Comments from the Devs

[Dooom]

@Doom: True enough, perhaps, but do you feel that an epic storyline can keep a game afloat if the combat/crafting/pvp/end-game systems are completely busted?

Absolutely not, and I'd never try to argue such (nor have I).

Hell, can you say the same for XIV even in its plot area alone?

Compared to "vanilla" (pre-RoZ) XI, 14's plot that I have seen thus far is so superior. The trouble is, it takes a bloody long time to get from part A to part B. Part of why I've kept playing is 'cos I want to know what happens next, especially with the class-specific questlines.

[Gadritan]

- Should have just went the quest route for leveling using epic story telling that is known in Final Fantasy.

Well, they're kind of doing that now with jobs. We know for sure now that we don't have to grind up advanced jobs. So that means "quests," to unlock them and to acquire abilities. Now..."epic story telling," I'm not so sure about. Unfortunately, I have a feeling the bulk of these quests is going to be "travel around the world 5 times for some 30second CSs then have a weak instanced fight."

[Biggie]

Thought this was interesting, curious what they will do with this...... If there is any truth behind it that is, not really sure where he would have got this info, I wouldn't think it would be in the .dats?

There was only one change in the client that was not documented on the FFXIV site.

* Added new GM command "monsterpop." Spawns a monster by actor ID at your position.

The last time they added a GM command, it was "gmbuff" and that was used for the GM that buffed everyone in the camps and in Ul'dah. Expect them to use this for some sort of world event soon.

http://www.ffxivpro.com/forum/topic/...anges/#1371524

My CON/THM are still 12/13 while my LNC/MRD/PUG waits at 28/20/20 for some Lv30 dungeons. Don't wanna be one of those people that facerolls on maxed classes and claims its too easy.

Hmm I took all my classes to 30, besides my one r50 and CON and THM @20, thinking that the min rank would be 30 to enter, but I bet you are right, I should have stayed at 20... Oh well, at least I have both CON and THM sitting at 20, even though I can not stand playing them.

[Alkar]

They have translated the zone post:

Greetings everyone,

I apologize for the delay in getting a comment to you all about this. We are aware it is a hot topic in the forum, but it’s one that is difficult to provide a satisfactory comment on. Firstly, I want to bring attention to the following comment was posted by Yoshida on the Japanese forum back in March:

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida View Post
Hello! This is producer/director Yoshida.

I appreciate you bringing up your concerns in regards to the map.
Just like you, I am keenly aware of the concern, and even though it is going to be a lot of work, we are drawing up plans for a proper rebuild. However, as you have all pointed out already, these fixes are related to the core of the game itself, so it is going to require quite some time.

Therefore, we are also making long-term plans alongside of this to alleviate the current map collision in a step-by-step fashion. This is an answer to the fundamental structure of the maps as well as the specs as a whole, so please note that the level design of a single area as well as other things are included in this.

We brought up the concerns being presented by the community, as well as the comment made above, to Yoshida again today.

In regards to the overall direction, he said that nothing has changed and he is still dedicated and moving forward with the edit work.

Next, in regards to the main focus of this thread, that the game is just a single area filled with monsters of different levels; the necessity to revamp this has not changed and we feel stronger than ever that along with the edits, each area should have its own specific theme.

However, as stated by Yoshida in the comment before, please understand that there is a large amount of work to be done and it will take some time before we can even share the information with you. Once the new designs start to take shape, we will make it our top priority to share them with you.

[Biggie]

I apologize for the delay in getting a comment to you all about this. We are aware it is a hot topic in the forum, but it’s one that is difficult to provide a satisfactory comment on. Firstly, I want to bring attention to the following comment was posted by Yoshida on the Japanese forum back in March:

Well shit fire, glad they were speedy getting us this information.......... March? Are you kidding me....

[Kaylia]

Well, they're kind of doing that now with jobs. We know for sure now that we don't have to grind up advanced jobs. So that means "quests," to unlock them and to acquire abilities. Now..."epic story telling," I'm not so sure about. Unfortunately, I have a feeling the bulk of these quests is going to be "travel around the world 5 times for some 30second CSs then have a weak instanced fight."

I don't think that's what he is talking about. These quests will be a reward for reaching a particular level (10,15,20..etc), and will only offer a small diversion from the main grind. It's obviously an improvement, but that's not what I would call "epic storyline".


The situation would be completely different if you were leveling at the same time you were progressing through the story, just like you do in most rpg. You basically grind while progressing inside a dungeon, but if you fail, you keep all the xp and start stronger next time. This way, you could have a free roaming xp party that has a goal other than get xp.

Imagine FFXIV if there was a promyvion-like dungeon that open at up at lv 20. If you want to progress to the next part of the story, you have to reach the end and kill the end boss. However, the place is difficult enough that it would be very hard for a lv 20 party to do it. On top of this, you can spice up the area with a few quests npc for additional reward and xp bonus, and you can have a team-oriented gameplay with a strong story driven experience.

[Tomino]

Kayla's idea is quite juicy, I like that. Reminds me of GW missions.

One thing FF11 did quite bad was forcing you to grind levels to then unlock content (jobs, plot, locations), while a much better way would be to unlock all these things *while* grinding. I think we can all agree any kind of WoW style, plot guided grind is a much more likeable progression method, not to mention something that should had been considered granted in 2011. Players should focus on solve quests, enjoy plot and battle bosses just to find out, well, they also got a few levels doing so. GW was like that, so I guess GW2 would also follow that same path.

