Martial Arts training.

[Woozie]

One time in TKD, my uncle taught us some knife defense techniques. Then he gave us a test.

He called a bunch of people up and asked how they would handle the situation. He would come up to them with a rubber knife or a squirt gun and demand their wallet. Everyone tried a bunch of different stuff, and no matter how perfectly they executed the techniques, he told them they all failed.

The correct response was to give the weapon-wielding assailant your wallet instead of risking your life over a driver's license, a credit card, and a 20 dollar bill.

In the very unlikely event that you're cornered against a weaponless guy who is alone, martial arts is can be very useful. In pretty much any other situation you're likely to get yourself killed regardless of what you've learned.

[Dimmauk]

One time in TKD, my uncle taught us some knife defense techniques. Then he gave us a test.

He called a bunch of people up and asked how they would handle the situation. He would come up to them with a rubber knife or a squirt gun and demand their wallet. Everyone tried a bunch of different stuff, and no matter how perfectly they executed the techniques, he told them they all failed.

The correct response was to give the weapon-wielding assailant your wallet instead of risking your life over a driver's license, a credit card, and a 20 dollar bill.

In the very unlikely event that you're cornered against a weaponless guy who is alone, martial arts is can be very useful. In pretty much any other situation you're likely to get yourself killed regardless of what you've learned.

When I was a bouncer, we would do the same thing. We had a secret weapon person, that would bust it out on anyone at anytime. Of course we were always on guard about it. I was 10/12 on blocking it. Some were with Sunglasses on. They would wait for you to come in during the day, and enter the place with sunglasses on. LOL

[Blarg]

how does running away help the huge amount of people who are slow as shit and will just end up turning their back on their opponent

[Fhqwghads]

how does running away help the huge amount of people who are slow as shit and will just end up turning their back on their opponent

If they're slow as shit they better have a loud voice and start screaming "fire", because they aren't going to have a chance either way.

[Woozie]

Actually, martial arts training would put those people into better shape, thus making them better able to run away.

[Max™]

how does running away help the huge amount of people who are slow as shit and will just end up turning their back on their opponent

Man, if only there were some way that a person could do a regular series of actions which would improve the ability of their body to perform those actions. Like, exerting yourself to reduce the stress from doing those precise actions at a later time.

[Blarg]

well even if everyone trained to run there would still be people who are, comparatively, slow as shit. You will always have a large group of people slower than average, such is the way averages work.

[Dimmauk]

[Max™]

well even if everyone trained to run there would still be people who are, comparatively, slow as shit. You will always have a large group of people slower than average, such is the way averages work.

It would still save your ass more often than sticking around and fighting... unless you're mr. "wtf huge ass negro" lane I guess, but you'd probably be the one people are running from in that scenario.

[Blarg]

So if you can run well and if you can keep calm and not panic in a stressful situation you would be better off not running assuming the situation you are in allows you to easily run. Who cares about every other situation that doesn't fit an ideal fleeing scenario.

Knowing how to fight AND knowing how to run will always be better than just knowing how to run.

[Matthias]

Did I say it never happens to people? No, I sure didn't. I said it hardly happens to anyone. If this happened on a regular basis the majority of the public would be in combat martial arts training and packing a weapon of some sort. It's ridiculous to think that's what people are training for.

No, it's really not. Again that minority of occurences, however minimal, can be among the most traumatizing experiences of a person's life. There is nothing wrong with preparing for worst case scenarios and having that ready just in case.

To be of the mentality that "martial arts for self-defense" is the number one reason people do it is disingenuous. It can be helpful, but of the hundreds of people I've trained with, not one of them has ever said "I do this for self-defense." The trainers have never said "this method is great for self-defense." Out of everyone I've ever met in my 4+ decades of life on this planet, not one of them has ever said they were cornered and forced into fighting. So in my experience, it hasn't happened to anyone I know, and nobody I know has seriously trained martial arts specifically for self-defense. So with that in mind, I'm confident when I state that being assaulted is very rare. The only time I hear about this is when I watch the news.

So yeah you've pretty much confirmed my earlier point that you are making a blanket generalization as a whole based on what has happened in your own little world and in your own little world alone. Gotcha.

Have you ever even taken any martial arts, outside of a McDojo?

Oh yes. I've also been in those situations that you yourself admitted you've never been in: where running was not an option and I had to fight.

Plenty of places will advertise that their martial art is great for self-defense because it's a selling point. Anyone who's actually done it for a while will understand that it's not very useful for self-defense in this day and age. It can help, as I stated, but anyone who trains a martial art for the sole purpose of self-defense is doing nothing but taking a placebo.

