Synthesis Recipe Revisions (08/18/2011)

[Sephiroth]

Wtf is this people at forum talkin about guild and training books being useless?

I believe they are trying to move from the shitty concept of "unless you have facility/books, you botch" to "with facility/books, i can do better but i dont need to complete my fucking craft so i can finally grab crafting leves that doesn't have guild in whichever town im currently at"

So why is it my rank 36 ALC can complete a 40 leve without Physicking training or whatever it's called? Training books make the synth easier but are never required. Support is a different matter but they could have solved that by allowing repair NPCs to give higher support.

[XalienLevi]

No pity for those who decided to play Crafting Fantasy XIV. Like the changes, especially to dyes. Gathering will still be necessary and profitable, just more simplified, and eventually less trash will be filling your bags. What's the problem here?

[Scythiroth]

This is definitely a change I've been looking forward to for a while. Still waiting for a few more things to change before I give this game another chance, but it is looking better and better.

[qpoiuwer]

So why is it my rank 36 ALC can complete a 40 leve without Physicking training or whatever it's called? Training books make the synth easier but are never required. Support is a different matter but they could have solved that by allowing repair NPCs to give higher support.

Back when I played, not having a book was about the equivalent of 5 levels. So if something required 2 trainings and you had them both you could usually do it about 6-8 levels below. If you had one, you could only be 1-2 levels below the synth. Without either training, you'd have to be several levels above the item to complete it. I thought this was a pretty good system. You generally only couldn't complete things if you were below their level and didn't have the training, and things with 2 trainings were a bit more rare anyway. I never did agree with getting a leve in one city and having to go to another to get guild support. This is easily fixed by only making these leves available in the city that their guild is in (and airships anyway should ease the burden considerably), but they shouldn't just take out the feature entirely to deal with it.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what the "alternative uses" they come up with are. As it stands, if they just remove this stuff and don't add anything back in for 6 months that will be a bad change.

The dye change is great though, as is the recipe simplification (though, I wonder if maybe it's a bit too simplified).

[miokomioko]

Training books make the synth easier but are never required.

Eh... Recipes that require training are more difficult than other recipes of the same rank that don't require training manuals. The treatise requirements are currently only there to increase difficulty to making various items. Which I think is fine because you have access to a ton of different recipes at any given rank... some of which will be slightly more difficult because they require special training. Working hard and focusing your local leves to earn guild marks will remove these obstacles and your character will eventually have full access to all recipes with no difficulty barriers inhibiting success rates. I thought the training manuals system was one part of crafting that was straight forward, made sense, and gave people tangible progress/accomplishment to otherwise a monotonous task.

At least they are going to do something with it since they probably can't reimburse you for them because most of them are shared between multiple guilds. They'll probably do what you thought they were and just be success rate bonuses when you have them instead of success rate destroyers when you don't have them.

Oh well, you win some you lose some. (I'm just bitter because I collected all 28 of them. Heh.)

[Grey Jorildyn]

Outside of leves, I find that training books are pretty much required when trying to skill up. Have you ever tried to make plates without sheeting training? Wires without chainweaving? How about nuggets without smelting? Fucking hard as hell unless you're way above the level of the recipe. Perhaps it's a BSM/ARM/GSM thing, but that's been my experience with it.

[Cursive]

i can not believe the all the bitching about the changes on the loadstone forums...as if somehow getting rid of an insane amount of mats and parts is a bad thing...and reduces the complexity. what complexity? having to make mats to make mats to make mats to make a finished item isn't complex. it is incredibly inefficient and tedious.

[Croy]

As a full time crafter and gatherer, I am very happy with the changes. You streamline the final product phase without completely eliminating the need to get other discipline items (still need ingots, still need leather for your weaving synths! but now instead of being required to level up another class just to make some niche item, most recipes will hopefully have items that are likely to be plentiful on the market.), and you also make it more clear what is actually valuable. There was too many items in this game to sell, and too many that had only 1 time use. The more items that are shared across multiple disciplines, the more refined the market actually gets. And if people are worried about market nuance, we have the Materia Crafting system to fill that niche quite nicely. And it should fill that niche better then some convuluted system that no one really liked in practice, and really didn't add much to the game other then frustration (For crafters, Gatherers AND combat classes).

The only thing I'm worried about is that they said they are phasing out old recipes, but they did not say they are phasing out old items. Hopefully this means some of the items that won't have much use in the future (Raw ingridients, not the parts recipes they talked about, some of the raw ingridients made was only used to make parts) are also phased out, or DoL just got a ton of more trash that only has value in NPCing it.

[Elcura]

I don't care if they obsolete half the fucking item database as long as I don't need 15000 materials to make 2-3 things. Get rid of that shit, free up some inventory in the process, make crafting less of a bother, it's all good.

[Dantrag]

Do you still have to select each item one by one(or group of items)?

[Kaylia]

I don't understand why they couldn't build an UI similar to other mmo for crafting. You open the menu, get a list of item that can be made, click on the item, and it starts.

Selecting your item manually, and starting the craft is such a chore, especially when you consider the time wasted because you had to check online for the recipe.

[Draylo]

This is great imo, too much crap in the old system.

[Kaiyoko]

Imo they should make it that those books make it easier to HQ the items that require those books or something along those lines. Not something that just makes it harder.

[Lucavi]

Nothing to complain about. I'm moving oooooon...

[Woozer]

Posted today in epic bitch thread:

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida
Hello this is Producer/Director Yoshida.

Originally Posted by Pooh
Since it seems all the recipes from 1~50 are going to be made easier, I thought it might be good to get some opinions from the professional crafters…

I imagine something like the below where the changes will benefit the new crafters and still retain a nice crafting life for the high ranks.

1~20 Recipe 　　Easier than the current situation
21~40 Recipe　 Same as the current situation
41~50 Recipe　 Resilient difficulty

Yes, this is the basic idea and I am sorry that I couldn’t explain the fundamental plan in a clearer manner. I will be making a specific post about this next Tuesday late at night, so please take the direction we are taking to mean that we will be adding even more recipes for high ranks which are quite high in difficulty, and will adhere somewhat to reality, yielding craft specific items with high stats. I apologize for the lack of details at the moment.

To put it simply, the road will become wider, but to reach the top, there will be trial-and-error, a degree of difficulty, and resilience required on the part of the crafter. Similar to the battle classes, we are aiming to have end-game style content for crafters and gatherers.

[Kurokikaze]

bleeh too bad they're not extending the same service to 21-40 recipes. Fuckin hours to make Chainmails.

[Niiro]

I'm confused on what he means by difficulty, the actual difficulty of the synth or how big of a pain in the ass it will be to get the needed items?

[miokomioko]

I had made the assumption that they would be recipes that are well past the current level cap.

[Corrderio]

I had made the assumption that they would be recipes that are well past the current level cap.

This would be my thought as well.

[Sephiroth]

Well you could in theory craft rank 60 recipes at rank 50 but it would be a huge pain in the ass without certain CRP and ALC skills. You'd have no hope of HQing it without HQ mats other than the random +1s you can get with 0 quality. It's not a bad idea, it makes those +2s and +3s even harder to make.