Ron Paul Rises

**Churchill** · 2012-02-02 22:30

And I personally and wholly agree with his sentiments towards businesses and racism. There are some arguments to be made for black folks not being as active and sort of their own worst enemy, rap music, all sorts of shit to where if a business did discriminate they wouldn't get boycotted...but yeah.

Demosthenes11 · 2012-02-02 22:48

Originally Posted by Churchill

And I personally and wholly agree with his sentiments towards businesses and racism. There are some arguments to be made for black folks not being as active and sort of their own worst enemy, rap music, all sorts of shit to where if a business did discriminate they wouldn't get boycotted...but yeah.

you really think that's a good practice? For how many years were jim crow laws on the books? How long did it take to desegregate? Did black people start being able to go to the same barber as whites because people put pressure, or the government?

The government is supposed to protect us from the tyrannic actions of the masses, not encourage it

**Eaglestrike** · 2012-02-03 00:20

Originally Posted by Demosthenes11

you really think that's a good practice? For how many years were jim crow laws on the books? How long did it take to desegregate? Did black people start being able to go to the same barber as whites because people put pressure, or the government?

The government is supposed to protect us from the tyrannic actions of the masses, not encourage it

Popular opinion AND demographics have changed since then. Some of that shit is still around, but I think with the largely increased network of information (and how so many things are now nation-wide) it would mostly stop shit like that from happening.

Demosthenes11 · 2012-02-03 00:29

Originally Posted by Eaglestrike

Popular opinion AND demographics have changed since then. Some of that shit is still around, but I think with the largely increased network of information (and how so many things are now nation-wide) it would mostly stop shit like that from happening.

why did popular opinion change?

**Churchill** · 2012-02-03 01:46

Popular opinion change because black people empowered themselves, and with the help of businesses and TV, Radio, etc, were allowed to explore what their potential and culture meant to this country. People weren't doing the Jigaboo because the Government told the south to fucking quit it and get right, they were doing it because the majority of the country liked soul/R&B/funk and loved to disco and get high. They could give a fuck less about lynching nigs on the weekend. Sanford and Son, The Jeffersons, whatever the show with Dynomite in it - those were and still are great shows that were the most watched shows of their time. Even old Archie Bunker was laughed at like Homer Simpson because his attitude was so obnoxiously funny (not that meathead wasn't obnoxious as well).

I hardly think any of these shows, the movies of the time, and the choice of popular music would have been so popular if racism was purely a product of the government saying "hey stop it" and not people going "wow blacks are ok". It wasn't immediate, and the south definitely needed intervention, but it's been taken too far in today's world and needs to be reassessed.

The only problem, like I mentioned earlier, is that I feel the image for black folks in the US now is in retrograde. I don't think people are saying "damn those coons are dirty savages who need to be working my field as lesser beings" but I wouldn't be surprised at people thinking "drugs dealer eh, i bet hes black"

Demosthenes11 · 2012-02-03 02:02

you mentioned many things that happened 10 years after the civil rights act...

**Mazmaz** · 2012-02-03 02:03

Originally Posted by Churchill

It wasn't immediate, and the south definitely needed intervention, but it's been taken too far in today's world and needs to be reassessed.

Yes, now gay people need to come up with a genre of music and a bunch of TV shows so they can be equal too.

Seriously, fuck you.

**Churchill** · 2012-02-03 02:10

Gay people have the same rights as anyone else, the government is the one preventing you from having those.

**Churchill** · 2012-02-03 02:13

Originally Posted by Demosthenes11

you mentioned many things that happened 10 years after the civil rights act...

Some, someish. I'll be clear and say that I don't think Sanford and Son is the reason black people aren't drinking from a separate fountain nowadays - I just find it hard to believe the Government saying black people are good too is what changed popular opinion and I think you can point to media/social/sports stuff for breaking the deeply instilled ignorance in many people.

**Mazmaz** · 2012-02-03 02:26

Originally Posted by Churchill

Gay people have the same rights as anyone else, the government is the one preventing you from having those.

