MLG Winter Championships 2012

[Akiyama]

I watched a little before I went to NCR. Shit was pretty awful.

[The Blackrose]

1. The players for these games had almost no notice at all. Players who couldn't get free plane/hotel rides were just completely left out unless they lives near Ohio. There was even less notice for KOF/SC5 than there was MK.

I thought the big party foul was waiting until the week before the event to announce the rule sets for each game. I was dreading the continuation rule, but it also showed that MLG was clueless regarding how some games operate (eg. Gameplay Rule #4 vs. KOF). MLG seems like they want to take every game and apply the same template over and over, when in reality all games are not equal. It shows a stubborn laziness in how they operate.

2. Even at FGC events, no crowds line up to watch KOF/SC/MK LOL. Even at EVO, there might have been like 15-20 people watching MK before being forced to on the main stage. That was when 100% of the people were there for strictly FGs and MK was a newer game at the time. No one will ever line up to watch those games like SF/Marvel.

Surprisingly, there were a ton of viewers at NCR for KOF, both in stream and physically (IPW had around 10k for KOF). Otherwise, I agree. MLG got the games that were lower on the totem pole.

#1 and #2 is why I hold more hope for IPL than I do for MLG. IPL's SxSW exhibition only had production issues. MLG has issues across the board. If you gave Arturo IPL's resources, the end result would be a juggernaut.

3. This tourney is taking place in Ohio. No offense, but that state sucks. Anyone spending his or her own money this weekend would be going to NCR over Ohio. MLG needs to make sure their tourneys are in better locations.

Hey hey hey hey HEY! No ripping on the sacred home of Seasons Beatings.

Seriously though, agreed again - fuck Ohio.

Final thoughts: I get the feeling Arturo is going to be thrown under the bus on this shit (he probably has the same feeling), which is totally not fair. The guy walked into a lion's den. I didn't care much for MK or SC, but I was glad that TheAnswer brought at least some emotion to what was a sort of dry commentary block (except when Juicebox came around). However, I could use less advertising being blown up my ass...

[Vandole]

I could use less advertising being blown up my ass...

http://www.noob2geek.com/wp-content/...block_plus.png

[Pikarya]

Artosis-Tasteless-INcontroL
Huk-Stephano-ViOLet
MarineKing
Haypro-DRG-Ret-Jinro-Sheth

Spoiler: show

J.Wong

Spoiler: show

Wong getting raped in SC/MK9 :/

Spoiler: show

Was a great event. Had some things that pissed me off though.

1. Mid game Sheth was playing and a security guard comes by and tells him to take off his headset because he's not supposed to have water bottles on the stations.

2. Constant technical issues with lag in SC2 matches. (More of Blizzard fault than anything)

3. No food or drink allowed inside. Only water. They gave out free Pepper, but the shit is nasty after your 40th drink.

4. Security was overzealous, they treated for the most part everyone like idiots, including the players (see #1).

5. Many players dced from games or that had technical issues were not issued rematches, so many players got fucked on 1-2 of their games. (MLG derp, they really need to stop having players sit around 5-10 minutes to fix a technical issue for their match to be unpaused/etc. By the time the game gets resumed the players are already out of their zen.

6. Force cross spawns only in the map pool. Its pretty retarded this isn't the norm in tournament play by now.

7. People really need to take fucking showers or use deodorant. I understand Blizzcon is the cancer of all B.O. but holy fuck people. Have some class.

[Vandole]

http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php...cedent.157294/

well put thoughts on my internet? its more likely than you think.

[Maguspk]

An angry armchair child makes a forum post about NOT ONE SECOND OF NO ADS. Yeah, well put thoughts.

Most of you probably don't even know that MLG ran SSBM successfully for a long time with big names in the community driving it's direction. Many of whom, in fact, are vocal about MLG being only a good thing. Even if you have some ignorant 'MLG is evil' view, you should see the clear case of the audience determining what they watch. Nobody is strapping you into your pleather computer chair and forcing you to watch. This is all assuming the argument even makes sense to begin with, which it doesn't. The same 'we gotta stay grassroots, bro' strawman is parroted in some form along with every single one of these posts, as if MLG's very existence threatens their astroturf cred.

Also, try reading the entire thread and not just the first few posts. Alphazealot gave some very reasonable insights which, surprisingly enough, managed to get through and impart some logic onto some of the more stubbornly resistant posters.

[Sho]

An angry armchair child makes a forum post about NOT ONE SECOND OF NO ADS. Yeah, well put thoughts.

Most of you probably don't even know that MLG ran SSBM successfully for a long time with big names in the community driving it's direction. Many of whom, in fact, are vocal about MLG being only a good thing. Even if you have some ignorant 'MLG is evil' view, you should see the clear case of the audience determining what they watch. Nobody is strapping you into your pleather computer chair and forcing you to watch. This is all assuming the argument even makes sense to begin with, which it doesn't. The same 'we gotta stay grassroots, bro' strawman is parroted in some form along with every single one of these posts, as if MLG's very existence threatens their astroturf cred.

