Battle Reform: Auto-Attack (06/30/2011)

[Sephiroth]

Oh yeah? From the looks of previous conversations, it seemed like FFXIV didn't have bots. Is it bad like launch bad or has it gotten worse?

I don't think it has gotten worse as in more people are botting. It's just the ratio of botters to non-botters has been increasing because botters are less likely to quit when they're getting their game played with no effort.

Most botters on my server belong to one of two linkshells depending on whether they're English or Japanese. Easy to spot and anyone legit doesn't want anything to do with people in those linkshells. Unfortunately for them reputation sticks and they'll be screwed when SE finally clamps down on bots.

[MysteryMithra]

What they need to do is give us some different head piece options. It's all Eye-patches and Tricornes on every R50 DoW idle in Ul'Dah. It's like a recourse of the Walahra Turban, except instead of everyone looking like a nomadic sheep farmer, everyone now looks like Black Beard.

[Arximiro]

What they need to do is give us some different head piece options. It's all Eye-patches and Tricornes on every R50 DoW idle in Ul'Dah. It's like a recourse of the Walahra Turban, except instead of everyone looking like a nomadic sheep farmer, everyone now looks like Black Beard.

MysteryMithra!

Yeah, everyone looks the same in almost every slot, except for the people who don't gear properly.

[Corrderio]

Holy crap there's a name I wasn't expecting to see again.

Hopefully we get nice pieces of gear in 1.18. As much as I like Tricornes, kind of gets dull that and my Celta are all I have to use headgear wise.

[Coren]

Wow. I somehow missed that. That's cool though. Archers should be using their fists for attacking. It makes good sense really when you think about it. I mean, they could use their bow to hit the mob...yea, that'll work.

BUT LEGOLAS DID IT IN LOTR OK?!

[Lordender]

BUT LEGOLAS DID IT IN LOTR OK?!

Legolas stabs bitches with his arrow while in close range :D

[Biggie]

No, ARC should not be using their fist for attacking, its just retarded. Think about it, if you were really out killing shit with your bow, would you ever decide to just punch your prey instead of firing another arrow? No, you wouldn't, unless you're stupid. No reason ARC can't shoot arrows for AA. It's a terrible idea for SE to make them hit with their fist, and only give them AA for melee range, nothing but a fail.

And lol at the people thinking if they did shoot arrows with AA that you would attack any and every mob in range as soon as you target the mob in active mode.... L O L

[miokomioko]

No reason ARC can't shoot arrows for AA.

Yes, there are reasons.

Is it cool to just disregard everything you don't agree with by writing "lol" a bunch?

[Elcura]

Is it cool to just disregard everything you don't agree with by writing "lol" a bunch?

Only need to write it once.

lol

[Biggie]

Yes, there are reasons.

Keep telling yourself that. Only reason you guys have came up with is problems using buffs, using arrows, and multishot. All bullshit reasons, that can easily be fixed. But hey, if mioko says its the right way to go to have ARC AA in melee range, than it must be right..... I used "lol" twice in five sentences, has nothing to with disregarding things that YOU, and the few others that defend every single dumb idea that SE does, thinks is right. lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol (but,yes, it is cool)

[Charismatic]

Remove ammo, add ranged AA, add offhand melee weapon, make archer use it while close and have it do less damage than shooting the mob to encourage archers to stand back but still give them some white damage in situations where they can't exactly back up off stuff as they would like to.
Give Archer more/better roots/snares/stuns or what have you, remove animation lock and you've got yourself the beginnings a real ranged damage class.

[Lucavi]

But then you have WoW and every other MMO is evil!

You can't reason with purists. My only wish is that SE could have somehow sorted out what kind of fan each player is and continued to charge the purists this entire time. At least SE would have received something for nothing, then.

[Corrderio]

Remove ammo, add ranged AA, add offhand melee weapon, make archer use it while close and have it do less damage than shooting the mob to encourage archers to stand back but still give them some white damage in situations where they can't exactly back up off stuff as they would like to.
Give Archer more/better roots/snares/stuns or what have you, remove animation lock and you've got yourself the beginnings a real ranged damage class.

I don't think they need to remove ammo for AA, just make quivers you can equip that automatically refill your ammo.

Either way, I really wish Yoshida or Matsui would give a valid reason why they think auto AA is somehow a horrible concept. Unless they did halfass the auto attack system. Which I'm starting to suspect.

[miokomioko]

I honestly think that this auto-melee for Archer is just an after-thought to just assimilate all Disciples of War into the new auto-attack mechanic. Months down the road, Archer will most likely undergo adjustments just to make sense of their role in battle and their abilities with this more general overhaul.

If this were a class-adjustment patch or Archer-specific update, I could understand the boo hoo. This is a "bigger picture" type of thing right now.

[Hyan]

Either way, I really wish Yoshida or Matsui would give a valid reason why they think auto AA is somehow a horrible concept. Unless they did halfass the auto attack system. Which I'm starting to suspect.

It doesn't fit the game they are envisioning.

Nothing they say will be "valid" either way, so it doesn't really matter. Everyone has already decided that it's no good, so talking won't change anything. All they can do is show how they intend archer to play, but that doesn't happen with just enmity adjustments. Everything is long-term. Too bad for them.

[Charismatic]

I don't think they need to remove ammo for AA, just make quivers you can equip that automatically refill your ammo.

Either way, I really wish Yoshida or Matsui would give a valid reason why they think auto AA is somehow a horrible concept. Unless they did halfass the auto attack system. Which I'm starting to suspect.

They don't need to remove it but there's really no point to consumable ammo other than to give crafters something to do, but honestly very few people seem to craft any decent arrows... at least that's been my experience thus far. Very little lost.

[Corrderio]

Can't blame people for not making arrows, seems like a lot of work to make them unless arrowheads/shafts/fletchings actually sell in the wards (And from my experience they don't seem to, or not at a noticeable rate)

It doesn't fit the game they are envisioning.

Nothing they say will be "valid" either way, so it doesn't really matter. Everyone has already decided that it's no good, so talking won't change anything. All they can do is show how they intend archer to play, but that doesn't happen with just enmity adjustments. Everything is long-term. Too bad for them.

I guess, but it just seems odd that Yoshida would want archer to have a manual attack since he doesn't seem to be in the dark in terms of modern MMOs.

[Alkar]

Maybe they have other plans for Archer in the future. There's no way to know right now.
Mages are in the same situation anyway.

[Meko]

In a game where HP and MP regenerate, I think 'ammo' is pointless. Why punish the archers for being archers? Let me guess, it's more realistic? K. Why not make all casters carry additional mats and reagants for certain spells/abilities? There's no point in it in my opinion.

[MysteryMithra]

We already suspend disbelief by allowing Archers to carry 999 arrows at a single time, and all you see on their back is a quiver with a couple arrows in it. Why can't we just allow them to have unlimited arrows and base their stats off of Quiver/Bow types? If SE is so worried about crafters being left out, they can always make quivers a woodworking skill to compensate for their loss of arrow profit.