Poll- Heavy Metal

[Byrthnoth]

Man, if you think they're too easy just re-form your alliance. You'll get a new group of tards and go right back to failing hard again.

I've been involved in several shout Akvan fights over the last week or so, and hoooly shit. Apparently no melee has the coordination required to turn around and no mage can figure out where 20'+ is. Also, Akvan apparently knows when the Paladin unweakens. He always puts up Magic Barrier, petrifies everyone, and casts Death. The fight last night was a win... with 30 seconds left.

He was a total joke the times we did him we had more people that we knew. Something like 15 minutes to cap lights and kill, 1-2 deaths top to Deathly Gaze, etc. Pickup people just make him look good.

[Slycer]

I like the variable difficulty for increased rewards idea, but we've been talking about that forever and ever, not just in the context of Voidwatch, so I doubt it'll ever happen. But yeah, shit's easy if you go with a consistent group of people, and it does get boring pretty quickly. Went back and did Celaeno and Moira last night as a throwback because the new stuff was getting a little boring, and it's amazing what a difference the new temp items (and level 95 to a lesser extent) made to those fights... total joke, especially Celaeno.

Edit: Locking subs for chance at 100 in Dreamworld Dynamis is sort of a variable difficulty for increased rewards situation, but I'd like something more scalable, akin to the 1 to 5 star difficulty selection on levequests in FFXIV.

[Mahoro]

I refuse to have a 18 people Linkshell. Not the first time I've said it, not the first one to say it. Go away.

Edit: And before you reply, we aren't the ones complaining about Heavy Metal plates and other drops. We are the ones saying we are doing perfectly fine as we are right now, and assuming 18 people per event would be normal is fucking stupid.

Jesus, the fear over 18 people in this thread. I never said any of the fights require 18 people (well perhaps Arch Dyna Lord pre-95), nor did I say you need to bring 18 people to every event. I advocated recruiting intelligent people to your LS enough to fill it up to 18. That way you have enough people to fill an ally where nobody is excluded if all 18 magically happen to be on at the same time. Or you can "lowman" your content (using the definition loosely as per this thread) with 8 people if 10 happen to be AFK/doing stuff in RL.

All I advocated was giving yourself OPTIONS. Obviously not all 18 would be on at every event. It's more likely ~12+ would be on at any given time allowing for peoples' "afk, no sky warp, bio break, feeding baby, feeding myself, feeding the children of Africa etc etc etc". The person doesn't have sky warp? Oh well, so you pop the first mob with 14 people instead of 15 (assuming the person isn't a tank or white mage, in which case you order them to get sky warp).

And the whole "more mouths to feed" argument does not prevent you from running any number of side activities during non-event time. You can still spam Abyssea and get your 4th Empyrean or AF3+2 for your 10th job in off-hours (i.e., non-VW time etc). As for Voidwatch itself, as Draylo implied..."Voidwatch drama? wut?" Individual loot pools are great (although I myself hate SE for not giving option to add drops to pool), and god I definitely didn't advocate the LS making commitments to get all 18 people 1500 plates or even necessarily having them all contribute to one person's Empyrean. That is a prescription for drama right there.

[Kalasin]

I never said any of the fights require 18 people (well perhaps Arch Dyna Lord pre-95)

No.

I advocated recruiting intelligent people to your LS enough to fill it up to 18.

As I and many others have said now, I refuse to and we are doing perfectly fine as we are now. No reason to change things if they are working.

[Mahoro]

Hey that's fine. Different strokes for different folks. If it works for you, great.

And the "No" to what I'm assuming is my statement about Arch DL.....well, if you choose the right one and not the clones, Ok I guess you can do it with less. But there was so much potential to choose a clone that our LS would not have dared attempt Arch DL without 18 pre-patch.

[Slycer]

Honestly they could solve so much of this non-loot pool BS by making the HQ rare/ex weapons and HQ rare/ex bodies straight drops off the NM itself as opposed to loading into people's crates. Most of the rest of the items except those have drop rates high enough that you'll get them given enough spammage and the personal crates are a great solution to dramatically increasing the supply of craft materials for crafters as well as removing the drama associated with drop distribution and actually allowing the same item to drop multiple times off one kill.

