White House wants new copyright laws.

[Shibo]

That last part is almost a viable argument when you consider a lot of places you pay that dollar for extremely restrictive rights to listen to the song in pretty specific scenarios.

But now that you can get tons of music for that price (or less) with absolutely no DRM whatsoever, so that you can put it on as many cd's/computers/ipods/etc as you like, even that is a completely ridiculous argument.

You can get like 1/4 as much gas now as you could when Nevermind came out for the same price, and people are bitching constantly that cd's have gone from 10-11 to 12-13 bucks in that same time span.


The shit about a direct line of loss was played out 10+ years ago, you're no less retarded for saying so-and-so would never have bought X if they couldn't get it for free than anyone on the other side is for saying they definitely would have.

The problem with the places online where you can "download" lots of cheap music usually based on a monthly fee isn't the same as downloading a song for $1 a piece. Unless they have changed, many of these sites don't let you actually keep the music when you stop paying for your subscription and it is more of a rental situation.

The gas argument is completely ridiculous as the price fluctuation of gas doesn't work under the same market conditions as other products do (such as music, movies, software, etc).

If you look at the price of other products in the time frame we are referencing to, the inflation rate of the cds / movies is about the same as other products. However, I do still feel the prices for downloading music online is far to much. There are a lot of different aspects that go into the production of physical music (and movies) that are no longer needed when considering the prices of online purchases. Yes there are new things to consider (i.e. servers and reliable connections), but I do not think those prices comes close to manufacturing costs.

[Plow]

The problem with the places online where you can "download" lots of cheap music usually based on a monthly fee isn't the same as downloading a song for $1 a piece. Unless they have changed, many of these sites don't let you actually keep the music when you stop paying for your subscription and it is more of a rental situation.

I'm talking about shit like amazon.

Although, rhapsody is pretty badass as well.

The gas argument is completely ridiculous as the price fluctuation of gas doesn't work under the same market conditions as other products do (such as music, movies, software, etc).

If you look at the price of other products in the time frame we are referencing to, the inflation rate of the cds / movies is about the same as other products. However, I do still feel the prices for downloading music online is far to much. There are a lot of different aspects that go into the production of physical music (and movies) that are no longer needed when considering the prices of online purchases. Yes there are new things to consider (i.e. servers and reliable connections), but I do not think those prices comes close to manufacturing costs.

gas is an exaggerated example, but the point I was making is that cd's are basically the same price as they've always been, and in comparison to a lot of things much cheaper


lol @ guy not getting south park joke

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Who cares about movies and music. It's all about streaming the sports games in the black out zones. =/

No kidding. Now that channelsurfing and diziport are down, what do people use to stream TV?

[Zeb]

but the point I was making is that cd's are basically the same price as they've always been, and in comparison to a lot of things much cheaper

You mean twice as much as cassettes, even though CDs cost significantly less than cassettes to manufacture?

The big record companies settled with the FTC in 2000 for price fixing CDs. Estimated cost to consumers was of $480 million. I'm all for piracy when it balances out overinflated prices set by greedy corporations. Shit if I could steal gas from OPEC...

[Shibo]

Old but good:

http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleim...bay_header.jpg

[Acevalefor]

This is not about arresting Pablo for streaming his weekly dose of House and Chuck. This is about finding another avenue to "Chop off the head" of Anonymous....Because it stands to reason (in the mind of a 55 year-old republican corporate exec from HBGary) that the top members of Anonymous must also be avid pirates. Too bad the corporate/government idiots can't wrap their head around the fact that there is no head to this snake and changing piracy laws is only going to lead to private companies being able to harass average citizens a little more freely. Gogo corporate capitalists!

/sarcastic rant

[Valisk]

You mean twice as much as cassettes, even though CDs cost significantly less than cassettes to manufacture?

CDs cost twice as much as cassettes because cassettes are all but obsolete. GTFO.

I'm all for piracy when it balances out overinflated prices set by greedy corporations.

Welcome to capitalism. A rising tide raises all ships. If people only had to pay what it cost to manufacture then everything sinks. With CDs in particular, you're paying for the songs, not the cost of making the CD and placing songs on them.

If anything, the industry has already compromised by allowing people to buy tracks individually or soliciting the rights to legal download sites like Rhapsody and Netflix to "adapt to the times" as I've seen thrown around in this thread by quite a few people.

The price of CD's has been greatly reduced over time. Most of them offer time incentives which allows them to be purchased for $9.99 the first week they go on sale then $12.99-$14.99 after that.

In all honesty, these new copyright laws probably aren't going to be enforced. But the amount of whining because free stuff could potentially (and I use this word loosely) come to an end is ridiculous. It's like the person at your favorite fast food restaurant who has been giving you all the free food you want for the past 3 years has finally decided to make you pay for your meals and you go ballistic on him. IF the free ride is over, stop complaining. It was free (when it wasn't suppose to be) and fun while it lasted.

[Zeb]

CDs cost twice as much as cassettes because cassettes are all but obsolete. GTFO.

