The Official Forums III: It goes on forever, now.

**Kohan** · 2012-12-08 23:44

Originally Posted by Karah

It's really bothered me for a long ass time not being able to tell if an avatar belongs to summoner A or summoner B. literally just had a scenario where 2 summoners both with the same avatars aggro'd so I kill Ifrit A behind Summoner A... but low and behold Ifrit B was behind Summoner A so Summoner A astral flows and the mob i THOUGHT was Ifrit B fuckin mops the floor with me.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...5-Enemy-naming

I can personally understand where you're coming from, but whenever you're making a suggestion, I highly discourage adding phrases like "quick and easy fix," because it will never be that. Developers groan at the sight of such statements, as they understand that they'll need to get through a lot of red tape to have any modification considered. Further, it basically tells them from the beginning that whoever suggested something—not to mention the people that supported their suggestion—will be aggravated with them if it's never done. After all, if it's "quick and easy," why didn't they do it? It sets a precedent that's unfair to them from the start.

Consider: if it can even be done, they need to be authorized (e.g., covered for hours) for starting on the work. If any assets are required, art has to get involved. When a preliminary version of the modification is created, and—when implemented—doesn't make the game violently explode, software testers are called in. Once a mob in one zone has a "leash" that causes a wildly unpredictable effect, hours of analysis may have to be committed, and at best, a minor change is implemented and re-tested—at worst, everyone starts over.

I don't mean to discourage you from posting a suggestion, but I do intend to discourage you from ever assuming how easy the work is going to be. That will only weaken your case.

**Karah** · 2012-12-08 23:53

You have a point about the quick and easy, was an off the cuff remark. To me it doesn't seem like it would require (that much) work to draw a simple red/blue/purple w/e line from master to mob.... but I could be wrong.

I shall alter that part of the post. Appreciate the input.

However, one thing I didn't account for... If it were to be implemented on mobs, then they would want to add it to players... then we would have 50,000 lines accross entire zones of dynamis. Now (that) would be complex... Assuming (which is an error) that they would only need to do this for enemies, would be much better.

**Stromgarde** · 2012-12-09 00:27

Originally Posted by Karah

You have a point about the quick and easy, was an off the cuff remark. To me it doesn't seem like it would require (that much) work to draw a simple red/blue/purple w/e line from master to mob.... but I could be wrong.

I shall alter that part of the post. Appreciate the input.

However, one thing I didn't account for... If it were to be implemented on mobs, then they would want to add it to players... then we would have 50,000 lines accross entire zones of dynamis. Now (that) would be complex... Assuming (which is an error) that they would only need to do this for enemies, would be much better.

You can do this yourself if thusly inclined using polutils. There certainly might be exceptions, but generally the summoned creature is listed directly adjacent to the summoner in the zone NPC lists. Your suggestion is already implemented with regards to players however, but the avatar in question needs to be targeted before revealing its owner.

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:01

Well obviously if I'm going to rename the mobs using polutils... but do you realize how many summoner/beastmaster mobs there are in the entire game...? You know how much work that would take??

And I mean it would be nice to have a (real) solution (eventually). Instead of just using 3rd party as the answer to every single problem.

It could probably be done by apradar just drawing a line between master and pet on the screen as well, but you want to be the one to say that on the official forums? Or ask Apnea to do it?

I happen to think its a real problem not being able to distinguish mobs, as a game flaw, not a player fix. Maybe that's just my point of view. To be honest it's kind of a bitch when you pull 5 mobs (of the same name) and lets say you want to blind them, 4 receive the effect.. one resists... WHICH FUCKING ONE RESISTED!!!!?

**Cairthenn** · 2012-12-09 01:05

I'm not doing this with the intention of being an asshole, but just pointing out the mild irony in you suggesting a "quick fix" for the devs to undertake (which would actually take quite a bit of work) while being nearly aghast at the suggestion of a fix that would take significantly less time.

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:08

You think it would take less work for me to go into utils and go to 200+ zones and rename every single summoner/beastmaster pet, than them to draw a line (for everyone not just me)?

And I already know someone is going to say well what about ADL. Let me cut you off before you ask. There's a difference between enemies casting avatars (summoning pets) and knowing who did it, and enemies who are specifically designed to be tricky by making clones.

**Cairthenn** · 2012-12-09 01:17

Yes, I do believe that editing a few lines of text on a case-by-case basis - especially considering that mobs that have freely spawned avatars are limited to Dynamis and Limbus - is simpler than engineering a brand new element into a game that is already obviously pressed for development time and resources.

To be honest, I don't want superfluous lines attaching sprites all over the place because people are unable to pay attention to the pathing of mobs.

