Dev Tracker

[Spira]

Not so sure about that.. I've tried BST in VW1 before and what happened was that you really had to struggle to keep your pets alive most of the time. Maybe cos we didn't bother to dawn mulsum it, but also because stuff like AoE doom and hard hitting nukes are far too common. That was 90 tho.

I believe SMN have a lot more going in VW than BST. Its just a little messy tho

[Colenzo]

That was the point. They said that they are doing this change to "improve" SCH.

They were going to nerf the helixes for those subbing them in and improving them for the people that were actually main SCH.

[Septimus]

They were going to nerf the helixes for those subbing them in and improving them for the people that were actually main SCH.

Well, when you put it that way, it makes it fine that they made 8 out of the 10 unique SCH procs available via sub job, and that one of the remaining procs doesn't land most of the time. Scholar is now totally fixed and is a viable end-game job now.

[Kuishen]

BST still remains as the only job who is allowed to constantly bitch and moan at SE because they just cant do anything right with the job.

I think you mean SMN.

[Colenzo]

Well, when you put it that way, it makes it fine that they made 8 out of the 10 unique SCH procs available via sub job, and that one of the remaining procs doesn't land most of the time. Scholar is now totally fixed and is a viable end-game job now.

Lets talk about how PUP can sub MNK in VW too and do more than procs than MNK mains!

[Septimus]

Lets talk about how PUP can sub MNK in VW too and do more than procs than MNK mains!

Honestly, I hope that they do away with procs entirely in new content. It was a fun mechanism for a while, but now it is old and stale. But they still have to figure out a way to make SCH worth bringing to events.

[Colenzo]

Eh, I think it brings another element to the gameplay. I would like to see them add a new element to the stuff to the new content for sure...maybe more NMs running around being badasses like Dark Ixion haha.

[NynJa]

I dont entirely mind the procs...but atleast cut it down significantly.

[Kaisha]

Well, when you put it that way, it makes it fine that they made 8 out of the 10 unique SCH procs available via sub job, and that one of the remaining procs doesn't land most of the time. Scholar is now totally fixed and is a viable end-game job now.

8 helix, Modus Veritas......and #10 is?

[NynJa]

libra iirc?

[Septimus]

8 helix, Modus Veritas......and #10 is?

Isn't Libra also a proc? If it isn't, holy hell SCH is fucked.

And before anyone says "Embrava", I present this scenario.

Alliance leader: "OK SCH, you Perpetuance Embrava the alliance, we will lock into the Planar Rift while you change to WHM/SCH and run back here so that you can be useful and land all of the procs that you would be able to on your main job."

[Kaisha]

In all the months I've done VW, as well as charting every trigger I've seen personally, Libra has not come up once, or even given a weakness hint all the times I've used it when I come as it.

For some reason people (who still play, not just you) think it is a trigger when I've ruled it out long ago. But yeah, useless VW job is useless, and I'll be glad to see it go when helix are subbable.

[Yugl]

The better approach is to figure out how to replace them. Remember that the intent is to place every class as viable and that maintains whether or not you think they were successful. Pure damage eliminate a majority of classes since only a few will ever be top DD. You have to think of ways in which every class gets a role if you abolish the proc system.

[Kaisha]

The job system is too busted/unbalanced for that to ever be viable.

[Septimus]

In all the months I've done VW, as well as charting every trigger I've seen personally, Libra has not come up once, or even given a weakness hint all the times I've used it when I come as it.

For some reason people (who still play, not just you) think it is a trigger when I've ruled it out long ago. But yeah, useless VW job is useless, and I'll be glad to see it go when helix are subbable.

Some people think that it might be a proc and doesn't work correctly, which is why you can land Modus Veritas (instead of it missing like normal) and still not proc with Scholar Abilities. Basically, shit is fucked.

The better approach is to figure out how to replace them. Remember that the intent is to place every class as viable and that maintains whether or not you think they were successful. Pure damage eliminate a majority of classes since only a few will ever be top DD. You have to think of ways in which every class gets a role if you abolish the proc system.

As the old saying goes, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." As long as some classes are more useful than others, people would rather lose out on a few procs than take a team that may not be able to get the job done.

[ronin sparthos]

Not so sure about that.. I've tried BST in VW1 before and what happened was that you really had to struggle to keep your pets alive most of the time. Maybe cos we didn't bother to dawn mulsum it, but also because stuff like AoE doom and hard hitting nukes are far too common. That was 90 tho.

I believe SMN have a lot more going in VW than BST. Its just a little messy tho

Bolded: What's wrong with BST in the current endgame. The pets get smashed so fast that it's almost impossible to play the class within the event without either spamming Dawn Mulsum and wrecking inventory or being a gimp WAR without a pet.

