Test Server Findings

[Prothescar]

I'll be leaving for Guild Wars 2 if things do not improve, that's for certain. No subscription fee and I know for a fact that ArenaNet doesn't fuck around with its customers like SE loves to do.

Their business model has gotten progressively worse and worse, if they truly plan on shifting players from XI to XIV, I doubt they'll succeed.

[Helel]

Empyrean gear was the probably the most unbalanced gear ever introduced (relatively speaking), but that's why it was so fun to get. SE just need to go crazy every now and then, and these weapon skills would have been the perfect opportunity.

[LidenbokValour]

They need to really pull something out of their ass for this patch and future content because I know a lot of people will be quitting once 99 ships in and it's still exactly the same just a few more NMs and extra 4 levels. Same shit different level comes to mind.


Like someone above me mentioned there is so many exciting and amazing titles coming they've gotta do something.



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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=50.440729,-4.117125

[Atoreis]

I think you guys a little exaggerate how bad are those WS.

Gaxe WS - Its best Gaxe Ws for might strikes and I think very decent avg outside abyssea. Ukko's Furry is just very good WS and they cant simply make new WS stronger because it would be .. unbalanced across all jobs.

H2H - Very solid WS that makes Spharai pretty much equal in DD output with Veret.

Dagger - Best dagger WS for nonSA/TA

Katana - hard to tell after "fix"

Great sword - It cant be more powerful than it is now after fix because it would be .. unbalanced XD It can already do some ridiculous damage under mighty strikes (yes I know 2h abi but still ) and its probably best Gsword WS

Sword - Same thing as Great Axe. CDC is already that good that its hard to make better WS so they decided for utility WS. Want damage? get Almace.

Club - They fucked up here with nerfing it. Once again tho WAR with KC and mighty strikes would make hilarious damage with it before nerf.

Stardiver - They would need to boost Drakes before making this one stronger. Why? Because otherwise SAM and WAR would have polearm WS that is stronger than DRG exclusive

Gun - Best damage gun WS?

Archery - Best damage bow WS?

Staff - Best damage staff WS?

GKT - Obviously overpowered

Axe - This one shouldnt be nerfed but I guess they was worry of BST too high solo capability with this?

Entropy - In this case they might have done wrong going for utility but I guess they did it to promote their vision of DRK casting spells which they dont see is a fail. Its one mistake being a result of other mistake. On the other hand I parse really high with Apocalypse using Catastrophe for almost 50%dmg of Ukko so with some WS on par with Smite/Furry it could potentially be too powerful and .. unbalanced?

So some of those WS are really great, some are decent and some are part of wrong "bigger plans" and maybe a few are fucked up by nerf. In the end its not as bad as ppl trying to show.

EDIT: Its also funny how ppl trying to say those WS should be better because they cost 100 merit points. Im pretty sure its harder and slower to get that 28skill in weapon from 95 to 99 than get 100 merits ( Yes im implying that getting those WS naturally from skill would have been harder than it is with use of 100 merits )

[Prothescar]

Sword - Same thing as Great Axe. CDC is already that good that its hard to make better WS so they decided for utility WS. Want damage? get Almace.

The utility is lost in that it cannot be used effectively on things that it would be needed on due to the attack penalty.

Club - They fucked up here with nerfing it. Once again tho WAR with KC and mighty strikes would make hilarious damage with it before nerf.

Then take WAR off of it. WAR doesn't need 3/4 of the weaponskills. This one should have been for PLD, BLU, and WHM.

Gun - Best damage gun WS?

Best physical gun weaponskill to an extent. Does not provide the enmity reduction benefits of Cornoach or Wildfire, and obviously Wildfire isn't physical but yeah.

GKT - Obviously overpowered

Overpowered not so much, this is what the other weaponskills should be like. Inb4 "BUT IT'S BETTER THAN FUDO" Fudo is shit to begin with.

The rest I have nothing to say anything about. Limiting us to 3 of these weaponskills, asking for 1,000,000 limit points, and making a majority of them complete shit is preposterous. I don't see how anyone can defend this.

[Alarial]

I think a lot of people are more upset for their reasoning behind making the WSs mediocre.

"Whms already have Hexa Strike".

"Pld's have spirits within!"

"We want this Axe WS to equal Rampage, that lvl 60 WS you've been using for 6 years".

"Here take Stardiver, you won't ever use it".

"Here Drks, we really and sincerely don't like you using Scythe".

"Abyssea was a mistake, our highest rated and highest grossing mistake".

They just sincerely don't care what players say, think, or want.

[kenshyn]

I think a lot of people are more upset for their reasoning behind making the WSs mediocre.

"Whms already have Hexa Strike".

"Pld's have spirits within!"

"We want this Axe WS to equal Rampage, that lvl 60 WS you've been using for 6 years".

"Here take Stardiver, you won't ever use it".

"Here Drks, we really and sincerely don't like you using Scythe".

