Comments from the Devs

[Hyan]

Few things need to happen before ranged AA can be viable, none of which have thus far. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

[Corrderio]

Update on Ifrit loot and all primals:

Producer/Director Yoshida here,

Regarding Ifrit (Hyper) rare drop; we will add a new method to obtain requested weapon by amount Ifrit has been defeated in 1.20 (taking down Ifrit)

We of course looked into having the rare drop weapon going into loot pool (to those that has the key item) but when players are talking after which weapon should go to who, although I don't want to think about it, there may be a possibility someone taking it silently. (We will implement /random in 1.20 too)

In 2.0 for item distribution we are implementing a NEED/GREED/PASS system but with current system that is not possible; sorry for the trouble.

Just like OP's idea we will keep the drop rate and still keep the individual treasure chest but aside from weapon dropping as a chest reward there will be chance where you may be able to obtain an item which you can trade to get the reward; This item will go into loot box so it's possible to give/receive.
(Hoping people use the /random and compromise)
By collecting amount of this trading item you will be able to trade for the weapon you wanted through NPC

This will be applied to all future Primal Battles.
(If the system is going to be modified other primal battles will also be modified)
And depending on release timing the drop rate and amount of item required will vary so please be careful.

/facepalm...

[TacoTaru]

As someone who hasn't played any other MMOs, can someone explain the need/greed/pass to me? I think I've got it, but I'm not sure if I'm right.

[Corrderio]

I think it's supposed to work like XI's loot system, but the only difference is people who select Need will have priority over those that select Greed.

[Siatdiat]

Update on Ifrit loot and all primals:


/facepalm...

What specifically are you face palming? I hope waiting until 2.0 for a loot system that isn't shit. Can never tell on this forum though.

[solracht]

They're just rolls with different priority. Greed rolls compete against Greed rolls, Need rolls compete against Need rolls and take priority over Greed rolls.

I don't know how it is in other games, but in Warcraft you can only roll Need if the item can be equipped by your class.

[Vuitton]

As someone who hasn't played any other MMOs, can someone explain the need/greed/pass to me? I think I've got it, but I'm not sure if I'm right.

If it's like WoW's need/greed/pass system, then all of the items dropped will show up in a window on everyone's screen and everyone chooses need/greed/pass. Then a random number generator chooses numbers for everyone 1-100 and whoever has the highest number wins. If there are both need and greed rolls, then only people who roll need will get a shot at the item.

It works well for WoW because most items are untradeable and your class is only one class. Unlike this game where we can be every class, meaning everyone can justify rolling "need". So, players will still have to create some sort of rule where you can only roll need for loot that you can use on your active class. Then all sorts of drama will happen when people roll need anyway because they only came on their WHM because nobody wanted to heal and the real class they love to play is DRG and they win the roll over the DRG in the group.

[solracht]

It works well for WoW because most items are untradeable and your class is only one class. Unlike this game where we can be every class, meaning everyone can justify rolling "need". So, players will still have to create some sort of rule where you can only roll need for loot that you can use on your active class. Then all sorts of drama will happen when people roll need anyway because they only came on their WHM because nobody wanted to heal and the real class they love to play is DRG and they win the roll over the DRG in the group.

It works well in WoW because there are restrictions in place (such as the ones you mentioned), which they could easily add here.

Of course we'll still have problems, such as people not wanting to come to events on classes that can't roll on what they want, or people switching classes for the roll.

The first problem is not really that bad, although it defeats the point of leveling useful or wanted classes to get items for your loved class. The second problem would easily be controlled if the roll restrictions are calculated when the boss dies. I don't know what they'll do about random chests (like the ones in Darkhold) though.

I don't disagree though, it's going to be messy in this game in one way or another.

[Corrderio]

What specifically are you face palming? I hope waiting until 2.0 for a loot system that isn't shit. Can never tell on this forum though.

Mixture of that and not being able to pass weapons if you already got them.

[shidobu]

My idea don't shoot me if u think its stupid
Since its possible to break Ifrits horns.
At the end of a fight if your group can kill it with in the 6-8 minute (what ever that stupid speed kill timer achievement is). You can get 1 rare/exe "Ifrits Horn" per kill (that can be passed to somebody thats having a horrible fucking drop rate) that you can give to the NPC that gives ifrits quest and he gives you 1 of the 7 weapons. While still having the chance of 1 weapon per chest. or that dark matter we love so much. Then when groups like mine that speed kill ifrit with little reward can actually have something to show for it after 50+ kills. while im grinding 5-6 kills a night for 3 weeks for a fucking axe.

