[dev1206] Class Reforms & Action Lists

[Alkar]

First glance at the lists and this is exactly what I'm thinking. Not sure I'm seeing a significant distinction between the classes and their jobs as I expected. For e.g. I could totally see where they were going with the classes = general, jobs = specialists thing with the old CNJ becoming WHM. But now it seems like WHM is more of a direct upgrade in the same role.

The old classes were terrible and needed to be narrowed in scope for sure. Could've been done either with the jobs or just fixing the base classes. Guess they're going for both.

You need to consider that we don't know everything about jobs just yet. As you can already see from the descriptions it's more than simply unlocking some spells/abilities (GLD losing HP when using PLD, THM getting more MP with BLM, etc.) so we'll need to wait a bit more.
They can easily add a couple mage jobs now that all these spells were completely removed. Granted that some will eventually show up when the cap is raised (THM being an obvious hint at this) but It's pretty safe to assume that RDM will show up soon enough.
I'm really liking the new Bard tbh, it's quite refreshing that you simply won't be sitting there singing the whole time.

[Almalexia]

Great. MP MNK is not just an inconvenience, it's a feature.

Why should my feet cost MP to use?

[miokomioko]

bitchin' to bitch

[Waraji]

Cuz what says MP about Elemental attacks inorite?

[Almalexia]

Cuz what says MP about Elemental attacks inorite?

PUG Abl. 5 O Converts your attacks into fire attacks and grants a bonus to attack power. Effect fades upon reuse. MP is continually consumed while effect is active. Cannot be used simultaneously with PGL Ability 6 or MNK Ability 4.
PUG Abl. 6 O Converts your attacks into earth attacks and grants a bonus to defense. Effect fades upon reuse. MP is continually consumed while effect is active. Cannot be used simultaneously with PGL Ability 5 or MNK Ability 4.

?

MP management is not my thing, but monk is. I would have to go out of my comfort zone to keep on monkin', or never monk again.

[Zzsark]

Then again there really might not be that much management involved at all with:
PGL WS 8 Melee attack. Chance to absorb MP when executed from the right or left of the target.Combo: PGL WS 5, Bonus: Chance to increase Absorb MP effect.
and if they reworked the rest of mnk WS to only use TP (I realize it says "Barring a few exceptions, weaponskills require TP to perform." So this may not be entirely the case) then what would be the point of having mp if you didn't want to use it.

Then again I've barely played PGL so I don't know how they work at 50 now.

[miokomioko]

***PGL*** currently sucks unless they are tanking something they can actually evade consistently. Without Featherfoot evades, you'll eventually run out of MP from executing Pummels and Light Strikes (Siphon MP won't really cut it if you're getting severely resisted). Beside the fact that the only strong attack they got that doesn't require evading first is Victimize... which would be great if it weren't for the unnecessarily long recast timer.

I was already intrigued by the MP inclusion on Pugilist/Monk and what interesting mechanics that might bring to the table... and it's mostly looking like options between dealing physical damage (footwork), fire damage, earth damage, and wind damage while executing combos to recharge the MP pool. I'm hoping they'll eventually make some weaponskills that might be specific to certain stances. I'm pretty indifferent about their tanking capabilities as I was never really a person who enjoyed that playstyle, but I'm not sure what other reason they might load the class/job up with HP.

[Tibian]

It is possible that since mage classes/jobs will be added before 2.0 that they took this into consideration. Arcanist/Geomancer (which has been confirmed by Yoshi) will most likely deal a bit more with the elements. Don't forget that we'll be able to swap a couple spells, and most people who want to play mage classes will have leveled up both THM and CNJ, while those with only one will have more of a supporting magic role (which has been thankfully nerfed as an option, just like mages using other melee/physical oriented abilities.)

For simplicity, here are the abilities that are not exclusive and will be swapped for mages. Sorry melee, I don't care about you.

THM Abl. 1 Increases magic accuracy of next spell.
THM Abl. 2 Increases range of next spell.
THM Abl. 3 Gradually increases magic crit rate. Effect fades upon a successful crit.
THM Abl. 5 Reduces MP cost of next attack magic spell by half, and restores MP when cast is complete.

THM Mag. 2 Restores MP in proportion to damage sustained. Casts cannot be interrupted while effect is active.
THM Mag. 5 Target AoE Deals fire damage to all enemies within range of the target.
THM Mag. 8 Deals lightning damage to target.

CNJ Abl. 1 Grants AoE to next enhancing magic spell, but increases cast time.
CNJ Abl. 2 Temporarily halves enmity and gradually restores MP.