On such topic, FF14 is old like it's a game from 2001.
Guess they thought "modern style" quest grind was referring to page long quest/leve descriptions, while keeping the world as vague as old MMOs.

I still have faith tho, basically because the dude behind Abyssea is working on 14 now. Abyssea areas are a nice step forward from FF11 zones (i remember being shocked seeing NPCs fighting mobs around camps), so maybe he can work some magic on Eorzea too. I'm looking at you, beastmen camps!

[Alkar]

Well I guess the PS3 version is due for whenever they rebuild the zones. I'm going to assume that Gridania will be the first one to be redone completely.

[Dooom]

One thing FF11 did quite bad was forcing you to grind levels to then unlock content (jobs, plot, locations), while a much better way would be to unlock all these things *while* grinding. I think we can all agree any kind of WoW style, plot guided grind is a much more likeable progression method, not to mention something that should had been considered granted in 2011.

It's hard to balance this with being able to level any job on one character though. If quests and unlocking things is the main way you exp, what happens when you do them all on one job, but want to level others? It's a tough one to balance. If you give exp from quests then if the rewards are too high, levelling extra classes becomes a chore; too low and people don't care.

(i remember being shocked seeing NPCs fighting mobs around camps)

These were just graphics, though. It would have been good if they fought mobs you could target and help them fight; but instead, they were just animated scenery.

[Kaylia]

It's hard to balance this with being able to level any job on one character though. If quests and unlocking things is the main way you exp, what happens when you do them all on one job, but want to level others? It's a tough one to balance. If you give exp from quests then if the rewards are too high, levelling extra classes becomes a chore; too low and people don't care.

I don't think something like this would be hard to balance.

When you were helping with CoP mission, you would get xp at the end no matter how many time you did it. For "boss" battle or other serious story event, I don't see why it wouldnt work . It could also be possible to have two set of quests for players who are going through the same region again. A story driven quest the first time, and a more generics quest that has similar objective the second time (has to to let everyone play together).

I'm pretty sure it would be possible to design something [simple] to make you feel like you're not going through the same story again twice.

[Tomino]

Is it quite true tho that games like WoW or GW are single-class based and pushes you to level alts, which is like re-playing the game.

Then again, once a game has hooked me with plot and battles during my first grind, I wouldnt mind levelling other jobs within the same context. I would still have the benefit of newfound friends, a LS and, also, being capped on one job could also allow for some items to improve other grinds.

[Spira]

they'd better fix gridania... that region is just effed up.. the others just dont have character.

[Gadritan]

they'd better fix gridania... that region is just effed up.. the others just dont have character.

They're completely redesigning it.

[Draylo]

Are they redesigning how empty/repetitive it is or just the collision?

[Cichy]

Imagine FFXIV if there was a promyvion-like dungeon that open at up at lv 20. If you want to progress to the next part of the story, you have to reach the end and kill the end boss. However, the place is difficult enough that it would be very hard for a lv 20 party to do it. On top of this, you can spice up the area with a few quests npc for additional reward and xp bonus, and you can have a team-oriented gameplay with a strong story driven experience.

you just described TERA

[Spira]

They're completely redesigning it.

thank god. Gridania.. well, gridania is fine.. but black shroud is just disgusting for a newbie area. They were totally not thinking when they designed that.
la noscea and thanalan are excusable in some ways because they're still broad open areas for which you can build some progression.. and uniqueness can still be fleshed out if they figure out something along the way..

like, even FFXI had this in mind. in fact, they seemed to design zones based on some kind of symmetry (between the starter city and Jeuno) and it worked out pretty well... they each had exactly the same number of dungeons, beastmen subtypes, etc...

[Cichy]

Doesnt help that mobs everywhere are so repetitive also. There should been no mobs in common between different realms and there should be atleast 20 more different types imo.

[Dooom]

When you were helping with CoP mission, you would get xp at the end no matter how many time you did it. For "boss" battle or other serious story event, I don't see why it wouldnt work .

The trouble with your example is that the exp given was considered too low for the time/effort involved; it was something that no one I knew paid any attention to. It's a bonus, but I can't see it becoming the main way people level in this, or any other game.

I'm pretty sure it would be possible to design something [simple] to make you feel like you're not going through the same story again twice.

Perhaps; but I doubt they will. What kind of repeatable quests could you design that would let you mainly level through them? I imagine they would end up looking a lot like "kill X mobs. Fetch X item". Oh look, Leves. WoW's quests, which are often held up as an example of "levelling through questing" are basically just focusing your grinding with a bonus at the end; people argue that they introduce you to the lore of the world and such, and frankly, Leves have that potential too. Just a shame the execution has been lacking.

[Sephiroth]

It's hard to even predict what they will do with the maps. As if redesigning a whole zone isn't a ton of work they have to redesign every quest, story quest, mob placement, every leve, every gathering node, make sure all unique features in the zones fit into the new area etc. I think if they made the zones about the size of Mor Dhona (they don't even need to change that place) and then cram in all of the unique features currently in the zones we'd have something looking good. They might have to remove some aetherial gates but who cares about those rank 70 or 80 gates anyway? The only down side is while they're redesigning these areas the team that works on maps can't be working on any new areas. But if they pull this off right we should have new areas replacing existing ones anyway.

[Corrderio]

I'm more concerned at how big of a download it will be with how shitty of a download system SE has.