2011-2012 NBA Thread: The Chris Paul and Dwight Howard sweepstakes

[Rhinox]

yeah not even worth my time arguing with someone who has zero idea what the fuck hes talking about.


Basketball isn't one of your strengths Aki.

[Rhinox]

I'll tell you what Aki I won't argue Baseball with you but do me the same courtesy when it comes to basketball.

[Akiyama]

Shouldn't argue football with me either tbh

but I'll do you that courtesy. I just don't get the +/- stat at all.

[Rhinox]

Shouldn't argue football with me either tbh

but I'll do you that courtesy. I just don't get the +/- stat at all.

lol

[kisada]

can't cause he don't know how.

obviously it doesn't mean everything but it can't be discounted. basketball is too fluid and there are way too many stats unaccounted for in the standard box score. it doesn't take into account what a player does on defense, how he spaces the floor for his teammates, extra possessions gained through hustle, or people who just own their matchups. take for example chuck hayes vs blake griffin. hayes is only 6'6" but he's beastly strong and he straight up owns griffin. i saw like 2 or 3 games last year where blake would try to post up hayes and it was some sad shit cause blake couldn't push him around and he had no true post moves to take advantage of hayes's lack of height. so basically blake would try to post him up, hayes would push him back and blake would be forced to take an ugly shot out of position. not only that he did this without recording many blocks or steals, so by the end of the game hayes might have just a few points and a few rebounds but for sure he'd have a great +/- because of his work on griffin.

shane battier's another good example of a guy who doesn't seem to put up big numbers, but because he does a lot of things mentioned above (facilitates the ball, spaces properly on offense, communicates and traffic cops on defense), his team benefits big time from him being on the court. there was a pretty good article on his days in houston (i think moss reposted it not too recently as well) that helps explain it as well.

[Akiyama]

I know +/- can be a good stat to follow when it comes to how productive a player is without literally putting production in a box score, but then it's harder to understand when guys have 19 minutes, no points, and.. yeah. Lol, ah well.

[Dimmauk]

jj barea with a triple double and klove with 51pts

Anyone can get a triple double or score 50+, but I saw something truely amazing the other day. Against the Lakers, Odum scored a quadruple single! 1point, 1 assist, 1 rebound and 1 steal!

[kisada]

I know +/- can be a good stat to follow when it comes to how productive a player is without literally putting production in a box score, but then it's harder to understand when guys have 19 minutes, no points, and.. yeah. Lol, ah well.

yeah but it should be easier to make sense of with guys like durant/westbrook/harden who do almost everything for the team. basketball inherently is a selfish sport because there's only one ball. a point can only be scored by one guy at a time, as it goes for rebounds/assists/steals/blocks, etc. so if you have those 3 guys on the court with collison and they account for 90%+ of your usage while collison is on the court with perkins, and then say that unit goes on a 12-0 run, the +/- is easier to swallow, correct?

[Kaslo]

Thanks for proving you didn't watch the game.


Kaslo can you please explain to Akiyama how Collison effected the game? I'll let you handle this one.

Collison was easily the best defender on K Love, hence why Serge didn't play in the OTs. Without Collison KLove would have had like 95 points.

Also, I don't remember Fisher bringing the ball up in the OTs, except that fast break that he passed off the Westbrook.

[Kaslo]

Also:

[Kaslo]

More:

[Andalusian girls]

yeh the +/- stat can easily lead you astray, if fucking Diaw is playing with Duncan, Ginobili, Parker, and Leonard he's probably not the engine of their success, but it does allow you to see the smaller contributions that aren't measured in the box score

Collison is a great screener, doesn't siphon shots away from better scorers, almost never turns it over, and is a very very solid man and positional defender, though he doesn't record blocks or steals he just forces bad contested shots (the primary goal of any elite defense)

he gives to his team without taking anything away, shoots a high percentage, rebounds well, passes well, and does all the intangibles that engender success. on another team in a different role he wouldn't be as effective but with 2 elite scorers in Westy and Durant and another high-calibre scorer in Harden he fits like a glove

[Dimmauk]

I forgot to mention that Brian cardinal is a bitch for trying to hurt Duncan. Timmy was angry afterwards and dunked it on those pussymavs


Did anyone see the assist of the night for last night? My god it was beautiful.

[Gredival]

While Westbrick had 4 TO's and 45 points.

Hm, value.

Invaluable asset for Fisher: Doesn't threaten D-Rose in PG rankings

[Rhinox]

Invaluable asset for Fisher: Doesn't threaten D-Rose in PG rankings

>implying anyone does.

[Dimmauk]

Just wait till the LA hype machine makes sessions look like Rose!

[Cail]

this mavs-rockets game is p damn good

[Dimmauk]

More:

It is amazing how shiny a homer can shine a turd. I'd say 3/4th of his screens are illegal. LOL

Also,

[Cail]

dirk now 19th all time in scoring, passing barkley

[Gredival]

Jesus Christ 4OT on Hawks/Jazz...

Also OKC 11pt halftime lead against Heat, with Westbrook only having taken 4 shots and KD taking 10