CNJ Mag. 1 Restores a portion of the target's HP.
CNJ Mag. 4 Resurrects the target. Traits may trigger prevention of Weakness and Brink of Death effects.
CNJ Mag. 5 Creates a barrier around the target that prevents a fixed amount of damage.
CNJ Mag. 6 Target AoE Increases the defense of all party members within range of the target.
CNJ Mag. 8 Deals wind damage to the target. Chance to inflict DoT effect.
CNJ Mag. 10 Deals earth damage to the target. Chance to reduce evasion against earth magic.

So, in retrospect "DPS Mages" will have Earth, Wind, Lightning, Fire to choose from (possibly having a predisposition for a particular element depending on class). Water has traditionally been an obscure spell from most FF's, not BLM, and Ice seems to be some weird exception for Thm/BLM only.

"Curing Mages" (excluding WHM) seem to not have changed a whole lot. Which is pretty unfortunate, because healing in XIV is really really boring. I would have preferred to see something like an instant cast that "increases healing potency for 10 seconds" or "combines the target's HP pool with the casters and averages them out (only usable on party members for balance reasons)".

Furthermore, if you look at the descriptions of WHM and BLM spells respectively, the identity for BLM is very apparent, while WHM is still a bit... in the middle. You won't have any of this wishy/washy "CAST A HEAL CUZ YOU CAN" situation anymore. An outstanding BLM will really focus on getting those combos in. A WHM will most likely be more concerned about healing, but if there is time to throw in a combo they have options. I'd like to see more pronounced active healing abilities.

BLM Only
Chance to inflict Stun.
Increased damage and reduced cast time when Stun fails to trigger.
Increased magic crit damage.
Lower health yields greater damage.
Reduced cast time.

WHM Only
Increased accuracy against target.
Chance to dispel an effect (on target, not players).
Chance to inflict Heavy.
Increased damage towards target.


Finally, the only outstanding and significant problem I have with any of the mage lists is THM Abl. 2: Increases range of next spell. I can see the options for boss fights... but really this is going to be a spell that gets completely neglected.

[Almalexia]

Beside the fact that the only strong attack they got that doesn't require evading first is Victimize... which would be great if it weren't for the unnecessarily long recast timer.

Seismic Shock was buffed in 1.19, even more than Follow Through. Unfortunately, it is elemental and tends to resist on big shit like Ifrit. Try it on beastmen, though. It's not quite Doomspike good, but way the hell better than Aura Pulse.

Too bad it drains MP!

[Hyan]

I'm pretty sure that Geomancer will take care of Water spells.

The system is even more traditional than XI ever was.

Now I just wonder how they're going to balance the elements.

[Nevex]

This is so... so messed up.
It's exactly what I expected to happen when they chose to build an entirely new job system over an existing (and flawed) class system.

[Elcura]

?

I think you missed the point on this one.

[Rocl]

a whole new game to come back to it looks like '~'

oh well lancer still sounds boss, so i can keep on truckin

[qpoiuwer]

?

MP management is not my thing, but monk is. I would have to go out of my comfort zone to keep on monkin', or never monk again.

I guess BRD + PUG will be a good combo then.

[Draylo]

This is so... so messed up.
It's exactly what I expected to happen when they chose to build an entirely new job system over an existing (and flawed) class system.

Agreed, I wish they just scrapped those terribad classes that are in the game now...

[Elcura]

Agreed, I wish they just scrapped those terribad classes that are in the game now...

You mean classes that you would ordinarily have been fine with if they had just been named differently?

[Hyan]

Aside from lore, I can't see what is so 'messed up' about all this. If you go in thinking it's gonna be flawed, "flawed" it's gonna be.

It will be interesting to see how exactly the restrictions and traits alter the Jobs as opposed to Classes. I find it hard to believe that the Jobs will function as direct upgrades especially since we don't know what actions are restricted from each system. Can MNK use all PGL's abilities? Will MNK obtain some actions from the second class it derives from?

The worst thing they could do right now is to introduce Blue Mage to the game. Hopefully if they do they'll name it Geomancer and have it function completely opposite from how BLU did in XI.

[Alkar]

Aside from lore, I can't see what is so 'messed up' about all this. If you go in thinking it's gonna be flawed, "flawed" it's gonna be.

It will be interesting to see how exactly the restrictions and traits function.

The worst thing they could do right now is to introduce Blue Mage to the game. Hopefully if they do they'll name it Geomancer and have it function completely opposite from how BLU did in XI.

Geomancer controls nature while Blue Mage learns its abilities from enemies. I don't see how you can possibly think that the two could be the same thing lol.
They're not going to introduce classic jobs and make them function in a way they're not meant to, not now.

[Gokulo]

Whoosh?

[Hyan]

Just wishful thinking really.