what is end game?

[Mojo]

Cleaving Fear Dearg

[Arthars]

ebisu fishing rod and lushang fishing rod quest w/o bot is endgame

trust me, it is still by far the most challenging(and boring haha) stuff to do in ffxi atm

no way to rush it, cant proc red for 100% opal silk/saber shoot, cant proc grellow for more moat carp

pure determination is end game!!!

[Draylo]

Salvage, Einherjar, Dynamis, HNM, limbus, sky, sea. Oh wait this is 2011? Sorry, Abyssea.

[Clash Perez]

Complain about how shitty end-game is once the level cap has hit 99. Until then, the game is in a transitional phase. Don't like it? Cancel your account and come back when it has been 99 for six months to a year.

[D44kpunk]

TRANSITIONAL PHASES. that's ff14s excuse too is what it seems. fucking transitions, how do they work

[Michelob]

Complain about how shitty end-game is once the level cap has hit 99. Until then, the game is in a transitional phase. Don't like it? Cancel your account and come back when it has been 99 for six months to a year.

I second the transitional phrase remark. I'm not so sure that this has been the coming of the "new FFXI" that people have claimed just yet.

[Yeyoking]

Things you do to better your character when you have reached the level limit.

I know a lot of people are unhappy about lack of content but I actually like the direction it took as its more like Diablo 2 where kicking ass and taking names was the whole point. I don't know anyone who played D2 to the end and stopped playing once they beat Baal in hell. Why stop with FFXI now that everything has been killed?

End game in D2 was grinding/botting meph/pindle/baal/etc to deck your character out so you can own faces in legit PVP.

End game in FFXI is grinding Dynamis, Salvage, Einherjar, Limbus, Abyssea gears so you can afk in town or grind it for other people so they can afk in town.

[Burningthought]

End game in D2 was grinding/botting meph/pindle/baal/etc to deck your character out so you can own faces in legit PVP.

End game in FFXI is grinding Dynamis, Salvage, Einherjar, Limbus, Abyssea gears so you can afk in town or grind it for other people so they can afk in town.

And truer words were never spoken.

[Arthars]

every game is the same. FFXI are shitty like fuck to begin with(2002?) > getting better after zilart(2004 or so) > climax(toau) > stale mate(wotg) > ???(abyssea) > transition > we'll see lol

we arejust lucky we get to pick up the game from stalls when RoTZ is released when the game is alot more stable.... FF14 can be shitty like fuck now but it will get better(my ff14 box still un-opened XD)

if you ever quitted a game and move on to the next game, you will find urself going through the same phase....and eventually you'll quit that game as well

as you can see theres alot of people still playing FFXI, it may suck for many people out there but for now, its still alive and kicking!

[Byrthnoth]

My largest complaint with endgame is that the motivation for endgame has changed. In the past, you did endgame so that you could get the best gear and your linkshell could alliance up and kill the hardest monsters, do the hardest events the best, etc. Now, we lowman the best gear so that we can play with even fewer people. It's a much less social game than it used to be. The lowman shift has been present since Salvage, but it has really come into full effect with Abyssea.

Spoiler: show

Example: Level 90 people with level 75 gear and brains could doubtlessly kill all the monsters in the game, but it would take more of them and they'd be slower than level 90 people with current gear.

[Isiolia]

My largest complaint with endgame is that the motivation for endgame has changed. In the past, you did endgame so that you could get the best gear and your linkshell could alliance up and kill the hardest monsters, do the hardest events the best, etc. Now, we lowman the best gear so that we can play with even fewer people. It's a much less social game than it used to be. The lowman shift has been present since Salvage, but it has really come into full effect with Abyssea.

I thought in the past people did endgame so they could AFK in Whitegate with the gear on?

That said, the funny thing is that Abyssea's proc system actually encourages a more diverse, possibly slightly larger group - if simply dropping the mob were all it took, we'd seen even smaller groups.
The root problem is likely that progress is rarely made for more than one person at a time. Maybe if, say, Empyreans were upgraded with Dominion Trophies (or something similar) instead of drops, you'd see full alliances on 'em instead of lowman groups squabbling over them. But that's SE's version of planning for you.

[Dazusu]

what the hell is end game these days?

A distant memory.

[Gwynplaine]

Right now Abyssea and their Magian Trials pretty much encompass the entirety of endgame. It's probably temporary though, sort of like how Dynamis was one of few endgame content back in like '06. Everyone's waiting to see what the Crest BC's will be like and how the "new" 99 endgame turns out.

[mcb]

I thought in the past people did endgame so they could AFK in Whitegate with the gear on?

