Stats and how they work.

[tachikoma]

so i followed seiken/kaeko's work for a while now and in very recent discussion with my ls I was presented with a basic flaw being vs a mob like chimera why would a person avg 15 dmg flat blades when they have +36MND (they are below the mnd cap) but basic theory says adding 36mnd would raise dmg at least 25points and i know base flat is around 12.

actually just think i came up with the reasoning as they were using a cobalt winglet and probably over the caps

[Izodius]

I updated the weapon comparison sheet. I was calculating Crit AP incorrectly and as such overvaluing it massively. (Crit too was slightly overvalued, corrected).


Thanks!

[Churchill]

still doesn't make sense to me but! people are modifying it online and have the potential to fuck sheets up. I would make it so they are not editable online

[Izodius]

still doesn't make sense to me but! people are modifying it online and have the potential to fuck sheets up. I would make it so they are not editable online

The sheet with the calculations is protected.

[Insanecyclone]

Found this

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...413#post767413

Snurble here in your thread~!

I wanted to give you some details on what's being planned for stats in A Realm Reborn.

In regards to battle-related stats, it is currently possible to receive large boosts from stats on equipment, while character stats do not have as much of an effect. For example, equipping items with multiple materia melded to it will allow players to become quite powerful. In A Realm Reborn, we are planning to make adjustments so that the ratio of influence from character stats and from gear stats is 1:1. With this, having 5 materia melded onto a single item won’t elicit as large of a difference like it does currently.

Similarly in the current version, even when players add large amounts of INT and STR via equipment with multiple materia and such, it may feel like damage is not increasing and this is due to a damage range that has been set. Fundamentally, battle related stats fluctuate based on the level difference between enemies, and this is also why we are not planning to display evasion rates and other things.

For crafting, the stats in A Realm Reborn will have a greater influence than now, and for gathering, the requirements to obtain HQ items will be visible!

[Raldo]

Sounds like everyone should stop doing any research 'cause shit's about to change. I have a hard time understanding what they were trying to say in that quote though. Why would character stats not be equal to stats from gear? Weird.

[neptunet]

So, tonight I tested out 2 different sets of BLM gear. A balanced set with extra m.attk versus an INT focused set. Food was Raisin. Fight was Nael van Darnus.

The purpose of this test was really to see if double melded m.attk boots were worthwhile or not. Wasn't really about total damage per se, was more about the averages of the spells and the lows and highs. Unfortunately my records of the balanced set fight are missing some averages but there are still some interesting conclusions to draw. I apologize in advance that this test doesn't draw from a larger sample set but it's more to provoke discussion and further testing.



Here's my raw table:



Balanced Set

INT 367
M.attk 502 +25 lightning
m.acc 457

	LOW	HIGH	AVG	CHIT	TOTAL

van Darnus

T1 	454 	484	471.67	552	3382
T2 	820 	891	834.17		5179
T3 	1024 	1051	1037.5	1436	3511
B  	358	 358			358
F  	691				1475

Deus Darnus

T1	446	493
T2	818	891
T3	1025	1061
B	349	371
F	646	664

INT set

INT 404
m.attk 475
m.acc 450

	LOW	HIGH	AVG	CHIT	TOTAL

van Darnus

T1	429	460	442.8	1504	8146
T2	869	934	903.5	1045	8273
T3	957	1035	1000.25		4001
B	355	374	366.75		1467
F	697				1502


Deus Darnus

T1	416	460	437	1512	10252
T2	848	940	903	1012	17266
T3	952	1016	977.5	1372	5282
B	360	375	367.67		1103
F	676	702	694.25	742	3519

Discussion of data =======

First of all, there were no misses at all. So @ that amount of m.acc all my hits landed without any resists.

Also, the stats between the two tests are very close. The difference is +28 m.attk and +25 lightning attack in exchange for 37 INT. This lets us look for a subtle shift in the data.

Thunder
We can see generally that with the extra m.attk, Thunder hit for about 30 more damage than without. If we add the lightning plus into the m.ttk, there was a difference of about 52 m.attk between the two tests, yet only about 30 more damage shows up for Thunder, but very consistently. The lows were about 30 higher and so were the highs about 30 higher. So does this lead to the conclusion that +2 m.attk = +1 spell damage for thunder? I doubt it but that seems to be about what we're looking at here.

Thundara
Interestingly enough, Thundara hits a lot harder by dropping the m.attk and increasing the INT. Whereas we saw about a .5*m.attk increase in damage for thunder, we see about a 2*extraINT increase in damage for Thundara. The average for the first phase is about 70 damage higher with the INT. This was Thundara on combo, so this isn't news to anybody. Of course the INT leads to a higher damage for Thundara. Strangely enough, for the 2nd phase of test 2, I did 10k damage with Thunder and 17k with Thundara. This is about an equal spread of hits between the two spells. I need to run through again on the balanced set to get the damage totals but on the INT set we can see that damage is highly skewed toward Thundara.