[Mahoro]

Honestly they could solve so much of this non-loot pool BS by making the HQ rare/ex weapons and HQ rare/ex bodies straight drops off the NM itself as opposed to loading into people's crates. Most of the rest of the items except those have drop rates high enough that you'll get them given enough spammage and the personal crates are a great solution to dramatically increasing the supply of craft materials for crafters as well as removing the drama associated with drop distribution and actually allowing the same item to drop multiple times off one kill.

Completely agree. This would be such a great idea. Unfortunately, that is why it will never happen ;;

[DNAval]

VW heavily caters to the JP /shout culture. Most of them would be ashamed down to their bones for delaying a run for more time than needed. The shouters also often set up Battlefield /seacoms with times for runs later/tomorrow and people actually read them. Things come together pretty naturally for Voidwatch on their part.

The few NA runs I´ve been to have been exactly what you described. For example had a simple shout to clear Windy Step 3 and 4. it looked like getting to Meriphaut [S] was rocket science to most. Then when things got started of course death all over, because feeding the mob TP and standing in AoE range is awesome. After a while it became pretty clear that the SMNs were the only things to actually clear this but people got angry at "pets giving too much TP". Of course after clearing step 3 50% of the ally really had to go. Oh the joy of shouts.


Anyone on Bahamut wants to adopt a tiny Taru Voidwatch Slave? <.<

If 70% of NA were like that instead of only the BG% I wouldn't mind large number events, but that's not the case so I'll just bitch about VW. ^_^

Edit: oh don't forget they also stay till events are done, I have never seen a JP leave an event because of wife or child aggro, those fuckers would rather shoot the wife and the kids before leaving the event.

[jamesfk]

Honestly they could solve so much of this non-loot pool BS by making the HQ rare/ex weapons and HQ rare/ex bodies straight drops off the NM itself as opposed to loading into people's crates.

Then this would be going back to the old HNM style system where some jack ass career mage that leveled war 5 years ago would lot anything and everything that had a war tag on it regardless of who needs it. The abyssea burn just amplified this lootwhore bs 1000x . Id rather all items lose the rare/ex tag and be sell-able.

[Taint]

If 70% of NA were like that instead of only the BG% I wouldn't mind large number events, but that's not the case so I'll just bitch about VW. ^_^

Edit: oh don't forget they also stay till events are done, I have never seen a JP leave an event because of wife or child aggro, those fuckers would rather shoot the wife and the kids before leaving the event.

This x100, I love playing with JP, they are organized, punctual and get stuff done. They don't bitch about playing XYZ job and know how to play their jobs respectively. They make questionable gear choices and a lot don't swap gear ever but they still get stuff done.

[Foldypaws]

Man, if you think they're too easy just re-form your alliance. You'll get a new group of tards and go right back to failing hard again.

I've been involved in several shout Akvan fights over the last week or so, and hoooly shit. Apparently no melee has the coordination required to turn around and no mage can figure out where 20'+ is. Also, Akvan apparently knows when the Paladin unweakens. He always puts up Magic Barrier, petrifies everyone, and casts Death. The fight last night was a win... with 30 seconds left.

He was a total joke the times we did him we had more people that we knew. Something like 15 minutes to cap lights and kill, 1-2 deaths top to Deathly Gaze, etc. Pickup people just make him look good.

Yeah, pickup groups are total fucking lottery. I'll do one NM 3 times in half an hour with one random group, then tomorrow another random shout will wipe twice and time out once over an hour and a half.

Sadly I only routinely play with 4-6 people, which is not really valid in VW if you want drops, never mind that I'm not sure you could kill say, Qilin, with 4-6 in the first place absent a hardcore zerg.

[Slycer]

Then this would be going back to the old HNM style system where some jack ass career mage that leveled war 5 years ago would lot anything and everything that had a war tag on it regardless of who needs it. The abyssea burn just amplified this lootwhore bs 1000x . Id rather all items lose the rare/ex tag and be sell-able.

Any way you cut it, the least of all evils would be to have the one super-rare item drop into the pool. Even if he leveled WAR five years ago, at least the guy in your example has WAR leveled. As it stands now, anyone can get anything. Take something like the GKT... one job can use it. Maybe 10-15% of players have SAM leveled to 95? So we're talking 85-90% of people who get it who will have no possible use for it. Yes that's the most extreme example, but it holds true for all of the HQ weapons and bodies, whenever something autoloads into a personal crate and is rare/ex, there's a fair chance that person will have no use for it whatsoever. And maybe just me, but I'd rather lose lot to that other guy than have the item load into his crate directly without even having a chance.