That said, the funny thing is that Abyssea's proc system actually encourages a more diverse, possibly slightly larger group - if simply dropping the mob were all it took, we'd seen even smaller groups.
The root problem is likely that progress is rarely made for more than one person at a time. Maybe if, say, Empyreans were upgraded with Dominion Trophies (or something similar) instead of drops, you'd see full alliances on 'em instead of lowman groups squabbling over them. But that's SE's version of planning for you.

upgrading one person at a time isn't new. the differance is that atleast with relics the ls was getting gear while they upgraded a relic. in visions zones you get nothing for the rest of people, and have to fight for claim in scars (hey look its endgame, ppl wasting time trying to claim a nm).

[ronin sparthos]

My largest complaint with endgame is that the motivation for endgame has changed. In the past, you did endgame so that you could get the best gear and your linkshell could alliance up and kill the hardest monsters, do the hardest events the best, etc. Now, we lowman the best gear so that we can play with even fewer people. It's a much less social game than it used to be. The lowman shift has been present since Salvage, but it has really come into full effect with Abyssea.

Spoiler: show

Example: Level 90 people with level 75 gear and brains could doubtlessly kill all the monsters in the game, but it would take more of them and they'd be slower than level 90 people with current gear.

Eh, I disagree. Your motivation for endgame was not the majority's feeling for the most part. In fact, most people were in large HNM shells in the 'day simply to masturbate that they were among the best, leech resources from the people in the know (be they leaders or otherwise) and ultimately act as cannon fodder. Even at HNM camps you'd know which LS' Ateam were in play at a Fafhogg or their Bteam.

The Bteams always made for the best entertainment.

Endgame still is what it was a few years ago - a grind towards the best gear with the intention of speeding up battles and showing off. The only difference between today and yesteryear is how quickly you get the best gear and significantly less faction warfare. Now for most of us, what we really miss is the sophomoric faction warfare.

"Guys did you hear? So and so wiped Vrtra"
"LOL"
"Fuck those faggots, we're the best."
"Fuck yeah"
"Faf window in 3hrs"
"Fuck yeah"

With the ability to get the best gear and all of the buffs that make Abyssea easier than most content, the ability to "be the best" needs less cannon fodder and simply just like minded individuals willing to show up and put in work. As I feared with SE, they leaned from way too difficult straight into way too easy.

But what do I know? In a 4hour run through Abyssea-Altepa yesterday I was treated to watching:

-2 Bennu wipes
-1 Emperador de Altepa wipe
-1 EXP party wipe
-1 Dragua wipe

To most of BG, endgame has become a joke due to years of stressful HNMs but to everyone else, the game is just right. Don't believe me? Try a PUG party or an EXP alliance in Abyssea and throw in some microwave popcorn.

[Isiolia]

upgrading one person at a time isn't new. the differance is that atleast with relics the ls was getting gear while they upgraded a relic. in visions zones you get nothing for the rest of people, and have to fight for claim in scars (hey look its endgame, ppl wasting time trying to claim a nm).

Technically, if you go for pop sets via NMs you'd be getting loot for others (at least initially) while you worked towards Empyrean items in Visions zones as well. Even gold crates technically could net augmented items.

Regardless, my point was more along the lines of lowman versus larger group. Essentially, if things are set up to be competitive, then players will gravitate towards lowman setups. The fewer you need to enlist help from and/or lot against the better.
By contrast, you have things like alliance XP or a good number of Magian trials that don't effectively punish larger groups - if you need to kill 250 Wyverns for your Varuna's Staff, or Megalobugard 4x for an Empyrean, teaming up is nothing but beneficial. There may not be a challenge that justifies a large group, but it's simply more efficient to knock points off a trial for (up to) 18 people at a time rather than one.

Things are set up towards this going into Abyssea, and even some things there are like that (XP, gaining of Atmas, etc). SE just didn't fully follow through.

[Taint]

One of the things I miss about endgame was the direct LS vs LS competition. You see X LS in town rocking highend gear and then later you watch them take down NH. Or you get the enjoyment of having X LS watch you kill NH. Nows it just all for the sake of AFK gear and you go about your business otherwise.

[Crizto]

I definitely miss making LS's leave the server 3 months later

[D44kpunk]

I definitely miss making LS's leave the server 3 months later

this, and flailing their fafnirs and having them spam arabic nonsense and curse at you in broken english

[ronin sparthos]

One of the things I miss about endgame was the direct LS vs LS competition. You see X LS in town rocking highend gear and then later you watch them take down NH. Or you get the enjoyment of having X LS watch you kill NH. Nows it just all for the sake of AFK gear and you go about your business otherwise.

This shows how bad XI needed real PVP.