"Abyssea was a mistake, our highest rated and highest grossing mistake".

They just sincerely don't care what players say, think, or want.

QFT seriously we need the Abyssea team of Devs back and these throwbacks we got kicked to the curb.

[Sechs]

Dagger - Best dagger WS for nonSA/TA

Wonder how this plays out? All the comments I read so far had THF in mind.
Can you make any LV3 SC linking Extenterate with other DNC ws? Atm DNCs without Rudra use Pyrric > Evis for Darkness, useful in many situations imho.

Katana - hard to tell after "fix"

I still have to understand if the "fix" made it worse or better.
Before the fix I had the impression it was much better than Jin, not as good as Hi? (except in a few couple of situations where it came out very close)


As for Stardiver, I still see a small potential in it when used on SAM, but maybe I'm still too much connected to an old lv75 mindset. Afterall there aren't many good PAs for SAM nowadays (best is Draca Couse I think?) and more than that, not many situations where using PA would be an "interesting option" over GKT.
Things were different at 75, and PA back then was a really good option for many situations. If things were still like that, I think a lot of SAMs (and possibly WARs?) would be drooling over Stardiver right now.

[Atoreis]

The rest I have nothing to say anything about. Limiting us to 3 of these weaponskills, asking for 1,000,000 limit points, and making a majority of them complete shit is preposterous. I don't see how anyone can defend this.

I dont think you really expect best damage gun WS to have enmity reduction? Would make whole relic completely pointless to get.

I agree with you about club WS but unfortunately devs fucked up here.

I dont see why you dont like idea of CDC to be best sword damage WS? CDC is really good WS that comes with really good sword with ODD.

Yes it is overpowered. You obviously have no idea of balance in this game if you think Fudo is shit. Fudo outside is one of the strongest WS and more important it comes with a job that has by far highest WS frequency (Ragni can pretty much self SC Kaiten->Kaiten everytime when Hassozanshin proc after WS and thats only with haste from WHM at salvage so no Miser/saveTP/regain or anything like that) . Shoha avg around the same as Vsmite and Ukko at high lvl VW and SAM can pop WS at VW more frequent than it can melee lol. Its pretty much WS > hit > WS > hit > WS> hit > WS > hit > WS> hit > WS for every tic of meditate when you have Miser>Tactician>Meditate>Monarch and most of that will be overtping with that one hit too so with higher fTP on WS. IT IS overpowered

EDIT: Once again I want to laugh when someone mention that 1000000 limit points as a serious reason that those WS should be stronger. 100 merits are FASTER to get than 28 skill you need from 95 to 99cap. I doubt You would be telling me that "They expect us to get this ridiculous amount of skill in weapon and give us medicore WS" if they would make those WS to come naturally from skill?

[Yugl]

As I understand it, the difference between the two WS is going to be greater ATT for Shoha v Stardiver but Stardiver will have better fTP. I expect SAMs to use the WS where ATT is capped regardless.

[Prothescar]

I dont think you really expect best damage gun WS to have enmity reduction? Would make whole relic completely pointless to get.

I agree with you about club WS but unfortunately devs fucked up here.

I dont see why you dont like idea of CDC to be best sword damage WS? CDC is really good WS that comes with really good sword with ODD.

Yes it is overpowered. You obviously have no idea of balance in this game if you think Fudo is shit. Fudo outside is one of the strongest WS and more important it comes with a job that has by far highest WS frequency (Ragni can pretty much self SC Kaiten->Kaiten everytime when Hassozanshin proc after WS and thats only with haste from WHM at salvage so no Miser/saveTP/regain or anything like that) . Shoha avg around the same as Vsmite and Ukko at high lvl VW and SAM can pop WS at VW more frequent than it can melee lol. Its pretty much WS > hit > WS > hit > WS> hit > WS > hit > WS> hit > WS for every tic of meditate when you have Miser>Tactician>Meditate>Monarch and most of that will be overtping with that one hit too so with higher fTP on WS. IT IS overpowered

EDIT: Once again I want to laugh when someone mention that 1000000 limit points as a serious reason that those WS should be stronger. 100 merits are FASTER to get than 28 skill you need from 95 to 99cap. I doubt You would be telling me that "They expect us to get this ridiculous amount of skill in weapon and give us medicore WS" if they would make those WS to come naturally from skill?

I'd still use Wildfire for damage, Last Stand would be for magic resistant things. I don't want Last Stand to have an enmity reduction.

Yes club WS is fucked up.

I don't want it to deal more damage than Chant, I want the utility of the weaponskill to actually work properly.

SAM really doesn't have much higher WS frequency than any other 2h job outside of a stronger meditate... it's still a 5 or 6 hit, 2 or 3 hit with Save TP atmacite and roll. Same as any other job. Fudo is nowhere close to Ukko or VSmite, Shoha closes the gap a bit more.

