What's Better?

[noodles355]

Geirskogul, Camlann's Torment and Sonic Thrust are basically the same WS, same FTP, similar WSCs (60%AGI, 60%VIT, 30%STR/DEX). Random fact relating to your question as I'm currently looking at Drg WSs and feeling really pissed off. Relic/Empyrean/AoE are the same damn WS. Both meripo (Drakesbane, Penta) WS have attack penalties and Stardier has shitty ftp accross all 4 hits. Fuck you SE.

Regarding your question, it'll probably be similar to Sonic Thrust damage, weaker because of stupid WSC, stronger because of 25% relic boost.

[shaggnix]

probably just showing my ignorance of the finer points on the mathy side of things, but i didn't realize there was an attack penalty on DB/penta. is that specific to the WSs or to multi-hit WS in general? for a job with a native lack of attack, you'd think SE would ... nevermind, i supposed SE wouldn't tbh. also, 25% relic boost - is this from using the relic ws with the relic weapon, a hidden bonus on relic weapons (i imagine i'd have heard/read about it if this were the case), or something else?

i'm holding on to a sliver of hope for stardiver when fully merited, but if it isn't str mod it can go to the phail bin with gierskogul and friends

[Kyte]

You really haven't read anything about anything have you.

[shaggnix]

i ... i.... i'm illiterate ok!!! don't make fun of me! my parent's couldn't afford public school cause my grandma needed medicine *sob*

[Kyte]

Okay, well to fill in the possible gaps:

*All relic weapons received a 25% bonus to their specific weaponskill at level 90.
*All relic weapons had their hidden ODD rate boosted to 20% at level 95. For those weapons that occasionally do 2.5x or 3x, the rate was boosted to an amount that makes them proportionally equal to a 20% ODD
*ODD cannot proc on WS
*Stardiver has a 100% STR mod at 5/5 merits, but it suffers from the fact that a sub 1.0 fTP carries across all hits. The -Crit evasion on it doesn't seem to be too stellar either.

None of these weaponskill have any chance of being superb in Abyssea, relative to Drakesbane, because of just how strong critical-based weaponskills are there. While you could try to boost them up with AGI atmas, that would lower your TP phase damage and weaponskill frequency- and even then they still wouldn't compete.

[grevenilvec75]

Going through my SCH spellcast and wondering about gear upgrades:

For nukes, AF3+2 or vicious mufflers? anything better than those? (currently nuking in 49 MAB and 96+56 INT not counting gloves)

+4 MAB ring or +7 INT ring?

Is there a good Idle belt yet? Currently idling in +mp -_-

Also is there a good idle ammo that's worth taking up an inventory slot for?

[Radec]

Going through my SCH spellcast and wondering about gear upgrades:

For nukes, AF3+2 or vicious mufflers? anything better than those? (currently nuking in 49 MAB and 96+56 INT not counting gloves)

Vicious by a hair, given you want AF3+2 for helix and perpetuance anyways, wouldn't be a terrible thing to skimp on for inventory.

Edit: in the imaginary case of you vs a 75 int mob, they beat af3+2 by ~1.3%
HAPPY YUGL D:

+4 MAB ring or +7 INT ring?

Strendu > Galdr > 8int(as of wednesday) > 3mab demon(mcrit a bonus but 3mab is the key) > 7 int

For Helixes, 8int > 7int > others

Is there a good Idle belt yet? Currently idling in +mp -_-

Also is there a good idle ammo that's worth taking up an inventory slot for?

Not for SCH in belt/ammo.