Thundaga
Of course, Thundaga damage is higher, a lot higher, with the m.attk approach. About 50-75 extra damage per hit. However, since it has such a long timer, the gain in damage from Thundara on the INT set eclipses the gain on Thundaga from the balanced set.

Here's where the real surprises come.

Blizzard
In phase 1 of test 1, Blizzard only did 3 more damage than the INT set. Huh?! Did that extra m.attk mean nothing? And most surprisingly, for the rest of the test, Blizzard did HIGHER damage with the INT set! Does Blizzard benefit more from INT somehow?

Freeze
We see the same story here. Freeze does higher damage in all 3 cases with the INT set.

Conclusion ++++++
The jury is still out, but it appears that the INT set wins over the Balanced set. But more strange is the question of "what is the value of that m.attk?" because there doesn't appear to be any. It helps on Thunder 1/3 but you lose on your ice spells and Thundara. If magic attack potency is supposed to increase all 3 of your element spells, why didn't it increase ice?

I'd really like to run some much more detailed tests against bosses, and do some more Nael van Darnus with some more extreme tests. I was definitely surprised by these preliminary findings.

[Niiro]

The combo bonus on Thundara caps your Matk which is why you only see increases in Thundara damage with INT.

[Alkimi]

Magic attack set still has it's uses I think. For large portions of AV/CC you're going to be mostly using fire spells and flare where magic attack has much higher gains.

[Churchill]

Does it really have higher gains though?

His entire point was that he had 50MAB in one set over the other, yet saw 30pt difference in damage. He also said his other spells were influenced far more by INT.

[Korino]

I have been looking around for a answer for this but I cant really get one. In game when hovering over Piety it says it effects Weapon Damage (Thaumaturgy). Does this mean piety effects spell damage in some way? or just the damage your club or staff does rendering it useless?

[Churchill]

weapon, con/thm spell stats are MND/VIT and INT/MND

[Buttons]

Does it really have higher gains though?

His entire point was that he had 50MAB in one set over the other, yet saw 30pt difference in damage. He also said his other spells were influenced far more by INT.

When we did CC 15 minute speed runs for the relic quest, i made a special magic attack set for my fire spells. (ifrit cudgel, magic attack shield, fire choker, mage ring etc.) and there was a major increase in my spell damage, usually parsed top on Firaga. (We opened most rooms by casting Firaga.) For bosses you just switch to your INT set again.

But it is interesting how the Ice spells seem to be affected by INT.

[Churchill]

Is that really necessary considering 3 BLM's can take out each section of mobs in one cast if not wearing AF, or is there some smarter playing/splitting up that occurs for 17m wins?

[Grey Jorildyn]

Well more damage is a huge help when doing those runs. I'd say it's pretty much required you have good INT set, and m.atk set is like gravy. It becomes more necessary as you reduce BLMs in your party too, but I mean, who does that!? Lulz. Knowing BLMs have nice gear sets means you can effectively farm with 6 or 7 (25min runs that is). That's really nice when you can't get a full party y'know?

[Buttons]

It's just usefull. Even when you know the speed run perfectly things can go wrong, the 2nd group in the Peiste Doblin room may not aggro the tank properly, or one of the BLMs was out of range and cast interrupted etc. So having extra damage never hurts. :D Plus if half the BLM finish off the mobs before the rest finish their cast, it means more MP at the end of Chimera, since it can get dangerous if you don't have enough MP for the boss and time is ticking. xD

[Izodius]

Despite everything being a couple of months or less from blowing up, I continued to do some updates on the Weapon Comparison sheet I made.

I cleaned it up so hopefully it's clearer to the user as to where to enter data. Basically Orange cells, put in the Weapon's Stat's in the weapon area and your two primary stats in the Character Stats area.

Silvano made the point that I wasn't taking into consideration the weapon's full potential because I wasn't looking at the stat caps by weapon - so he added in those calculations.

I also added a section for you to put your own two primary stats and see how that effects weights against the stat caps. This will also change the comparison for the weapon itself, the only time attribute stats on a weapon are calculated are when your stats are entered (since they are relatively and you could be at cap).


Stat caps were calculated using a logarithmic function based off of all the stat caps I knew, it's close but not perfect - it'll have to do until someone figures out the actual stat-cap by weapon formula (from every cap I know, I'm more inclined to believe it's a set value / hidden stat but within certain ranges). I thought about adding a place for user over-ride for stat caps but for general usage it's simply not worth it - using the curve gives a close enough value.


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...Q1hHUEE#gid=23

[Meatdawg]

Your auto attack numbers are working for at least one of the weapons. The Flame LT spear. No matter what I put it is not updated the AA value.

[Izodius]

Your auto attack numbers are working for at least one of the weapons. The Flame LT spear. No matter what I put it is not updated the AA value.

Fixed! Simple copy and paste error on my part. Thanks!

[Drexel]

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