And you would know this how, considering you yourself earlier admitted you've never actually been in a fight, and therefore have never had to use martial arts in a self-defense situation? And again, what data are you basing this "Anyone who's actually done it for a while will understand" comment? Please by all means demonstrate the painstaking research you've done to gather this data to validate it beyond you just making up facts and figures to support your own perspective on things based on what you have seen in just your own limited observations.

Common sense dictates that outside of a controlled environment, aka a gym or a ring where there are some sort of rules in place, all bets are off. Sure, it's up to the individual to draw their own line in the sand on whether they fight or get the fuck out. People who wind up with lacerations, stab wounds, gunshot wounds, and blunt force trauma are the ones who think they can handle themselves.

And those people with zero preparation could end up just dead. I'd rather have stab wounds, lacerations, gunshot wounds, and blunt force trauma than be dead.

If you don't think common sense dictates running the fuck away when confronted by someone ready to assault you, and instead you're going to "man up" and fight, then you 100% deserve whatever the hell happens to you, and you lack the type of common sense I'm talking about. Fighting on the street is the absolute last thing anyone with a brain in their head should ever do, and should only happen if there is no alternative whatsoever.

To me "common sense" dictates you do whatever is appropriate for the situation. Assessment of such situations is something any real martial arts schools will teach. Oh right but you wouldn't know that. Get some life experience dear.

Again, will knowing some martial arts help in the incredibly unlikely event you find yourself forced into a fight? Sure. It's like insurance: great to have when some idiot plows into you. The big difference is if you're assaulted it's not an accident, so you need martial arts for self-defense even LESS than you need insurance.

Accident or not, you are conceding the possibility is there. Nothing wrong with preparing for that possibility, considering the dire consequences should it happen.

To be specific, the only time I can see NOT running away is if:

1) There is no escape route.
2) Someone is with one or more people who would not be able to get away (children, wife, etc.)

Other than that, the best self-defense is a good pair of running shoes and two legs.

Not if the guy's got better shoes and two better legs.

And your assertion that it's for self-defense is based on what? Bruce Lee movies? The Karate Kid?

Ahh way to avoid the question. I do in fact have a response to this but I'll wait until you answer my question first, not letting you off this one kiddo.

1) And I disagree with any approach except getting the fuck out of dodge. Anything else is stupid and isn't worth bringing up because it almost never happens to anyone.

Ahh and once again there's the "almost never happens to anyone", based on the exhaustive research of "what I have seen in my life time to the people around me."

All it does is start people down an ignorant conversation on "my martial art can beat up your marital art." Or worse yet, setting someone up for a false sense of security and a harsh reality check when they get the shit kicked out of them because they thought that Tie Fong Buttkick would be able to fend off an attacker.

Well that really depends on where you go. For example my martial arts instructors have always made it clear not to try to be the hero, that getting mixed up in fights is absolute last resort, always. The point is if it seriously comes down to the last resort then having no option available kinda sucks. Martial arts gives you an option.

2) If you consider "running away" a martial art for street fighting then guilty as charged. I never said shit about which martial art is best for fighting in a street fight, other than don't fucking do it. Feel free to point out where I said a goddamn thing about a particular martial art being good for street fighting.

You didn't but you did make a commentary on the issue of which martial art being good for street fighting... your comment was that none are. So you still contributed to a topic of discussion which you had previousy dismissed as "the fucking dumbest, most ignorant, retarded direction this thread could take".

3) Pretty much. You think you're prepared enough for all the unknown variables when some nutjob decides he's going to assault you?

Nope but I'm prepared for some. And again, I'd rather be prepare for some than none.

Which martial art is going to help you when he pulls out a 9mm and shoots you in the face because you think you're a fucking bad-ass and are going to stand your ground?

Probably none. But for that matter if the guy had a gun and was hell-bent on shooting you running wouldn't accomplish a whole lot either.

Again, in the extremely unlikely scenario that a person finds themselves in a situation they cannot get away from, then martial arts might be able to assist them in making the best of a life threatening situation.

Well... um... that's... kinda the whole point man. As unlikely as it may be, it could happen, and if it does happen it could save your life, so nothing wrong with being prepared... That's sort of been my point all along kiddo.

But to say "martial arts are for self-defense" is a dumb thing to say, because it's not, except to people who eat up that kind of marketing.

Well again, still waiting for proof of your authority in determining what martial arts are or aren't for.

If you're too stupid to comprehend that running away from a street fight is > any martial art, then I'm not going to argue the point further.

Actually I never once said that running away is greater or lesser than any martial art. My point has always been what you just stated above: in the worst case scenario it could help, therefore it's a useful tool to have. That's... what I've been saying this whole time... Seriously, those sherdog forums have nothing on you.

