Consequences were the same

[Dimmauk]

Is it really that hard to hit the reply with quote button Drex? nice misquote you got there. My point was that just because it worked, it doesnt mean its ok. I know as a parent, the last thing I want is for my child to hate/loathe me. You dont have to hit someone to show them that they did something wrong.

[Alvinho]

Is it really that hard to hit the reply with quote button Drex? nice misquote you got there. My point was that just because it worked, it doesnt mean its ok. I know as a parent, the last thing I want is for my child to hate/loathe me. You dont have to hit someone to show them that they did something wrong.

I've read every post so far, but I generally tend to stay away from arguments like this because it never leads anywhere, but this was just too ridiculous to let slide.

How did slavery work? White people got rich and slaves got fucked over.

Seems like it didn't work for the slaves.

If a kid gets disciplined in the form of a spanking, and he turns out better, then spanking, as a form of discipline, works. Of course it's not 100% guaranteed to work, but when you have humans dealing with other humans, nothing is.

[Yugl]

my point was we did the research part already. responding to every person saying "that's not research that's anecdotal!" is lame and doesn't allow to take things a step farther especially considering there's research that supports both sides. spewing out links on the internet proves nothing.

You're right, spewing links does nothing. However, that doesn't need we need to fall to the level of anecdotes like most proponents of Christians will do. We can debate about the methodology of the studies and scrutinize how they might have "messed up." You seem uninterested in doing so and rather debate through anecdotes, which means we'll all just be speaking past each other while agreeing with people whom laden their post with rhetoric. It's just like debating with O'Reilly because you protect the "integrity" of anecdotes using the utmost force.

so explain to us what makes you prioritize one research over the other as there is research on both sides. I know you'd never admit it, but I can pretty much guarantee that your decision that the "don't spank" research is "more valid" is because of your own anecdotes on real life views. you just hide it in that extra layer so that makes it ok amirite?

The majority of research I've seen validates that stance. If you're willing to meet that and explain why the scientific method was compromised in studies that opposed physical punishment, then that would not be talking past me. However, pulling an O' Reilly and continuously denying the work is simply speaking past me. Also, if my stance is based on anecdotal experience and then criticize my character (Your ad Hominem later on), aren't you admitting that it didn't work?

also, this is a rather ignorant of the internet response. there are studies for everything on both sides of a lot of issues. This one included. Of course a study gets less validity when you've got studies that prove both arguments. this goes for both pro and anti spanking. it suggests as most people have been saying this isn't a black and white situation and more likely that it's an issue of whatever your more comfortable/effective with doing when it comes to child rearing will be more effective.

Ksandra, why do you continue to associate statements with things I've never said? Do you read? I asked him to clarify what he is trying to assert. Unlike you, I try not to assume people's arguments for them. Furthermore, if you read (Big lesson of the day) what he said, he didn't specify research on this topic. He said scientific research. Perhaps he meant to say scientific research on physical punishment, but the literal phrasing actually makes a statement about science as an enterprise.

trufax, but then, what else am I supposed to do until I go tutor mah student? :3

Become a good teacher.

[kuronosan]

I think there's a nice big fat line between "disciplining your child physically" and "beating the shit out of your child".

Seriously now... I was spanked a ton when I was a kid and I turned out fine. My fiancee was spanked and she turned out fine. The majority of my friends were spanked and sent to the corner and slapped on the back of the head and they turned out fine.

Kids these days are getting out of control and parents aren't hitting them or disciplining them as much, they're just giving them whatever. Does nobody see this correlation?

Sometimes, sending your kid to the corner will work. Other times, you have to smack some sense into them. What will you do when you say "Go to the corner" and they say "NO!" ? Tell them "Oh well okay then I'll take away the XBox and you can stay inside"?

[Ksandra]

Does nobody see this correlation?

apparently no because that's anecdotal! (via yugl)

actually seeing and experiencing stuff isn't worth anything anymore.

[Dimmauk]

The problem is parents are too busy with work, and whatever else they do, and not raising their kids. Then there are kids raising kids too. I have never hit my kid, and she is prefectly fine. I cant say the same for other kids in her class that hit other kids and think its ok because their parents hit them. Why is it so hard for people to evolve from physically abusing your kids to punishing them, talking to them, and teaching them what they did was wrong and why. I guess its easier to hit your kid, tell them to shut up, and get back to pwning noobs in a video game.