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:20

But i'm not talking about (just) summoners. What about trolls in halvung, what about beastmasters literally everywhere (with freely summoned pets)?

It's the biggest issue with avatars, yes, but, it's still an issue with all of them.

Killing a mistaken bsts pet in dynamis doesn't get you astral flowed, it gets you charmed, there by doubling your effective list of mob names to change.

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:26

To be honest, I don't want superfluous lines attaching sprites all over the place because people are unable to pay attention to the pathing of mobs.

It could easily be removed adding a new option in the (effects) menu.

Toggle > pet tethers.

(and yea this time I really do mean easily)

**Cairthenn** · 2012-12-09 01:30

That is a possibility, however it would require the allocation of more development time. This game is currently starved for involving content; are you really suggesting the prioritization of a cheap mechanic that would benefit a limited number of unobservant players? How little are you paying attention to the game that you are unable to discern what is paired with what based on its movement and orientation?

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:37

Well the scenario was like this. Summoner + Ifrit and Summoner + Ifrit.

They aggro'd together and landed on top of each other. now, how do propose that I seperate them? I sleep them? On bst? (yes nazuna yes penguin etc etc had I been using them sure)
I bind them? On bst?

Once they're together you cannot seperate them. so here's what happened.
Ifrit B -------------Ifrit A
Summoner A -----Summoner B
--------------me-----------------
they were seperated but the pets were behind the wrong masters, it was literally impossible to tell them apart after they grouped up aggroing at the same time.

Obviously the answer was to run away and sack the pet and/or reraise somewhere else. I'm not dumb. Just a shitty scenario I would like to avoid by simply knowing which pet is which.

**Cairthenn** · 2012-12-09 01:44

You have the options of being more observant before hand, pulling more carefully, killing both avatars, or labeling them yourself as needed with a third party tool. Don't misunderstand, I'm not arguing that it wouldn't be helpful - it indisputably would be beneficial for what you are suggesting. I am simply stating that it is not a worthwhile adjustment in the slightest.

**bechyni** · 2012-12-09 01:44

Killing both avatars forcing the SMNs to resummon them is so fucking hard and a waste of time

**noodles355** · 2012-12-09 01:47

One person got fucked over one time. Everyone drop what you're doing right now and make sure this doesn't happen again!

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:47

Originally Posted by Cairthenn

You have the options of being more observant before hand, pulling more carefully, killing both avatars, or labeling them yourself as needed with a third party tool. Don't misunderstand, I'm not arguing that it wouldn't be helpful - it indisputably would be beneficial for what you are suggesting. I am simply stating that it is not a worthwhile adjustment in the slightest.

How could it be beneficial... but not worthwhile? You have to pick a side. If its an easy fix aka in the coding make a (in all instances of master class job, attach tether) Why not let them tell me how hard it actually would be, and then we can decide if its worth the one day it would take to change... or the 6 months people think it would take to change, in which case it may not be worth it.

In the exact same scenario Ive had happen before I did indeed kill both avatars. Immediately as I turned to kill the first summoner, the second resummoned and astral flowed.

**bechyni** · 2012-12-09 01:50

Originally Posted by Karah

How could it be beneficial... but not worthwhile?.

Because atm people are more worried about new content and keeping the game going instead of with one person who died in dynamis that one time

**Cairthenn** · 2012-12-09 01:51

It is "beneficial" in that the implementation would directly address your problem. It is "not worthwhile" in that time spent implementing the feature could be better put to use. The two claims are not antithetical.

Spoiler: show

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 01:54

I mean really. Player pets are identified, enemy pets aren't, I don't really see the argument here. If ours need to be identified, why aren't theirs?

I cannot be the only person who's annoyed by this.

What if the 20 was only 10 feet away, would it be worth it? How about 20 feet? Where's the line drawn?

How many days would it take for the tethers to be attached to become worthwhile, 1 hour? 3 days? What's the distinction?

If its a simple fix, why not ask them to do it? If someone could legitimately show that it would actually take months and months and months of testing... to draw an aesthetic line from master to mob... I'd drop it.

**bechyni** · 2012-12-09 02:00

The pets are identified: http://images.wikia.com/ffxi/images/...27s_Avatar.png

**Karah** · 2012-12-09 02:06

Which Kindred's avatar is it? There is probably 40 Kindred summoners in that zone? Who's is it?

Where as If I summon, it doesn't say Karah's Avatar, there's only one Karah.

Epic level paint here guys, it took me 3 seconds to add this tether from the master to the pet!

http://i46.tinypic.com/z0ig9.jpg

I'm not asking for some magical glowing pulsing writhing sparkling shifting immaculate machine. Just a line, an epic line. That is 3 yalms long.

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