You do realize when CDs were first introduced cassettes were not obsolete, right? And prices haven't really changed since then either.

[Valisk]

You do realize when CDs were first introduced cassettes were not obsolete, right? And prices haven't really changed since then either.

Your argument was present tense so I used present numbers. Prices have changed a ton since CDs were introduced.

Price of CDs has greatly decreased from 1984. (Chart on 2nd page)

http://76.74.24.142/F3A24BF9-9711-7F...00C49D8418.pdf

Taken from RIAA so judge as you will. Still from the average cost of $21.50 to probably $11.50 in 2010 is considered a price change seeing how that's almost a 47% reduction.

[Ragnus]

I have to agree that the whole thing reeks of lobbying.

Speaking of the South Park jokes they hit the nail on the head with this quote from Christian Rock Hard

[A mansion, somewhere, day. The agent has taken the boys for
a ride and arrived here. He leads them to the main gate]

DETECTIVE
This is the home of Lars Ulrich, the
drummer for Metallica. Look. There's
Lars now, sitting by his pool.

KYLE
What's the matter with him?

DETECTIVE
This month he was hoping to have a gold-plated
shark tank bar installed right next
to the pool, but thanks to people downloading
his music for free, he must now wait
a few months before he can afford it.
Come. There's more. Here's Britney
Spears' private jet. Notice anything?
Britney used to have a Gulfstream IV.
Now she's had to sell it and get a Gulfstream
III because people like you chose to
download her music for free. The Gulfstream
III doesn't even have a remote control
for its surround-sound DVD system. Still
think downloading music for free is
no big deal?

KYLE
We... didn't realize what we were doing,
eh...

DETECTIVE
That is the folly of man. Now look in
this window. Here you see the loving
family of Master P. Next week is his
son's birthday and, all he's ever wanted
was an island in French Polynesia.


KYLE
So, he's gonna get it, right?

DETECTIVE
I see an island without an owner. If
things keep going the way they are,
the child will not get his tropical
paradise.

STAN
We're sorry! We'll, we'll never download
music for free again!

DETECTIVE
Man must learn to think of these horrible
outcomes before he acts selfishly or
else... I fear... recording artists
will be forever doomed to a life of
only semi-luxury.

[Plow]

CDs cost twice as much as cassettes because cassettes are all but obsolete. GTFO.



Welcome to capitalism. A rising tide raises all ships. If people only had to pay what it cost to manufacture then everything sinks. With CDs in particular, you're paying for the songs, not the cost of making the CD and placing songs on them.

If anything, the industry has already compromised by allowing people to buy tracks individually or soliciting the rights to legal download sites like Rhapsody and Netflix to "adapt to the times" as I've seen thrown around in this thread by quite a few people.

The price of CD's has been greatly reduced over time. Most of them offer time incentives which allows them to be purchased for $9.99 the first week they go on sale then $12.99-$14.99 after that.

In all honesty, these new copyright laws probably aren't going to be enforced. But the amount of whining because free stuff could potentially (and I use this word loosely) come to an end is ridiculous. It's like the person at your favorite fast food restaurant who has been giving you all the free food you want for the past 3 years has finally decided to make you pay for your meals and you go ballistic on him. IF the free ride is over, stop complaining. It was free (when it wasn't suppose to be) and fun while it lasted.

that pretty much covers it

now, afk torrenting the new york times

oh hey I can get it for free, maybe the recording industry should follow their model!

nvmnd, adblock lol

[notorious bum]

Prices have changed drastically, according to the RIAA?

I can walk into any major retailer right now and still pay $15 for Barry White's Greatest Hits or Blink 182's Take Your Pants off and Jacket.

Adjust that shit for inflation and whatnot lol

[Yugl]

If they can't control it, they might just tax it or grant subsidies/tax breaks to industries affected by pirating.

[Plow]

Prices have changed drastically, according to the RIAA?

I can walk into any major retailer right now and still pay $15 for Barry White's Greatest Hits or Blink 182's Take Your Pants off and Jacket.

Adjust that shit for inflation and whatnot lol

or you can go to amazon.com, get completely DRM free mp3's for 7.97, the CD brand new for 3.48 + 2.98 shipping, or used for 52 cents + 2.98 shipping for the barry white

5.65 + 2.98 shipping for blink 182 new

or $15 for the blink 182 on cassette, lol

sorry, you being retarded enough to go buy the latest britney spears at sam goody is not a valid argument against ip laws

[Syntex]

There is a lot of positive change that has come from piracy forcing the industry to adapt. I think insofar as the industry is getting it right and no longer gouging the shit out of consumers we should be willing to part with a resonable and fair amount of money in recognition of that.

For example, NetFlix. I certainly wouldn't pay 50k for movies, series, etc. but I think $8/month for unlimited streaming pretty fair.

I'm not saying these corporations and artists are going bankrupt right now. But they survive and do as well as they do because SOMEONE is still paying for the product. If the justification for piracy goes from "The corporations price gouge the shit out of consumers" to "I don't want to pay for something if I don't want to" then what will happen when no one is left to pay for the product? As the internet savvy become more and more of the market, that is a possibility that could destroy the entertainment industry.