[Ksandra]

I guess its easier to hit your kid, tell them to shut up, and get back to pwning noobs in a video game.

that would be a fine retort if that's what our parents were doing. And no, my parents weren't just smacking us around while watching Taxi or something either.

[Raytheon]

The problem is parents are too busy with work, and whatever else they do, and not raising their kids. Then there are kids raising kids too. I have never hit my kid, and she is prefectly fine. I cant say the same for other kids in her class that hit other kids and think its ok because their parents may have hit them. Why is it so hard for people to evolve from physically abusing your kids to punishing them, talking to them, and teaching them what they did was wrong and why. I guess its easier to hit your kid, tell them to shut up, and get back to pwning noobs in a video game.

ftfy

You have no evidence that just because a kid hits another kid, that the parents hit that kid. It's an assumption, which may or may not be true. I would agree it may be more likely that a violent kid may live in a violent household, but the possibility easily exists that the kid is never hit at all.

Strange choice of words on the second part. I wouldn't agree that not physically disciplining your child means you're 'evolved'. Time-out may work for you kid, but not for another kid. Like it's been stated, different strokes for different folks, pretty much.

[Seanr]

On the subject of kids hitting other kids, it seems that people can't grasp the concept that some people(kids) can just be dicks just for dicksake.

They're also smarter than people give them credit for, and learn how to "game" the system(adults) very quickly.

We taught the kids it was wrong to hit others, and to apologize when they did so. Of course they got time out.... But then they got the idea that it was ok to hit as long as you said "sorry", some of them would be saying sorry before (or during) hitting someone.

One little bastard was actually saying sorry while choking someone out, he was a violent little shit, and I know for a fact his mother never laid hands on him (father wasn't there, different kid than earlier as well)

These were elementary school aged kids btw.

[Raytheon]

Damn, lol kids choking kids saying sorry, that's uhh... weirdly awesome lol? In a fucked up kinda way of course...

[archibaldcrane]

I know as a parent, the last thing I want is for my child to hate/loathe me.

lol



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S 4G using Tapatalk

[ronin sparthos]

Damn, lol kids choking kids saying sorry, that's uhh... weirdly awesome lol? In a fucked up kinda way of course...

Serial killer in the making.

All cause his parents didn't spank him.

[NynJa]

The problem is parents are too busy with work, and whatever else they do, and not raising their kids.

I've already rebutted to this ridiculous statement:
If you cant commit to raising a kid then maybe you should have worn a fucking condom...or put it somewhere else.

[Dimmauk]

I've already rebutted to this ridiculous statement:
If you cant commit to raising a kid then maybe you should have worn a fucking condom...or put it somewhere else.

I agree, but that doesnt always happen eh?

[Dimmauk]

that would be a fine retort if that's what our parents were doing. And no, my parents weren't just smacking us around while watching Taxi or something either.

My parents were smacking us around and telling to go to our room so they could do more blow. Tell you what, have kids, smack them in the ass, because you lack the patience to teach them why what they did was wrong, and let me know how you feel. My wife was never spanked, and she turned out just fine. I was surrounded by abuse, and I turned out decent too. I think its more about me being me, and not about my parents smacking us.

[NynJa]

I agree, but that doesnt always happen eh?

Then either put the kid for adoption so some parents, who cant procreate, but will be able to devote time to raising their child(ren) can do so...or just go for an abortion.

[Ksandra]

My parents were smacking us around and telling to go to our room so they could do more blow. Tell you what, have kids, smack them in the ass, because you lack the patience to teach them why what they did was wrong, and let me know how you feel. My wife was never spanked, and she turned out just fine. I was surrounded by abuse, and I turned out decent too. I think its more about me being me, and not about my parents smacking us.

it's like you didn't read any of the thread. Any.

[NynJa]

My wife was never spanked

off topic, but...missionary position only?

[Dimmauk]

it's like you didn't read any of the thread. Any.

Reading is for suckers.

off topic, but...missionary position only?

LOL, is it spousal abuse if she asks for it?

[Esvedium]

LOL, is it spousal abuse if she asks for it?

You can't rape the willing....