Job System (03/04/2012)

[Elcura]

Kaeko's investigative work properly quantifies exactly how little sense WHM/BLM's class relationships make.

I don't think you need "investigative work" to properly understand how little sense these subclass choices make sense.

[Niiro]

According to Mooglebox, they are restricted to DoW, but that's the extent of it.

For the most part lower level WSs for all jobs are capable of being used cross-class, higher level ones or WSs that have certain special effects tied to them are usually exclusive.

example: Heavy shot and Piercing arrow can be used cross class, but Shadowbind (special effect) and Wide Volley (high level) can't.

That said, there's really no reason to use WSs cross-class as you can't make combos (even if you can equip the next WS in the combo), so there isn't really a point to them being cross-class to begin with.

[Lokus]

Some have use for incaps but nothing worthwhile needs to be incapped anyway.

[Alkar]

Mages do not have a lot of options because there are only 2 of them in the game. Adding defensive abilities makes more sense than adding nothing.
Most likely there will be other sub-classes added come 2.0 or whenever new mage classes show up.

[Grey Jorildyn]

Gonna suck not having Stoneskin on BLM. Guess we'll have to get by another way somehow.

A lot of this doesn't make sense.

[Kaylia]

I like how they say the ability to cross-class is core to the game, but if you look at the options for BLM (given only PGL and ARC), they get these options (comprehensive list):

It's not like these abilities are set in stone either. I see no reason to think they won't be changed [eventually].


Not that I think including cross-class abilities was a great idea to begin with. Min/maxer are going to be pigeonholed into specific choice regardless of the system, and it makes the game much harder to balance.

[Grey Jorildyn]

In theory the game should be easier to balance when everyone is using the same skills. Predictability and all that.

This system seems poor now because everyone is pigeonholed into 5 abilities due to the current level cap. Perhaps over the longhaul, as we see more abilities become available in the base classes, the job system will appear to improve. We could see spec'ing within it like we do now with the armoury system. Just seems like a perfect example of the more things change the more they stay the same.

[Draylo]

Hopefully they add more jobs at 2.0!

[Elcura]

Hopefully they add more jobs at 2.0!

Won't be Blue Mage.

[Malekos]

I like how they say the ability to cross-class is core to the game, but if you look at the options for BLM (given only PGL and ARC), they get these options (comprehensive list):

Decoy
Hawk's Eye
Quelling Strike
Chameleon
Featherfoot
Second Wind
Blindside

That's it. Get to pick 5/7. Blindside does not work on spells or auto-attacks. Black Mage / THM by definition is unable to use any WSs, therefore, is mechanistically unable to use Blindside (can use the buff, but cannot proc the effect). Hawk's Eye does not work for spells (says "increases physical accuracy"). So you can remove these 2 from having any sort of use. This leaves only 5 options, which is the # you get anyways. So BLMs are essentially locked into every single one of their abilities. The only time the ability list for any reasonable BLM change is if they simply did not level ARC or PGL high enough to get some of the abilities unlocked like Chameleon.

Not only that, but BLM will not have invigorate, so in order to get TP to use most of those, you have to (1) pull out you weapon, thus no mp regen, and (2) get close enough to swing that stubby weapon.

[Stanislaw]

Not only that, but BLM will not have invigorate, so in order to get TP to use most of those, you have to (1) pull out you weapon, thus no mp regen, and (2) get close enough to swing that stubby weapon.

You can get TP from Quelling Strike. It works on spells too.

[TacoTaru]

You only need TP to use Second Wind. I can't recall how much TP Quelling Strike gives to say whether it's enough for Second Wind to go, but most AoE attacks from Ifrit/Moogle seem to generate enough to use it right away.

*Edit*
Beated.

[Sigmakan]

To me, a lot of these 'sub-classes' actually make a lot of sense. The only job that kinda gets screwed is WHM.

We'll have to see how potent the job-specific abilities are. If they arent that potent I can see most jobs becoming obsolete (with exception of PLD BRD WHM).

With that being said, jobs are still optional. They are another tool we can use to customize our party setups. I'm pretty sure we were all expecting jobs to be much more powerful and essentially replace classes, but it seems like there will be a good balance between the two.

[Raldo]

WHM, screwed? What do they want that they can't access aside from Chameleon?

[solracht]

With that being said, jobs are still optional. They are another tool we can use to customize our party setups. I'm pretty sure we were all expecting jobs to be much more powerful and essentially replace classes, but it seems like there will be a good balance between the two.

Jobs aren't supposed to be optional in party settings. If there are full-party scenarios where it's preferred to use classes over jobs, then the intent of the job system has failed and Square-Enix wasted development time.

[Sigmakan]

WHM, screwed? What do they want that they can't access aside from Chameleon?

Thats a great point. I was more looking at they can get instead of cant get. A lot of the GLA abilities dont seem very appealing to a traditional WHM role. Still though, its not bad, most jobs get the abilities they need/want.

[Lordender]

Am I alone in thinking this whole job system is a bit strange? I don't know why but the whole idea seems strange/weird to me.

[Aratharn]

The concept is sound, the idea of specialization etc. We'll see how the implementation goes. Have a feeling it will take several patches to balance/tweak things.

I think it will be better when they add multiple jobs you can branch out to. Ex: GLA can choose to be PLD or DRK.

[Malekos]

lol... brain misfire this afternoon I guess. I was thinking about most of those abilities from their pre-1.19 state.

[Malekos]

I think it will be better when they add multiple jobs you can branch out to. Ex: GLA can choose to be PLD or DRK.

Yep, this is what I was thinking too.