It's an idiotic conversation and I've made all my points.

Incredibly bad ones based solely on superimposing your own experiences onto the rest of the world despite your own admittance to having zero firsthand experience in it, but yeah you have.

Knock yourself out if you feel the need to reply and defend your dumb position, champ.

Oh it's not a matter of need. I discuss these things with morons like you for the same reason I read the sherdog forums: sheer entertainment.

[Fhqwghads]

I'm done arguing with you, you're a fucking idiot. You want to be the man, stand in the wind with your cape blowing and lead the charge against crime go for it. Learn all you can from martial arts since it's so awesome for self-defense (according to you), go watch "Never Back Down" 50 times, then fend off all the evil villains who jump out of the shadows at you every day. Just don't forget your kevlar underwear there, princess.

(edit) I will respond to this:

considering you yourself earlier admitted you've never actually been in a fight

Let's get something straight since you're jumping to conclusions: I have been in plenty of fights. I've never been in a street fight. I actually enjoy fighting. I love punching people in the face and kicking them in the ribs. That's why I go to a combat martial arts gym. But you know what? I STILL won't fight in the streets, because I'm not a fucking retard who thinks that just because he can hold his own in a gym that he can take on the world. I've been in several situations where I had the choice to either fight someone, or get the fuck away. I got the fuck away. The bottom line is you prioritized self-defense with martial arts. That is not high on the list of properties associated with martial arts. It is there, but you're coming off like it's the main reason it should be taken, and white-knighting the fuck out of it on that merit alone, which is stupid.

[Dimmauk]

I think some people dont know that if you beat someone's ass, and they find out you have been trained, then they can charge you with assualt with a deadly weapon.

[Woozie]

I think some people dont know that if you beat someone's ass, they may assault you with a deadly weapon

Fixed.

[Blarg]

I think some people dont know that if you beat someone's ass, and they find out you have been trained, then they can charge you with assualt with a deadly weapon.

even if it's proven to be self defense?

[Chips]

I'm done arguing with you, you're a fucking idiot. You want to be the man, stand in the wind with your cape blowing and lead the charge against crime go for it. Learn all you can from martial arts since it's so awesome for self-defense (according to you), go watch "Never Back Down" 50 times, then fend off all the evil villains who jump out of the shadows at you every day. Just don't forget your kevlar underwear there, princess.

(edit) I will respond to this:



Let's get something straight since you're jumping to conclusions: I have been in plenty of fights. I've never been in a street fight. I actually enjoy fighting. I love punching people in the face and kicking them in the ribs. That's why I go to a combat martial arts gym. But you know what? I STILL won't fight in the streets, because I'm not a fucking retard who thinks that just because he can hold his own in a gym that he can take on the world. I've been in several situations where I had the choice to either fight someone, or get the fuck away. I got the fuck away. The bottom line is you prioritized self-defense with martial arts. That is not high on the list of properties associated with martial arts. It is there, but you're coming off like it's the main reason it should be taken, and white-knighting the fuck out of it on that merit alone, which is stupid.

I miss your posts, why do you no longer post in the MMA thread?

[Chips]

even if it's proven to be self defense?

I'm not sure how the laws work in the US, but way back in the day when I did Karate, my instructor told me about how one of his green belt students was jumped, got a knife pulled on him, kicked his attacker in the knee then broke it, and apparently was almost criminally charged (due to being a greenbelt). I guess the only reason he wasn't was because a witness saw the knife. Take the story for what it's worth, can't prove that it's true but I don't see why he would have lied.

[Blarg]

I think that is a rarity. Like how the (possibly fake story) about the robber who hurt himself breaking into a house sued the houses owner for leaving a sharp object out.

[chiyio]

I think some people dont know that if you beat someone's ass, and they find out you have been trained, then they can charge you with assualt with a deadly weapon.

pretty sure this is bullshit. Even if not, it would vary from state to state. A quick google doesn't find anything to support that either.

I've done a style of american kenpo (organization I'm part of is called AKKI) off and on for like 10 years and enjoyed it.

[Max™]

Well, it depends... if someone picks a fight with you, then you hammer fist his temple, land a kick into his floating ribs, and punch him in the throat as he drops to his knees... the level of force used, and the possibility that the guy winds up in the hospital might make it easier to treat it as a more severe assault.

People can be broken easily if you do the right things, fighting in an uncontrolled situation is never without risks, and fighting an untrained opponent can make it harder to judge the difference between "inflict enough pain to make him back off" and "oh fuck I just crushed his trachea".