Now I know the responses of Dynamis and Tiamat/Jorm/Vrtra come up and to that I raise a hearty who cares. Being able to solo some mobs designed for level 75s does not make a good job class and what BST is capable of in Dynamis is nothing special given the mobs are all EP.

The whole point of pushing the game to 99 was to give classes the opportunity to broaden their core competencies and to tweak others for function at endgame yet what we're seeing is an old fashioned dose of bullshit, excuses and promises that turn out to be garbage when the curtains are lifted.

I'll ask SE ad infinitum where are the pet buffs for BST because what you can do to mobs almost 30 levels under you is irrelevant.

[Kaisha]

What would you want? Jugs to be infinite use, a spirit-link ability to copy your buffs over, and a Deus Ex Automata JA to summon a low HP pet while you main summon timer is down, and lowered pet HP to accomodate the changes?

I can't see much being done to BST that'd make it PT-usable other than making it more of a PUP and DRG hybrid.

[ronin sparthos]

What would you want? Jugs to be infinite use, a spirit-link ability to copy your buffs over, and a Deus Ex Automata JA to summon a low HP pet while you main summon timer is down, and lowered pet HP to accomodate the changes?

I can't see much being done to BST that'd make it PT-usable other than making it more of a PUP and DRG hybrid.

As BST is supposed to just be a generic pet-oriented DD so some abilities that cripple the master in exchange for being able to have a more durable/offensive pet would be a start. Stuff like attack/haste/acc/crit-hit rate buffs in exchange for the masters relevant stats would have a BST choose between being pet-focused or foregoing the buffs for a pet/master combo. Abilities don't only need to be offensive either as some defensive tools would help against the pets being one-shotted repeatedly or enfeebled with no way to remove debuffs.

Pet Roboronts should honestly be usable like Dawn Mulsums rather than being attached to the Reward timer. It'd be much like the Maintenance JA they have cooking for PUP.

Beyond some actual pet related JA buffs, I never understood why exactly pets needed 100tp AND the charges to be up for Ready when the abilities are overall underpowered to begin with. SE claimed to have plans for quick-fire pets and effects for having certain pets out but beyond Geralds en-slow that hasn't appeared yet.

[Crab_Cake]

Beyond some actual pet related JA buffs, I never understood why exactly pets needed 100tp AND the charges to be up for Ready when the abilities are overall underpowered to begin with. SE claimed to have plans for quick-fire pets and effects for having certain pets out but beyond Geralds en-slow that hasn't appeared yet.

It can be used as a balancing mechanism... if SE didn't remove any skills for BST to use (Hippo for example).

IMO most abilities now could be 1 charge (or even 0 charge) and not be overpowered since the 100% TP requirement already serves its function well.

Some other stuff that may be overpowered they could put a limit on it (3 charges for example) but right now none of BST pet commands really qualify as overpowered if there was no charge requirement.

Now I know the responses of Dynamis and Tiamat/Jorm/Vrtra come up and to that I raise a hearty who cares. Being able to solo some mobs designed for level 75s does not make a good job class and what BST is capable of in Dynamis is nothing special given the mobs are all EP.

Admittedly though as a career BST in the past, I find the ability to solo/farm effectively a good trade off for being useless in group events.

If BST can solo twice as better than every other job, then that is still an advantage for BST (sort of the same deal with THF in the old days when THF were useless except to be there for drops or maybe for "farming").

While I wouldn't mind being able to use BST in events, the problem is that if BST were as useful as say WAR in events "but" BST also had the ability to solo/farm better than WAR in stuff that still matters (Dynamis, Tiamat, etc) then you could say BST is a bit overpowered or "bandwagon" material (everyone level up BST!).

Of course though this doesn't mean BST has to be entirely useless in group events. It just doesn't have to be as good or as wanted as the other core jobs like WAR, WHM, etc or at least more "situation" than those jobs.

There is the problem that everyone basically has every job leveled up meaning if WAR is better than BST (for example) then your group will want you on WAR most likely.

So overall - I have no idea >.>.

[Foxer]

Last week, I posted this pic:
http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/256/newmacro2.jpg

They had mentioned toying with this idea.

This was on their site today regarding the chat window:

[dev1059] Log Window Expansion

* The log window will now allow for customization of window width and maximum/minimum number of lines displayed.
These settings may be adjusted via the Main Menu under Config -> Windows.

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8...20111125en.jpg

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If you wish to discuss or submit feedback on this topic, please use the [dev1059] tag.

I guess it's official!

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...ndow-Expansion