--------------------------------

I preface my question with yes, Vere|Spharai|Glanzfaust and normal melee is almost certainly better, but: in the case where you're attempting to feed net 0 TP to a mob by using Shijin Spiral and Footwork, would it be better to:

A) WS + 5Hit, easy to get STP for as MNK/Anything - only need 10STP before counting hits 3 4 5 on WS, Rajas/Brutal/Tantra+2 legs gives 12.
Set looks something like:

TP
Oa2-4/---/---/Thew
Tantra/Calcitrant Stole/Brutal/Aesir
Tantra/Tantra/Rajas/Epona(Probably a better choice here, but can be anything without -stp)
Atheling/Black/Tantra/Tantra

WS
Oa2-4/---/---/Demonry Core
Shura(3WSDMG) or Aias/Moepapa/Brutal/4dex
Toci/Hachiryu/Rajas/8dex
Atheling/Pikalara/Byakko(aug: 4stp)/New 10dex feet

or B) WS + 4Hit, WS in stp+23 (35.4 on 5 hits land) TP in stp+27-29 to allow 1 of hits 3 4 5 to miss.

TP:
Oa2-4/---/---/Hagneia Stone(Alt: White Tath)
Tantra+2/Calcitrant Stole/Brutal/Aesir
Usukane(Alt:Loki)/Tantra+2/Rajas/Tyrant
Misuuchi Kappa/Black/Tantra+2/Tantra+2

WS:

Oa2-4/---/---/Hagneia Stone(Alt: White Tath)
Shura(3WSDMG) or Aias/Moepapa/Brutal/4dex
Usukane(Alt:Loki)/Hachiryu/Rajas/Tyrant
Atheling/Pikalara/Byakko(aug: 4stp)/New 10dex feet

Aside from gaining a hit on B, since kicks are limited to 2x/round and Oa4 weapon makes it more likely to get 2 than 1, you'd often be WS > 2 rounds > WS in B vs always 3+ rounds in A.

There are probably better TP alternatives too - Tactical mantle's -15 attack isn't a huge deal with the 15% boost from footwork, and that'd free up some stp in places.

So: A or B, and any improvements to either?

[urat]

For Exentorator on dnc (capped of course):

Head: Obviously Ocel+1, 13 agi is hard to compete against

Body: Athos Tabard (Agi+15) vs Toci's (Str+13 Att+10 Double Attack+3%)? also to note ocel+1 and toci's will net me another 3% triple attack on top of it all...

Hands: Athos gloves (Str/Agi+7 Ws dmg of day+ [I'm guessing fTP+0.1 on earthsday]) vs Charis+2 (Agi+9) vs Etoile+2 (Agi+6 Attack+7)?

Legs: Ambusher's Hose (Agi+10) looks like strictly the best legs for this, yes?

Feet: Athos Boots looks like best feet for this, Agi+10 is just nuts.

Neck: Houyi's Gorget(agi+6) vs Earth Gorget (fTP+0.1)?

Waist: Crudelis belt (agi/str+5) looks like the best for this, yes?

Back: No idea here, is it still Atheling as usual?

And for rings, I'm presuming stormsoul x2, then brutal and mermans or Aesir for earrings? Or would the agi+4 ear be better than merman's?

Such a goddamn cool looking ws, and even thoug I only just unlocked tier 2 its already doing solid damage, this thing looks like it's going to be a beast when properly geared for at 5/5 merits

[dasva]

*Stardiver has a 100% STR mod at 5/5 merits, but it suffers from the fact that a sub 1.0 fTP carries across all hits. The -Crit evasion on it doesn't seem to be too stellar either.

While technically true belt/gorget as well as more tp/tp bonus make up for it... in fact can actually push it to greater than 1.0 ftp carrying across all hits.

[Yugl]

Really? Last I heard was that belt + gorget was 0.2fTP, which would land the WS at 0.95 fTP.

[dasva]

Like I said belt gorget AND more tp/tp bonus since tp does increase it's ftp

[BrayenMidgard]

Like I said belt gorget AND more tp/tp bonus since tp does increase it's ftp

So these WS that have an "across all hits" a lowered Ftp, they mimic all bonuses applied to the first strike? does that include acc bonus from the first hit? i mean if i am understanding you are saying more tp also affects subsequent hits as well in terms of their ftp value. so maybe that common acc bonus on first hit applies as well? (sry if this has been covered i haven't been keeping up with stuff lately)

so "outside" is stardiver worth it over drakesbane? i mean ever since i heard of the 20% penalty on drakes im sorta /sandpanda as to what to even do with drg

also on a related note(since it has the ftp thing-a-mathing), have test been done with resolution? is it conclusively better or worse then torecleaver? accounting for aftermath?
(sry for the double question, been trying to figure out which to merit)

[fantasticdan]

Blade: jin vs shun in abyssea? I assume jin.

