Ultra Street Fighter IV: AVOID PS4 RELEASE FOR NOW

**Akiyama** · 2011-10-20 16:37

Originally Posted by Weltall

The only recent events you could have seen him in was him making top 4 at Evo, 2nd at SBO, and 1st at GodsGarden Teams. Is there something I am missing?

He is the best, and he has already been playing Akuma for a month+ in AE (non 2012).

Well, I suppose my definition of 'best' is winning those tournies. :< I guess I should look at it sort of like baseball. You can be the best in baseball by batting .350, and can't obviously win 'em all. I suppose the way he lost some of those was my reasoning behind him maybe slipping, lol. Oops? Like I said.. I haven't followed the SF community nearly as close as the Marvel shit lately, even though Marvel's lolMarvel.

and yeah, I googled him and Akuma and noticed he'd been working on a new arcade card over in Japan for the last month and did well against Nemo's Yang.. so yeah. I'm behind times, man. No need to go "OH LAWD THIS FOOL DONT KNOW NOTHIN"

**Aurara** · 2011-10-20 16:39

welt, lets fite!, got about an hour before class!

**Weltall** · 2011-10-20 16:41

I'm @ work homy.

**Aurara** · 2011-10-20 16:41

**Thulius** · 2011-10-20 16:44

Originally Posted by Weltall

Ok, the demon palm not being overhead anymore doesn't matter at all, but Akuma's standing FK is now -2 on block, which gets him punished every time, correct?

Uh... No overhead demon palm means crouch blocking beats demon flip every time. That's huge for his vortex because now the left/right mixup is all you have to worry about.

-2 on far roundhouse is only going to be punishable in very specific situations, it's mainly going to stop him from getting free frame traps off something that's already an incredibly good poke.

I don't know about him being #1 though. The vortex nerfs seem like a pretty huge deal to me but I haven't been following the updates closely enough to know what sort of competition he has in 2012.

**Weltall** · 2011-10-20 16:46

The demon palm is not a big deal. It still will beat projectiles and focus dashes. Also, you have to worry about the grab from demon flip, so Akuma always has better than a 51/49 against anyone who does not have Daigo/Momochi/Fuudo reactions. ie - You will always have more than 2 options, all which require different reactions from the opponent. The roundhouse just helps set a lot of that up, which I don't get if its punishable.

Wouldn't Balrog vs. Akuma be completely free for Rog? lol

**The Blackrose** · 2011-10-20 16:52

Originally Posted by Weltall

Ok, the demon palm not being overhead anymore doesn't matter at all, but Akuma's standing FK is now -2 on block, which gets him punished every time, correct?

Someone tell me why Mago and Daigo both think Akuma will be the #1 tier in 2012, with Daigo already switching to Akuma right now?

I don't get it, lol.

Teleport > Demon Armageddon, duh.

In all honesty, I don't know. Demon Palm not being overhead didn't hurt as bad as his increased recovery frames on throw. And now his standing FK is punishable on block. Unless Tokido/Mago/Daigo have been cooking up something new, I really want to know what they're smoking.

**warc** · 2011-10-20 16:52

-2 means its punishable by spd/grab ultras and.... chun super. no other moves are 2f that I know of. Akuma hasn't gotten any drastic changes besides slight nerfs, I don't see how hes top tier in 2012. Hes definitely one of the top 10 though. I could see it since the former toptier all got nerfed. People put too much stake in tiers though. If you aren't a tournament player, play whoever you want to. :/ inb4 yangplayeretc.

Edit: posting between a double post, awyeah.

**The Blackrose** · 2011-10-20 16:52

Originally Posted by Weltall

Ok, the demon palm not being overhead anymore doesn't matter at all, but Akuma's standing FK is now -2 on block, which gets him punished every time, correct?

Someone tell me why Mago and Daigo both think Akuma will be the #1 tier in 2012, with Daigo already switching to Akuma right now?

I don't get it, lol.

Teleport > Demon Armageddon, duh.

In all honesty, I don't know. Demon Palm not being overhead didn't hurt as bad as his increased recovery frames on throw. And now his standing FK is punishable on block. Unless Tokido/Mago/Daigo have been cooking up something new, I really want to know what they're smoking.

**Weltall** · 2011-10-20 16:53

I dunno, but in interviews when asked top tier for 2012, every single one said Gouki before even mentioning any other character. No way Daigo would switch to him just for shits and giggles either.

**Thulius** · 2011-10-20 17:00

Originally Posted by Weltall

The demon palm is not a big deal. It still will beat projectiles and focus dashes.

Which is why I said it's a nerf to his vortex. From neutral it's going to be useful in all the same situations but if he's flipping at you on wakeup, crouch blocking beats every option. Throw whiffs crouching and palm is no longer overhead so the only threat is crossup dive kicks. He's still going to have lots of solid options and safe jump setups but there's going to be less guesswork involved, which means less random damage off untechable knockdowns.

**Weltall** · 2011-10-20 17:04

Maybe I'm retarded, but I demon flip > throw crouching opponents for the last 3 years.

And, if they are just crouch teching every time, a late cancel into demon kick punishes.

**Thulius** · 2011-10-20 17:13

Really? I guess I was misinformed then, Akuma is dumber than I thought. If that's the case, how can he not be top tier in 2012? .-.

**Weltall** · 2011-10-20 17:28

It could just feel like they are crouching, but I actually time it different when I see them crouching to get it to work. I dunno

**Thulius** · 2011-10-20 17:30

Nah you're right, just tested it out myself. Definitely works on crouching.

**Balb** · 2011-10-20 18:11

-Demon flip palm will still be good because it's + on block. The knockdown isn't even what you have to worry about with that move.
-As mentioned, only SPD or chun will only be able to punish Far St. roundhouse. This only hurts against SPD chars, you should never be using it against chun anyways.

He'll still be top.

**Weltall** · 2011-10-20 18:26

Nice info, thanks!

**Kipling** · 2011-10-20 18:46

If it was -3 frames he'd be in trouble, but he's safe at -2.

**fantasticdan** · 2011-10-20 19:11

Originally Posted by Balb

-Demon flip palm will still be good because it's + on block. The knockdown isn't even what you have to worry about with that move.
-As mentioned, only SPD or chun will only be able to punish Far St. roundhouse. This only hurts against SPD chars, you should never be using it against chun anyways.

He'll still be top.

Yeah, not being able to push buttons after a blocked st. rh doesn't change anything... Not that it isn't a deserved nerf, but saying it doesn't "hurt" is retarded. Raging demon characters + ken will be able to punish with super as well.

**Balb** · 2011-10-20 19:52

Good Akuma players don't even use it in half of the matchups because of hitboxes. If you're using it as a mindless poke tool, it'll hurt your game. If you're setting it up, np.

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