Random Question Thread XX: The Aforementioned Goddamn Random Question Thread

[Byrthnoth]

Stuff Stuff Math Stuff

There's a problem with your math, but not your theories. You forget to divide by 2 before calculating TP per hand.

1241*.5 = 620 (or 621, I'm not sure)
620/2 = 310 (Dual wield TP is calculated off the delay of a single hand)
(310-180)*6.5/270 +5 = 8.13 TP/hit, while 308 (50.36%) would give 8.0 TP/hit and 313 (49.56% DW) would give 8.2 TP/hit.

In that range, every 4-5 delay (16-20 delay combined pre-DW and /2) results in +/-.1 TP. It's a good range to test in.

[Aozora]

has anyone ever done any tests on restraint to show the effect each hit has on WS dmg? retalliation hits count?

[cdgreg]

What's the deal with Alfard? Can I dual box him/his pops with WHM+THF or WHM+NIN?

[Kirschy]

Since no one knew anything about dual wield, I devised a test that will suit my needs, if not say how it works. I imagine that it does break down into 1024's just like haste, so I am going to operate based on that. If anyone has any information they think is relevant to say it does not, please let me know. But I figure there is really is only 1 of 3 ways it could work.

Scenario 1. DW traits auto stack and recalculate for each added trait no matter what it's from. This would give us 512/1025 or a true 50% with af3+2 head, af1 body, suppa and lvl 90 nin.

Scenario 2. DW traits stack and recalculate, and 'enhance dw' effects do not stack and recalculate, this would give us 358/1024 for traits and 50/1024 each from suppa, af3+2 head, af1 body for a total of 508/1024 which is 49.6%

Scenario 3. DW traits each add a static number to the total, 102/1024 for 10%'s, and 50/1024 for 5%'s, this would put us at (102*2)+(50*6) for DW5 job traits and af3+2 head, suppa and af1 body. or 504/1024, or 49.21%

I figure if we start with these 3 assumptions we can check and see if any of them seems right and works, then devise more tests to see if it stands up to further scrutiny, or try and figure out a new way it could work. To do the tests we need to find delays we can achieve that will show a tp difference between these very small amounts of delay difference. Which I think I have done.

Calculating reduced delay from Dual Wield.
Combined Delay = (Delay1 + Delay2)
Reduced Delay = Combined Delay * (1 - Dual Wield %)

So to determine our tp gain/hit we would add the delay of both weapons together, then multiply it by (1 - DW%)
Then take that number and insert it into the delay part of this equation:
14.5 + [(Delay - 530) * 3.5 / 470]

So, lets start by determining our delays.
50% would be .5
49.6% would be .504
49.21% would be .5079

We'll use Ihintanto (999 delay) with a 180 delay katana, and a 242 delay katana.

Test 1. Ihintanto with a 242.
242+999=1241 base delay

1241*.5=620
-530=90
*3.5=315
/470=.6
+14.5=15.1 tp/hit

1241*.504=625
-530=95
*3.5=332
/470=.7
+14.5=15.2 tp/hit

1241*.5079=630
-530=100
*3.5=350
/470=.7
+14.5=15.2 tp/hit

With this test we should be able to tell if 50% DW is a true 50% reduction, or slightly less.

Test 2. Ihintanto with a 180 delay katana (kamome would work here)
180+999=1179delay

1179*.504=594
-530=64
*3.5=224
/470=.4
+14.5=14.9 tp/hit

1179*.5079=598
-530=68
*3.5=238
/470=.5
+14.5=15 tp/hit

With this test, provided 50% DW is not a straight 50% reduction, we can determine if it is closer to a 49.6% or 49.21% reduction in delay.






My question is this:
Can people double check my math and make sure I did everything correctly?

And if possible, if anyone has an Ihintanto, can you equip these items: nin af1 body, af3+2 hat, and suppanomimi on your 90 NIN, and go hit something 10 times without any store TP on (like rajas ring and brutal earring!) and let me know what the results are?

Before anyone yells at me for not testing myself I want to point out the following:
I already ask in LS if people wanted to do dynamis Sandy, and no one does.
I shouted and offered everything freelot to get people to do it, and could only get 5 people. (and by people I mean 5 gimps melees)
I shouted and offered 1mil to anyone with the katana who could test for me, and ask people to tell their friends, no response yet.
And I'm going to spam check the zone til people are there to ask if I can come get the katana, as well as trying all the previous methods at different times until the update. But currently, and probably until the update, I will most likely not be able to test this myself, so if anyone could help out, that would be awesome.