Also, try reading the entire thread and not just the first few posts. Alphazealot gave some very reasonable insights which, surprisingly enough, managed to get through and impart some logic onto some of the more stubbornly resistant posters.

Actually a good deal of us know about MLGs exploits with SSBM (I can agree that they did a good job with this game). And other sock in the drawer games like SCIV & T6. And your point? These games were all further driven to the grave with the exception of SSBM, which actually had a great showing. What we also remember is the major fucking up that MLG had with EVO 2005, amongst bracket rigging in 2010 Brawl, and a few other things. To touch on EVO2005, it was something that the FGC & SRK never really forgot about up until this day. If you don't know what happened, they [MLG] pretty much took over the entire event, pushing tons of Halo and other FPS set ups into the space reserved for EVO's fighting games... set ups that weren't even being used. On top of that they took up even more space for their audience and had more venue space for their own crew, most of which was simply not being used at all either. It got so bad, I personally remember seeing people from EVOs side stand up on chairs to boo people playing Halo and other MLG games at the event.

No one is forcing us to watch indeed, but Justin Wong, Bala, Reynald, Xian and others are "ours," part of our community, and we would support/cheer/boo them no matter where they went to tourney up. If Justin's tweets were to be believed, he was one of the people that had the worst time there (despite him winning more money than normal at 7th place).

Also where the fuck are you getting this "we gotta stay grassroots, bro" shit from? Just about everyone here would like to see the FGC blow up to something big just like the MLG. You should probably stop talking out of your ass and actually hang out and read posts on our forums or join in the chats we have. Very few want to see this accomplished via ties or working with MLG, however. It's obvious that they are in it for business, rather than actually taking part in the culture that's come about.

3. No food or drink allowed inside. Only water. They gave out free Pepper, but the shit is nasty after your 40th drink.

7. People really need to take fucking showers or use deodorant. I understand Blizzcon is the cancer of all B.O. but holy fuck people. Have some class.

3. I wish I could have free Dr. Pepper like that.

7. People will never take showers. Happens each and every time.

[Vandole]

yet another topic magus has no real idea what he's talking about while we continue to actually know the problems and discuss them. it all boils down to one thing, since MLG has given arturo sanchez the responsibility of the fighting games in MLG, they need to let him run it in the best way he can. but instead MLG is using their obviously favored(extended set and advertisement plans) to do it. it's going to take a very long time for it to get fixed ... if it happens.

hopefully the FGC can bring IPL up to snuff and shut out the FGC's involvement in mlg altogether.

[Sho]

Dude, the FGC itself is ALREADY trying to become ESPN.

Not that it's necessarily a bad thing, but there is WAY more censorship going on now, than in the past. Fucking Alex Valle is a nice guy now! Alex Valle was just a COACH on a show. There was a time (not too long ago) when coaching from Valle would have been "step your shit up scrub", or "go play on the other machine. You're not built for this".

If you don't think we've already lost a ton of our identity, and people in position of influence aren't DYING to get rid of more of it, you're insane.

One of the MAJOR pillars of the scene was an every-man-for-themselves mantra, and an extremely abrasive stance on newcomers. New guys were cool, as long as they were willing to deal with the harsh nature of the scene. Nobody would help you, unless you showed impressive desire to help yourself first. No special treatment. No coddling. Jump in the ring with the pitbulls, or fuck off if you're scared. That's gone.

To me, that WAS the scene... well, along with racism and sexism that wasn't necessary at all, but even that was kinda cool, in so much as it was REAL. The FGC used to be so organic. So honest. The incredible diversity, obviously gave way to uglier points, but that was seemingly offset by the simple purity of the meritocracy that was our scene. Yeah, you had people saying racist shit... but whether you liked Japanese players or not, when Bas came and beat our ass in Alpha 3, you had to respect it. You could hate Black people, but when Sanford's Sentinel was stomping on your head, you couldn't do shit but appreciate the fact that Black people dance better than you. Sexism was around, but if some girl came around and beat all of our asses, that would have given way to sheer respect as well. Not coming out in favor of bigotry... I AM coming out in favor of honesty though, and harmless fun. VERY few people are in this scene popping off with racist/sexist comments that they are REALLY serious about

But now everything has the cater to that most worthless generation of kids born in the 90's, that had their mothers peel the crust off of their sandwiches until their 21st birthdays. The most sensitive, worthless fucks ever in life. ZERO appreciate for excellence, since they came up in the everyone-gets-a-trophy world, and they've been afforded respect and adulation they never had to earn. I miss the meritocracy. If you won, you earned respect. That still happens, but it used to be the ONLY way. Now, if you come up with a catch phrase, a dance.. or you have some prop to use in a planned victory celebration, you're the shit. If you look like Nick Cage, and make videos saying obvious shit (despite the fact that you don't even compete), you're the shit. Players come up with on-screen personalities... players have become ENTIRELY different people, because of the attention... shit is NOT the same, already. It just isn't.