Stealing from the rich is supposed to be justified to remedy inequity and such, not because it's ok to steal from someone as long as they are richer than you.

Look how long it took the music industry to offer an alternative to napster.

I don't want to spend 15 bucks on a shitty CD that has ONE SONG on it that I like, hell, the only CD I bought in recent memory that had a bunch of good songs was Linkin Park Hybrid Theory. There are a lot of people, including myself that for the longest time wouldn't mind paying a dollar or 2 for a song but with how long it took for them to realize "HAY PEOPLE WILL PAY FOR STUFF WE NEED TO MAKE IT AVAILABLE" they deserved to lose out. I remember joining napster after they have been sued and reformed to something like 15 bucks a month and looking for songs which after 3 months they still didn't have to download from popular bands nonetheless.

Like someone else said this is just like the pirating of music, you can't stop it, you will never stop it, and the people in control of the government need to die so our generation can move in and take control so we stop wasting our time on shit that we KNOW we can't win like the war on pot and this shit.

[Ksandra]

Even in today's world of PVRs, timeshifting, fast-forwarding commercials, streaming, etc, we still have tons of movies, tv shows, music etc being produced. Hell they found it reasonable to pay Sheen what, like 1 million per 22-minute episode of that show? Obviously they're not hurting that bad. One can make the argument that without rampant copyright infringement they'd earn more (I think that's a pretty contentious argument though) but obviously even with rampant copyright they seem to be doing OK.

terrible argument is terrible. This is like saying "wal-mart is making tons of money so all retail stores must be doing well."

There are tons of shows that got canceled, but had a lot of followers through downloads. (hi2u Joss Whedon shows).

Everyone who is excited over the Game of Thrones show should be purchasing hbo instead of downloading. Because you gotta learn to support the shit you like, and you think hbo gonna give a shit about doing more seasons if people aren't subscribing? nope.

Really wanted to mention this, because I hope to god people subscribe to hbo for it. I'd like to see them keep going.

[Pirian]

Like someone else said this is just like the pirating of music, you can't stop it, you will never stop it, and the people in control of the government need to die so our generation can move in and take control so we stop wasting our time on shit that we KNOW we can't win like the war on pot and this shit.

This is what the hippy generation said, and now their generation is in office. Just saying, lol

[Fhqwghads]

Why? This is the age of information and these people are stuck in the last century. They're not going to be able to enforce this at all and we all know we're going to continue to download our shit and stream what we can for the rest of our lives. They are going to need to either adapt to the new situation or die, and its looking like the latter.

Just because they dont embrace the new technology and rather, choose to demonize it, doesnt mean its going to change public opinion. I'm sure most of us have somewhere around $50,000 of shit that is likely downloaded on our machines. The threat of lawsuit, or even felony, wont stop me from basically borrowing some bytes from a "friend"

Just my two cents. They can enact all the laws they want, but this is the way shit is, and will remain to be, and there is nothing they can do to stop it.

Quoted because this is pretty much my reaction and would have been my response. Seems like these jerkoffs are so far behind the ball with technology, and have no fucking clue how to monetize it by contributing to its growth, that they'll just go the tried and true method of regulation and outlawing what they can't control. Not to derail too much, but this country is going to fucking shit. Big business is becoming more visible in the day to day business of the government, and even someone who is blind as fuck has to admit that most of the government is owned by big business. I mean seriously, streaming a FELONY? These assholes are really going to toss someone in a federal penitentiary next to some of the most vile scum of the earth who would just as soon split open a person's abdomen, rip their intestines out, and skip rope with them just because the person downloaded season one of Scrubs? At what point is the public going to say enough with your bullshit corrupt government officials and take matters in their own hands?

I apologize for taking it to the extreme (lol revolution) but I'm sick of our rights and privacy being trampled over, and reading article after article of how the government is virtually doing whatever the fuck it wants and completely unopposed as it does so.

[Zeb]

Your argument was present tense so I used present numbers. Prices have changed a ton since CDs were introduced.

Price of CDs has greatly decreased from 1984.

http://76.74.24.142/F3A24BF9-9711-7F...00C49D8418.pdf

Taken from RIAA so judge as you will. Still from the average cost of $21.50 to probably $11.50 in 2010 is considered a price change seeing how that's almost 50% reduction.

All, right yeah. they've changed, but not as signifcantly as you argue. When CDs first became mainstream albums were around the $16 range, after the FTC got a hold of record companies, prices have lowered to what they are now.

eh, we're a bit off topic now... to get back on topic. For the record, the only streaming entertainment type I pirate is football, due to blackout zones. There's just way too many fingers in that pie for anyone to convince me that streaming it is wrong.

[Ketna]

I want to see Game of Thrones too, but I refuse to pay what Comcast wants to charge me for HBO. Give me an option to buy each episode separately and I would do it, but I dont want to support HOURS of other shows that I dont care about for 1 hour that I do. If the show is good then I'll buy the box set, like I have for Weeds and Californication.