If they dropped the rare/ex tag and made these sellable, the crafted versions of the bodies would be pointless, so I can't really see that happening.

[Mahoro]

Yeah, pickup groups are total fucking lottery. I'll do one NM 3 times in half an hour with one random group, then tomorrow another random shout will wipe twice and time out once over an hour and a half.

Sadly I only routinely play with 4-6 people, which is not really valid in VW if you want drops, never mind that I'm not sure you could kill say, Qilin, with 4-6 in the first place absent a hardcore zerg.

I actually find Qilin to be quite amenable to PUG's. There have been many shout groups on Lakshmi formed for Qilin in the last two weeks, with some people from my LS going on event off-hours. There is literally no strategy for Qilin besides "proc, zerg" apart from designating one person to take the adds as they are popped. SE was pretty kind with this mob IMO.

Of course, the only caveat is that you need to ask people before taking them "do you have a way to sky other than Tele Mea --> choco." If they don't, don't invite them unless you are still filling the ally and have 30 minutes to spare. Bonus fail points if they don't even have a way to Tele Mea and then start asking mages in your party to Tele them....

[Slycer]

Qilin is definitely zergable, and that's definitely the best way to kill him, but I could imagine a PUG having trouble with it if they aren't equipped with most or all of the temp item KIs.

[Foldypaws]

Nah, you misunderstand. I'm saying that I'm don't think I could kill Qilin with 4-6 people, even with most of us having relic/empyreans. And even if you could, (via zerg) it wouldn't be worth it because we would have piss poor lights.


Edit: also, the couple of times I've tried Qilin with pick up people, they've been unable to kill it. If a fanatics drink wears and there hasn't been a proc in the last minute, there's fuck all I can do, and as a DRG I'm not exactly awash in proc abilities.

Fucking wyvern won't use anything other than wind breath no matter how much I shout at people to lower other resistances >_>

[Mahoro]

I agree you likely can't do Qilin with 4-6, was more or less proving a side note about Qilin PUGs.

The zerg definitely takes longer than the time Fanatic's is up. Melee should not be subbing /NIN. It's basically a 4 minute+ zerg (could take up to 10 if the melee fail). All the melee I've gone with consider it fun because they are just non-stop spamming WS for the entire time.

[Churchill]

Man, if you think they're too easy just re-form your alliance. You'll get a new group of tards and go right back to failing hard again.

I've been involved in several shout Akvan fights over the last week or so, and hoooly shit. Apparently no melee has the coordination required to turn around and no mage can figure out where 20'+ is. Also, Akvan apparently knows when the Paladin unweakens. He always puts up Magic Barrier, petrifies everyone, and casts Death. The fight last night was a win... with 30 seconds left.

He was a total joke the times we did him we had more people that we knew. Something like 15 minutes to cap lights and kill, 1-2 deaths top to Deathly Gaze, etc. Pickup people just make him look good.

*Was a total joke when I was there outside of my WHM bot

[Byrthnoth]

Actually, I'm pretty sure you were on one of the fail runs too with two characters. =P

[Septimus]

Anyone on Bahamut wants to adopt a tiny Taru Voidwatch Slave? <.<

I would offer a spot with us, but we are a fairly small group just doing it for clears. (Generally it is 4 people with two-boxes.)

[DNAval]

This x100, I love playing with JP, they are organized, punctual and get stuff done. They don't bitch about playing XYZ job and know how to play their jobs respectively. They make questionable gear choices and a lot don't swap gear ever but they still get stuff done.

I know this has nothing to do with the discussion but a long time ago back when ToAU came out I made a merit pt to go kill trolls near Cerberus pop place, I invited a JP SAM when she got there she was sporting soboro and full Jaridah Peti Set, a NA war immediately start bitching about the gimp JP SAM he then put his warp cudgel on and disbanded party, as soon as he warped out the JP SAM proceeded to change her gear and......

She bust out Ace helm, Bernie +1 and a bunch of other pimped out shit ( for back in the day ofcourse) and then just to top it off.... an Amano -_-.................................. Those JP's sure have a sense of humor.