So requirements = kill ifrit with in speed kill achievement time + break one of the horns = 1 Rare/exe item to trade for 1 Weapon @ the Quest NPC

[Corrderio]

My idea don't shoot me if u think its stupid
Since its possible to break Ifrits horns.
At the end of a fight if your group can kill it with in the 6-8 minute (what ever that stupid speed kill timer achievement is). You can get 1 rare/exe "Ifrits Horn" per kill (that can be passed to somebody thats having a horrible fucking drop rate) that you can give to the NPC that gives ifrits quest and he gives you 1 of the 7 weapons. While still having the chance of 1 weapon per chest. or that dark matter we love so much. Then when groups like mine that speed kill ifrit with little reward can actually have something to show for it after 50+ kills. while im grinding 5-6 kills a night for 3 weeks for a fucking axe.

So requirements = kill ifrit with in speed kill achievement time + break one of the horns = 1 Rare/exe item to trade for 1 Weapon @ the Quest NPC

I was thinking about something like this to. However class stacking is a problem I can see this causing. (Not that it's not happening now, just assuming if Yoshida can make good on his word about all classes/jobs being wanted after the revisions are done the idea could pose a problem).

[Niiro]

My idea don't shoot me if u think its stupid
Since its possible to break Ifrits horns.
At the end of a fight if your group can kill it with in the 6-8 minute (what ever that stupid speed kill timer achievement is). You can get 1 rare/exe "Ifrits Horn" per kill (that can be passed to somebody thats having a horrible fucking drop rate) that you can give to the NPC that gives ifrits quest and he gives you 1 of the 7 weapons. While still having the chance of 1 weapon per chest. or that dark matter we love so much. Then when groups like mine that speed kill ifrit with little reward can actually have something to show for it after 50+ kills. while im grinding 5-6 kills a night for 3 weeks for a fucking axe.

So requirements = kill ifrit with in speed kill achievement time + break one of the horns = 1 Rare/exe item to trade for 1 Weapon @ the Quest NPC

I'd take this and adapt it to a token model.

Killing Ifrit gives unique currency [cinders, scales, kidney stones, w/e], amount determined by kill speed and # of participants, skilled players motivated to try lowmanning for more currency/person, less skilled players motivated to bring more for faster & safer kills.

Only items dropped from fight are "Ifrit's horn"s into shared loot pool (rare, not ex), low base drop rate, breaking horns increases rate, breaking both he always drops 1, max 2 (uncommon).

NPC that gives quest lets you exchange X amount of [currency] + horn to make a weapon of your choice. Currency can also be used for other misc items (think company seals).

Pros:
-Horns can be bought/sold so people with really horrid luck still have alternative means of getting one
-Can only hold 1 horn at a time to help deter hoarding/whoring
-If no one needs a horn the group can forgo breaking them and just kill asap for more currency
-Can't get a weapon without the required currency, so people still need to actually participate in the fight
-Currency gives people who may not need any more weapons reason to continue helping others

Edit: Also lore-wise it makes little sense for Ifrit to have fully fashioned weapons dropping out of his dead ass, the NPC makes the weapons as compensation for your help.

[Egon]

It blows my mind that FFXIV was released with no plan or no possible way to roll on items. What were they thinking?!?

[Fievel]

thinking

lol

[solracht]

It blows my mind that FFXIV was released

I'm sure a lot of people would tell you that you could've stopped the sentence right there. : P

[Lucavi]

It blows my mind that FFXIV was released with no plan or no possible way to roll on items. What were they thinking?!?

That Japan, much like High Elf culture, is superior to all and the dirt-dwellers should feel honored to even have a chance to play the game?

[Grey Jorildyn]

token system yes plz

[Crab_Cake]

If it's like WoW's need/greed/pass system, then all of the items dropped will show up in a window on everyone's screen and everyone chooses need/greed/pass. Then a random number generator chooses numbers for everyone 1-100 and whoever has the highest number wins. If there are both need and greed rolls, then only people who roll need will get a shot at the item.

It works well for WoW because most items are untradeable and your class is only one class. Unlike this game where we can be every class, meaning everyone can justify rolling "need". So, players will still have to create some sort of rule where you can only roll need for loot that you can use on your active class. Then all sorts of drama will happen when people roll need anyway because they only came on their WHM because nobody wanted to heal and the real class they love to play is DRG and they win the roll over the DRG in the group.

Easiest way is to implement a method that detects where you have said class or job leveled up.

Say if you have DRG to 75 and the item can only be equipped on DRG but you're currently playing as WHM - The game checks all your classes and notices you have DRG at 75 so you can roll Need.

Currently though it looks like players will need to do this manually though (he said players have to /random >.>?). Hopefully they'll sort it out in the future.

[Achitophel]

Easiest way is to implement a method that detects where you have said class or job leveled up.

Say if you have DRG to 75 and the item can only be equipped on DRG but you're currently playing as WHM - The game checks all your classes and notices you have DRG at 75 so you can roll Need.

DING DING DING!

[miokomioko]

Is this not common sense?