I have the relic katana, af2 pants, and af3+2 head, but I don't have AF1 Body/Suppa. If you can design a quick test around that, I don't mind running it for you.

[Kirschy]

has anyone ever done any tests on restraint to show the effect each hit has on WS dmg? retalliation hits count?

Copied via Test Data Compilation Thread: http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/103...ilation-Thread

Restraint: http://robonosto.blogspot.com/2010/0...-findings.html
Restraint + Empyrean Hands: http://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/17...er-mufflers-2/

[Pendulum]

You could. Stand on the tail so it only uses Serpentine Tail; if he turns to face you he can use Nerve Gas which is pretty nasty. I'm usually THF on Alfard (with a bit more support than just a WHM) and evade him quite a lot but you want to be either right up against a wall or keeping at least 2 shadows up all the time because Serpentine has knockback and then he'll turn around to face you.

Daggers suffer dmg reduction against him so it takes a bit longer than you'd think. NIN can use innin on it for the crit bonus since you (should) be behind it always.

[cdgreg]

You could. Stand on the tail so it only uses Serpentine Tail; if he turns to face you he can use Nerve Gas which is pretty nasty. I'm usually THF on Alfard (with a bit more support than just a WHM) and evade him quite a lot but you want to be either right up against a wall or keeping at least 2 shadows up all the time because Serpentine has knockback and then he'll turn around to face you.

Daggers suffer dmg reduction against him so it takes a bit longer than you'd think. NIN can use innin on it for the crit bonus since you (should) be behind it always.

Thanks. I've heard Ningishzida is actually tougher than Alfard, true?


another one!
How much of a difference is there going to be between:
1.) Harrier +2 DMG:100 Delay:524 "Jishnu's Radiance"
and
2.) Vision Bow DMG: 97 Delay: 524 STR+5 RACC+15 using I assume sidewinder?

I have 15 coins sitting in my storage, I just haven't used RNG since 75 other than to EXP it to caps lol. But if it's a disgusting difference I'll dedicate the time.

[Aurara]

It's probably going to be a disgusting difference.

[Falaras]

What atmas do Ninjas usually use? Basically as I am starting again with my Ninja from 75 with zero Atmas I am looking for which ones I need to be thinking about getting.

[Raen Ryong]

another one!
How much of a difference is there going to be between:
1.) Harrier +2 DMG:100 Delay:524 "Jishnu's Radiance"
and
2.) Vision Bow DMG: 97 Delay: 524 STR+5 RACC+15 using I assume sidewinder?

I have 15 coins sitting in my storage, I just haven't used RNG since 75 other than to EXP it to caps lol. But if it's a disgusting difference I'll dedicate the time.

Jishnu's absolutely rapes Sidewinder, especially in Abyssea. Worth the effort.

[Pendulum]

Razed Ruins
Gnarled Horn
Apocalypse

[cdgreg]

Thanks. Guess I'll start on that path and then decide whether to take the easy path and farm up 15 more coins of decay, or think about trying to dual box Fistule + Alfards and ask LSmates for Bukhi's help.

How about a follow up, if you guys had half the decay coins, and knew you'd be dual boxing Fistule+Alfards, would you go for Harrier+2 or Gandiva?

[GeneyusTitan]

Real men get real emps.

[|Heretic|]

Anyone have a working link to the ZoneTimer plugin? Looks like the windower site has gone through some changes and certain links no longer work.

http://wiki.windower.net/plugins/zonetimer

[TacoTaru]

Thanks. I've heard Ningishzida is actually tougher than Alfard, true?

I'd say they're about on par with each other, but Alftard has more potential to fuck you up if he gets a lucky hit in on Serp Tail. Also, I'd make sure your WHM has enough enfeebling skill to stick at least slow on, as a fully debuffed Alf and a nondebuffed Alf are almost two different fights <_<

Also, just get Gandiva, Empyreans are sexy and WoE is a headache.

[Michelob]

How about a follow up, if you guys had half the decay coins, and knew you'd be dual boxing Fistule+Alfards, would you go for Harrier+2 or Gandiva?

Depends how much you like ranger or how much you plan to use it. I'd personally go for the empyrean anyways because the difference in effort isn't much and I hate WoE in its current state.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Best way to solo crabs in WoE?

[Pendulum]

Do I need to clear my delivery boxes/ah items if my server is the destination for a merge?

[TacoTaru]

No.

[Maguile]

Redoing AMK for augmented hat, not sure on what to get for augments though. Jobs I have/use are:

Mnk (w/victory smite)
War (w/Ukko's fury)
Drk
Pld (w/CDC)

Im thinking WS damage +2% for VS, but are there any other viable options?

Anyone?