[tharon]

What's considered the best tp set for a drg if i'm not toggling in and out of abyssea? Currently using this on drg

Rhong/brave/x/b.tathlum
af3+2/L.torque/Dragonkin/brutal
timarli/timarli/rajas/keen
Atheling/goading/bestia(haste+4)/af3+2

also on thf i would like to know the same. current tp kit on thf is

Auric/triplus/raider's rang/x
af3+2/rancor/suppa/brutal
mirke(crit3%/da2%)/dusk+1/iota(haven't done eponas)/rajas
atheling/twilight/af3+2/ballerines

was going for more crit rate on tp set.
Thanks in advance n such.

[GImpers]

What's the best neck/waist for Rampage on BST? Is it gorget/belt or would +str items be better?

Thanks.

[Haborym]

Rancor Collar for neck, idk about waist.

[Howie Roary]

He's quoting my numbers. I'm pretty sure these were made after it was confirmed that Calcitrant was +5 kick damage. Assumption on the outside Abyssea set were that the player had 90% hit rate without neck/ear. The comparison was run against Bukhis, but with evasion tweaked to get that exact value. (Qilin? is for when I want to push accuracy below 70%.)

The original post explained that the reason Calcitrant lost in the second comparison was that it had no accuracy on it. The raw attack provided by Faith/Agasaya/Calcitrant provides a very small boost to overall DPS, and is easily overwhelmed by any accuracy needs.

given capped A+ h2h at 424 [I think?] with 8 merits, making the total 440, add 7 from faith, 7 from hands, and 3 from bruiser, if I calculated it correctly it squeaks in at 51.03 base damage, is that last tier worth sacrificing rancor regain/attack ear? (assume all I care about is MNK, no TP bonus ear)

[Nightfyre]

Hands: Athos gloves (Str/Agi+7 Ws dmg of day+ [I'm guessing fTP+0.1 on earthsday]) vs Charis+2 (Agi+9) vs Etoile+2 (Agi+6 Attack+7)?

DEF:30 STR+7 DEX+7 VIT+7 AGI+7 INT+7 MND+7 CHR+7 Elemental weapon skill damage increases depending on day Set: Increases rate of critical hits

That said, they'll be best option unless accuracy is an issue.

[Motenten]

given capped A+ h2h at 424 [I think?] with 8 merits, making the total 440, add 7 from faith, 7 from hands, and 3 from bruiser, if I calculated it correctly it squeaks in at 51.03 base damage, is that last tier worth sacrificing rancor regain/attack ear? (assume all I care about is MNK, no TP bonus ear)

424 + 16 (merits) + 7+7+3 = 457, which is 50+3 = 53 base damage. With +32 Taipans and 8 fStr, you're getting barely more than 1% additional melee damage. Anything that can match the attack boost and give an additional 1% damage on top (or 2% ws damage, in the case of regain or Store TP) of that would be a sidegrade. Rancor Collar by itself is about a 2.7% gain (outside Abyssea) over the 9 att of the Calcitrant (about the same as Faith+Bruiser attack), which means any earring upgrade is just a bonus.

The only reason not to use Rancor Collar over pretty much anything else is due to the damage taken. If you don't want the damage taken, there are several alternatives you can fall back on (including Faith+Bruiser), most of which are nearly indistinguishable unless you also need accuracy (in which case Calcitrant falls behind).

[Kyte]

DEF:30 STR+7 DEX+7 VIT+7 AGI+7 INT+7 MND+7 CHR+7 Elemental weapon skill damage increases depending on day Set: Increases rate of critical hits

That said, they'll be best option unless accuracy is an issue.

Are you sure about that?