Survey: Which Game Client Do You Use? (08/31/2011)

[Cail]

We won't get expansions anyway.

This unfortunately

[Souljacker]

We won't get expansions anyway.

Actually, your whole post is pretty much wrong on many aspects.

Care to elaborate, or just wanted to see yourself type?

[Gokulo]

The main reason we're not getting an expansion is not technicalities or limitations, but finances and manpower (which should be obvious even before S-E went and said so themselves). They aren't of course the only one, but besides limiting memory on the PS2 lots of the so-called limitations come form the engine and they won't be able to do anything with that even if they drop PS2 support.

And pulling random numbers out of thin air never helps your argument.

[bungiefan]

Why would my eyes bleed? Most of the games I play are at 640x480, since they are on console. The stability of the console (at least before Abyssea) heavily outweighed any visual improvement I could get out of the PC version, and I've been playing since the 2002 game release, so I'm used to how it looks. Gaming on Windows is such a headache involving more than just starting the game. I have to worry about driver compatability being broken, a system update fucking something up, and all the support programs causing trouble if one of them updates and breaks something.

[Byrthnoth]

Yeah, I'd put the limitations on ffxi developers in this order:
1) They have to deal with the bullshit spaghetti code of developers-past.
2) Shrinking user base gives SE limited motivation to fund them to make new content.
3) The game is freaking huge, so any kind of fundamental change to it takes an incredible amount of resources and time.
4) lolPS2/X-BAWKS limitations.

Example, the Enmity system:
It's blatantly broken, and SE has blatantly said that they pretty much can't fix it (or even just raise the cap). Why would that be?

Well, consider every monster that has a move that affects Enmity. Consider that they were added over a period of years by different programmers and developer teams. Each monster may have a different way to change Enmity. Do they set it to 0? Do they set it to 1? Do they reduce it by 99%? Do they reduce it by 100%? Do they subtract 9999 VE/CE? etc. Simply increasing the cap (or really changing almost anything about the system) could break hate mechanics for certain monsters. There are thousands of monsters, many of whom change Enmity through their actions (and some of whom we probably don't even realize mess with enmity). If they changed the enmity system by doing something as simple as doubling the cap, they'd have to test a hundred of monsters. Even if they did that, odds are they'd miss a few because they probably don't have a list of what monsters affect Enmity either. Then, after that, they'd have to consider if full-reset abilities (Enmity Douse, Super Jump, etc.) needed to be adjusted to compensate for the higher cap. Finally, the the PS2 would shit a brick because Enmity values take 2 more bits than they used to.

[Divinius]

I'm pretty convinced that anyone who says "The game looks fine on a PS2" has never actually played it on a PC at anything above minimum settings.

Play for 10 minutes on a PC with all settings at max and you'll want to vomit the next time you have to play on a PS2.

[Alkar]

The main reason we're not getting an expansion is not technicalities or limitations, but finances and manpower (which should be obvious even before S-E went and said so themselves). They aren't of course the only one, but besides limiting memory on the PS2 lots of the so-called limitations come form the engine and they won't be able to do anything with that even if they drop PS2 support.

And pulling random numbers out of thin air never helps your argument.

SE CEO said that their plans are to revive their online games (FFXI and FFXIV) and also they're looking into the possibility of a PSVita port.
An expansion would kinda help with the reviving part and would be a nice excuse to have a Vita version in the first place. If they want to revive FFXI they need to have a presence in stores and possibility a graphic upgrade. It all seems to fit so far.

[Lordender]

SE CEO said that their plans are to revive their online games (FFXI and FFXIV) and also they're looking into the possibility of a PSVita port.
An expansion would kinda help with the reviving part and would be a nice excuse to have a Vita version in the first place. If they want to revive FFXI they need to have a presence in stores and possibility a graphic upgrade. It all seems to fit so far.

I would like to see revamps to core systems eventually, I think the spell system in XI is so awful, getting hit for 5dmg and getting interrupted then having a weird second delay on recasting another spell, mp costs are way too high on BLM spells, the job is just so cringe worthy outside of abyssea, it makes me want to vomit, its even worse now than it was back at 75 cause of the new spells and we have convert + refresh @ 90, seems to help very little.

Over the years melee jobs have become a lot more faster pace, mage jobs remained the same due to such an archaic spell system.

I would love to see them streamline down the systems, redo a lot of them, drop PS2 support but it just seems like such a pipedream that will never happen.