Was more the point that most of the weaponskills are not even worth the 100 merits worth of time. They would be more appropriate coming from skill. yes. At least then we wouldn't be relegated to a maximum of three effective. You're going to be capping skills regardless, can't say I'd farm up 315 merits if I didn't have to. I have more important things to do with 6-12 hours of my time.

[Byrthnoth]

Wonder how this plays out? All the comments I read so far had THF in mind.

Can you make any LV3 SC linking Extenterate with other DNC ws? Atm DNCs without Rudra use Pyrric > Evis for Darkness, useful in many situations imho.

You can't close level 3 skillchains with Exenterator on Dancer because it's Fragmentation and we don't have any Fusion properties. It has to be 3-stepped in order to get Light or Darkness out of it.

[Sechs]

Suspected as much =/
But it should still be the strongest WS to use for DNCs without Rudra, no?

[Byrthnoth]

Suspected as much =/
But it should still be the strongest WS to use for DNCs without Rudra, no?

Yeah. It will be the best WS to spam in any situation where you can't reliably skillchain (where you have more than one other melee).

[Dimmauk]

I'd still use Wildfire for damage, Last Stand would be for magic resistant things. I don't want Last Stand to have an enmity reduction.

Yes club WS is fucked up.

I don't want it to deal more damage than Chant, I want the utility of the weaponskill to actually work properly.

SAM really doesn't have much higher WS frequency than any other 2h job outside of a stronger meditate... it's still a 5 or 6 hit, 2 or 3 hit with Save TP atmacite and roll. Same as any other job. Fudo is nowhere close to Ukko or VSmite, Shoha closes the gap a bit more.

Was more the point that most of the weaponskills are not even worth the 100 merits worth of time. They would be more appropriate coming from skill. yes. At least then we wouldn't be relegated to a maximum of three effective. You're going to be capping skills regardless, can't say I'd farm up 315 merits if I didn't have to. I have more important things to do with 6-12 hours of my time.

No way other jobs can out WS a samurai outside abyssea. Have you seen a samurai in salvage lately? And VW too! LOL

[Atoreis]

SAM really doesn't have much higher WS frequency than any other 2h job outside of a stronger meditate... it's still a 5 or 6 hit, 2 or 3 hit with Save TP atmacite and roll. Same as any other job. Fudo is nowhere close to Ukko or VSmite, Shoha closes the gap a bit more.

You are very wrong here.

5hit with 437 delay and 80%haste is 17%faster than 78.75%haste and 482delay. Hassozanshin makes it around 25%faster probably.

EDIT: There is also still a Kogarasumaru that thanks to Shoha absolutely crashes every other DD option in game. Btw most of those WSs paired with mythics are best in their category by far and making them much stronger could ighly unbalance relic/mytic/empy which for now might be not that bad considering how hard is to get mythic but that might be far different for 99 versions especially after nyzul and salvage revamp.

[Taint]

SAM really doesn't have much higher WS frequency than any other 2h job outside of a stronger meditate... it's still a 5 or 6 hit, 2 or 3 hit with Save TP atmacite and roll. Same as any other job. Fudo is nowhere close to Ukko or VSmite, Shoha closes the gap a bit more.

.

Terribly wrong on all accounts. Fudo outside is not far befind Ukko or Smite. Since the introduction of Zanhasso SAMs WS frequency is off the charts. Shoha is going to be quite the buff for SAM and really opens up main weapon options.

[Byrthnoth]

You guys are up to a 50% base Zanshin rate at 95, just fyi. Back/Domaru+1/Earring for about 68% (17% Zanhasso).

[kenshyn]

Yeah SAM WS frequency is retarded if geared for it and 5 hit hell it doesn't take much for a SAM to get to a 4 hit build. With the JA that does save tp they added its insane to think of any job even close really.

[Zag]

Yeah SAM WS frequency is retarded if geared for it and 5 hit hell it doesn't take much for a SAM to get to a 4 hit build. With the JA that does save tp they added its insane to think of any job even close really.

Take into effect that SAM probably has 1 hit or 2 hit build in Voidwatch. The atma just got upgraded to level 15 for save tp also plus the regain level 15 also ramped up.

I get I got 2-3 hit build on mnk with Footwork in and /sam in VW, so I cannot even imagine what SAM gets in VW.

MNK is a beast job but SAM is back to being Beast, WAR is beast... They just need to fix up DRK and DRG a little bit.

SAM and WAR are just cool in that their mythic, relic and empyrean are all godly.

Before you say these weaponskills are good to put Relic on par with empyrean... You have to take into account this.

-Can they make level 3 skillchains?
-Can you solo level 3 skillchains?
-Can you double a level 3 SC?
-Will afterglow need the relic WS in order for it to work?

That WS is nowhere near on par with Victory smite sorry man... Especially in VW where you can solo 3 lights for massive damage. I don't even think the new weaponskills even make level 3 SC with just 1 new ws+1 new ws.

We do not know if empyreans get a ws boost at 99 either. Right now, the weaponskills are garbage except for the SAM one imo.