No. The government makes it legal for gays to get married, and then the people stop discriminating against them. This is what happened here in Canada.

**Churchill** · 2012-02-03 02:32

And in America, the Government says it is not legal for gays to get married. If the Government says gays can get married, that they have the same rights as everyone else and can adopt as couples, file taxes as couples, whatever, then they are granting them rights that the FEDERAL Government currently says they DO NOT HAVE. The Constitution is pretty clear and gays should have these rights, but the fact that they do not has everything to do with the Government.

Now, when the above finally happens, gay people are still going to get discriminated against. That's going to happen until they end of time unless religions figure out that they are all garbage or that when it says love thy neighbor it also means the gays.

Also, isn't Canada making it illegal, or you can't get divorced or something? Thought there was an article about that.

**Mazmaz** · 2012-02-03 02:45

Right. Except you said there's too much government intervention in that first quote. Or I misunderstood.

Also

In 2012, after the submission of a legal opinion by a Government of Canada lawyer suggesting that non-residents of Canada cannot have valid marriages if they do not have the capacity for marriage in their home jurisdictions, the Conservative government announced that they would alter what they consider to be a "legislative gap".

They're fixing a technicality.

**Elvis** · 2012-02-03 20:11

Originally Posted by Mazmaz

Yes, now gay people need to come up with a genre of music and a bunch of TV shows so they can be equal too.

Seriously, fuck you.

You don't understand. Churchill is talking about how we're socialized into perceiving minorities differently.

The Civil Rights Movement is still more important for obvious reasons but popular culture plays an important role in shaping public opinion.

Demosthenes11 · 2012-02-03 20:24

is that why gays in the philippines are on tv and the stars of shows so often, but the vast majority of the country thinks they are heathens going to hell and dont want to let them marry?

**Elvis** · 2012-02-03 21:10

Originally Posted by Demosthenes11

is that why gays in the philippines are on tv and the stars of shows so often, but the vast majority of the country thinks they are heathens going to hell and dont want to let them marry?

Sorry, but I'm talking about the mainland here.

When writing my original post, I knew someone would see it as an absolutist statement.

These are complex institutions. It's not a rule that popular opinion mirrors popular culture and I didn't even say that.

I simply said it plays an important role in shaping attitudes.

So do other things.

It's difficult to say when it becomes acceptable to no longer be weirded out by a gay person on TV. It changes as our society changes. Then gradually you see more positive portrayals of gays and other 'groups' (while some, like Muslims are still hated; see: 'All-American Muslim' / Lowe's controversy).

This is something I feel confidently postulating about because I'm talking about America.

The same kind of evolution will be different in countries or territories without the same kinds of historical legacies.

We have slavery, civil discrimination, the Vietnam War, the Civil War, women's suffrage and feminism, etc.

Right now, it's the gay rights movement that harkens back to the days of the Civil Rights movement and the activism of the 70s. Not saying it's to that level of radical thinking mixed in with politically viable social change, but rather that similarities (profound ones) exist.

And television plays a big role in advancing the line for what is and is not acceptable. How does it work? I think it's always a reaction to societal changes but sometimes, there is a concerted effort to socialize groups favorably. And why not? Everyone should be humanized.

**Churchill** · 2012-02-04 00:03

That and the Phillippines are more Christian (Catholic) than the US is, which is a specific point I made responding to Maz. Even if the Government decided that oh yeah, gays fall under the people portion of having rights, they would still have the majority of the christian nation thinking they were buttfucking heathens.

**test123** · 2012-02-04 07:07

This interview really blew my mind. I liked how Ron Paul mindfucked Piers about the "bank robbery" comeback, lol.

**Rhinox** · 2012-02-04 13:39

Amazingly boring.

**Mazmaz** · 2012-02-04 13:58

So's any other Piers Morgan interview.

Demosthenes11 · 2012-02-04 15:07

can we start calling paul "7% paul" ?

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