[Selamis]

It would be a perfect time for a full game expansion, if you think about it. We'll be 99 by I'm guessing March, give or take a month, they could add a new region with high level mobs, that would be challenging to us at 99. They could code these new mobs with a completely different enmity value than anything else in game, being able to bipass the old codes and make them function better (I don't know if that's even possible, just throwing out the idea.) This of course assuming PS2 supports gets canceled outright, but they could very easily take everything they have done in the past few years and bring that to the game going forward.

If they were to make HNMs be poppable, without the horrid drop rates for pop items, and still make them have proc weakness for gear, in addition to TH, but make them somewhat of a challenge but maybe not as challenging as Voidwatch. It could bring about new places to merit for those sick of Abyssea, or low on stones. I dunno, just ideas that could potentially work, but if they were serious about reviving their online games, this would be a nice start. One would have to assume that anyone still playing this game now, would get the expansion, and it might even bring back old players like Abyssea did, either way, yes it would cost money to produce and develop, but in the long run they would make money off of it.

I mean look how many people bought ASA/AMK/ACP and paid $10 each just for a piece of gear, even if the story was sort of weak. Throw new content at players and promise new rewards, more often than not they'll usually buy it so they don't get left out/behind.

[lolwut]

VW isn't all that hard, it's just the trigger/treasure system that sucks. Being forced to kill at a pace far slower than you're capable of just to build up your lights, then having the drops be forced onto mules or people who don't want them is more of a cockblock than an actual difficulty imo.

I love the idea of a full on high level expansion though. Something on the scale of ToAU but with nothing below lvl 80 content (like the mid level exp areas in ToAU) and some serious new battlefields and nms would be awesome, and could potentially add years to the game.

[Gokulo]

SE CEO said that their plans are to revive their online games (FFXI and FFXIV) and also they're looking into the possibility of a PSVita port.
An expansion would kinda help with the reviving part and would be a nice excuse to have a Vita version in the first place. If they want to revive FFXI they need to have a presence in stores and possibility a graphic upgrade. It all seems to fit so far.

Actually, it's pretty much confirmed now afaik, not only a possibility. And I understand what you're saying, but they also already said on the forums that a full blown expansion is a no-no in their book - that can of course change, but personally I don't think so. I'm not even sure we'd see another add-on -they'll just release content in the form of patches for now. Of course, we should hope I'm wrong

[TacoTaru]

Assuming you refering to the Camate post, they said they weren't planning on working anything at this time and were trying to work on content for the rest of this year/early next year. They never said it was a no-no, just they had no plans of working on one because of the content planned laid out in front of them.

[Gokulo]

Wasn't what I was thinking about, I believe it was talked about somewhere else (and maybe earlier in time). Though I should have added "at the moment" there I guess...

Though, my opinion on :

They never said it was a no-no, just they had no plans of working on one because of the content planned laid out in front of them.

is that exactly what's worrisome - you'd be already thinking/working on an expansion with a plan spanning only for so long. Of course they're probably have more stuff planned afterwards, but rather still in the form I mentioned before - meaning even if they're thinking about an expansion, it won't be anything soon - not next year. Or it might be a small/weak expansion lulz. Or they're just lying and trolling us.

[Cail]

If theyre planning on workin on an expansion at this time, its gonna be a hella long time before they come out with one, if they do. If theyre not even working on it yet, they would still need to create it all, program it all, test it all, then promote it, then release it...

[Michelob]

It would be a perfect time for a full game expansion, if you think about it. We'll be 99 by I'm guessing March, give or take a month, they could add a new region with high level mobs, that would be challenging to us at 99.

Or they could revamp all of the old regions and content to make them suitable for level 99 instead (in other words, not a waste of server space) which, coincidentally, is what they are doing.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see another full blown expansion but at this point I don't see one coming within the next two years, if ever.

If they were to make HNMs be poppable, without the horrid drop rates for pop items, and still make them have proc weakness for gear, in addition to TH, but make them somewhat of a challenge but maybe not as challenging as Voidwatch.

Voidwatch is not challenging... unless you count trying to stay alive as you try not to kill it while trying to proc weaknesses, which is a rather mild challenge itself. Isn't anyone else sick of trying to proc weaknesses or is it just me? I miss HNMs where the challenge was just trying to bring them down and coming up with strategies that worked.

One would have to assume that anyone still playing this game now, would get the expansion, and it might even bring back old players like Abyssea did, either way, yes it would cost money to produce and develop, but in the long run they would make money off of it.

I mean look how many people bought ASA/AMK/ACP and paid $10 each just for a piece of gear, even if the story was sort of weak. Throw new content at players and promise new rewards, more often than not they'll usually buy it so they don't get left out/behind.

I personally know a lot of people that never bothered with the $10 add-on scenarios (or learned their lesson with ACP and didn't get AMKD/ASA) until they were lumped together with the Ultimate Collection for $5 combined, myself included. People would be much more skeptical about add-on scenarios if they were released again.

[Fawkes]

Or they could revamp all of the old regions and content to make them suitable for level 99 instead (in other words, not a waste of server space) which, coincidentally, is what they are doing.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see another full blown expansion but at this point I don't see one coming within the next two years, if ever.

I'd rather they revamp old areas to make them suitable for 1-75. Especially if they intend for anyone other than current players to buy a PSVita version or whatever.

[Amiricle]

I dont play ffxi anymore, but I had it originally for ps2 since I had the ps2 beta. Swapped shortly after launch to pc, but occasionally played on ps2 as well through toau. Come wotg my ps2 wouldnt read discs anymore, but still ran pol/ffxi fine. Still would, however, no wotg or any further disc-based expansion would be possible.

The main reason I kept my ps2, however, is because for some reason SE wouldnt accept payment / billing changes for my account on a pc or they would take forever and involve multiple customer support calls, whereas changing my billing info on ps2 took all of 5 minutes. As such, unless they've made changes to how shits processed, I'd need my ps2 to reactivate my account should I ever decide to play again, unlikely as that is.

[Byrthnoth]

...unless they've made changes to how shits processed, I'd need my ps2 to reactivate my account should I ever decide to play again, unlikely as that is.

They made changes, so you wouldn't need to anymore.

[Amiricle]

Regardless, I was curious and dug out the ps2 (which I dont know why I still have since I have a backwards compatable ps3 anyway I could install to, last resort) from the garage to see if it still worked. It does even though it sat in the garage for over a year, including through a winter. So yea, I can imagine a decent number still being in use (maybe minus working optical disk drives).

As for expansions, I would be extremely shocked if they ever do another large disc-based one like Zilart/CoP/ToAU/WoTG anyway. However, theres no way they'll stop making new content either as long as its showing profit. Most like you'll get more DLC ones like Abyssea/Shantoto/ etc.

[arus2001]

Example, the Enmity system:
It's blatantly broken, and SE has blatantly said that they pretty much can't fix it (or even just raise the cap). Why would that be?

Well, consider every monster that has a move that affects Enmity. Consider that they were added over a period of years by different programmers and developer teams. Each monster may have a different way to change Enmity. Do they set it to 0? Do they set it to 1? Do they reduce it by 99%? Do they reduce it by 100%? Do they subtract 9999 VE/CE? etc. Simply increasing the cap (or really changing almost anything about the system) could break hate mechanics for certain monsters. There are thousands of monsters, many of whom change Enmity through their actions (and some of whom we probably don't even realize mess with enmity). If they changed the enmity system by doing something as simple as doubling the cap, they'd have to test a hundred of monsters. Even if they did that, odds are they'd miss a few because they probably don't have a list of what monsters affect Enmity either. Then, after that, they'd have to consider if full-reset abilities (Enmity Douse, Super Jump, etc.) needed to be adjusted to compensate for the higher cap. Finally, the the PS2 would shit a brick because Enmity values take 2 more bits than they used to.

Not really sure why a PS2 would be monitoring your enmity when it should all be server-side, but not the main reason I'm replying.

While there may be a lot of monsters out there, I have a hunch the enemy TP move list and functions exist outside a given mob's statistics. Rather, mobs are just pointed to whatever ID a desired TP move entails and for the most part that should be copy/paste work. Of course, we know there are mobs that behave a bit differently out there, like normal rabbits have Dust Cloud while the one NM in Mis[A] has that with a hate reset. To us, they're the same name, but on the back end, it could be something like "Dust_Cloud-NM_Npfundlwa" with all the proper parameters handling damage, accuracy, valid targets, and additional effects like the hate reset following.

That isn't to say there aren't a fuck ton of TP moves out there, but when it comes to NMs that they're particularly interested in maintaining the mechanic for, it shouldn't be too bad to edit.