We sold out so much of ourselves, to make the scene more accessible for the most pussified generation of kids to ever walk the Earth. This is just a fact. We sold out, to attract pussies (that won't turn to winners, ever), to get numbers up, so we could add $1K to the pot. We sold out to get "sponsors" that don't actually give anybody any actual money. This is what we've ALREADY done. Trying to cling to what's left now is silly. It's already gone. Bring on MLG.

Ain't even gonna lie. When I read this, shit was soul crushing. HAV played Wong during MLG, btw.

[Vandole]

wow, that was a salty as fuck post.

[Sho]

He's been in the scene as far back as 1999. Shit was amaze.

[octopus]

That's actually something I don't understand why you have to censor yourself if your have a good product. I remember watching ESPN2 when they used to show Madden tournaments, those players werent saints at all. In fact they were all popoff in-your-face kind of players, the bad kind that you don't want to associate the FGC with now.

[Xno Kappa]

Post is so full of shit lol. Sounds like some old man shit someone in their 70's would say. The scene blowing up has everything to do with SF4 and the internet, not some arbitrary WWE-style attitude era nonsense.

[Maguspk]

Actually a good deal of us know about MLGs exploits with SSBM (I can agree that they did a good job with this game). And other sock in the drawer games like SCIV & T6. And your point? These games were all further driven to the grave with the exception of SSBM, which actually had a great showing. What we also remember is the major fucking up that MLG had with EVO 2005, amongst bracket rigging in 2010 Brawl, and a few other things. To touch on EVO2005, it was something that the FGC & SRK never really forgot about up until this day. If you don't know what happened, they [MLG] pretty much took over the entire event, pushing tons of Halo and other FPS set ups into the space reserved for EVO's fighting games... set ups that weren't even being used. On top of that they took up even more space for their audience and had more venue space for their own crew, most of which was simply not being used at all either. It got so bad, I personally remember seeing people from EVOs side stand up on chairs to boo people playing Halo and other MLG games at the event.

Interesting, even if this wasn't biased and I could believe it as a credible account it would have little to nothing to do with the MLG today, different management.

Also where the fuck are you getting this "we gotta stay grassroots, bro" shit from? Just about everyone here would like to see the FGC blow up to something big just like the MLG. You should probably stop talking out of your ass and actually hang out and read posts on our forums or join in the chats we have. Very few want to see this accomplished via ties or working with MLG, however. It's obvious that they are in it for business, rather than actually taking part in the culture that's come about.

It's literally a direct quote from the article, he mentions it multiple times. The sentiment is shared by nearly everyone who agrees with his post and you used the term yourself in one of your first posts in this thread. Try to keep up.

yet another topic magus has no real idea what he's talking about while we continue to actually know the problems and discuss them. it all boils down to one thing, since MLG has given arturo sanchez the responsibility of the fighting games in MLG, they need to let him run it in the best way he can. but instead MLG is using their obviously favored(extended set and advertisement plans) to do it. it's going to take a very long time for it to get fixed ... if it happens.

hopefully the FGC can bring IPL up to snuff and shut out the FGC's involvement in mlg altogether.

You still haven't read the posts in the thread you linked. MLG has a track record for being trash the first time around they do an event and slowly improving based on audience feedback. This is especially true Sundance has started doing shit.



As for food at MLG, I've eaten food inside at nearly every MLG I've been to, they don't do shit. Obviously they watch you as you come in but nobody says anything once you get it past the doors. At Dallas last year I sat behind LiquidTyler with his wife, watching him play, and ate a huge slice of pizza from a bomb pizzeria a few blocks from the venue that some friends brought back for me.

[Sho]

Interesting, even if this wasn't biased and I could believe it as a credible account it would have little to nothing to do with the MLG today, different management.

It's literally a direct quote from the article, he mentions it multiple times. The sentiment is shared by nearly everyone who agrees with his post and you used the term yourself in one of your first posts in this thread. Try to keep up.

Nah, you read me out of context. We want to blow up while keeping that "grassroots" feel (that's what I mean "via our own grassroots events")... I've been saying this for ages. MLG management sucks [for fighting games]. The best thing they did for that division is adding Sabin, and they still won't let him do what he wants. You should keep up instead. Also, I wouldn't take what that OP said as speaking for everyone. There are people like him who simply believe that MLG is self destructive to the FGC. There are some that feel that MLG can work with the FGC, but on the FGC's terms (basically, pump money into our events while letting us do what we do). Then there's the majority that thinks the FGC can blow up on its own (however, with no one with a plan decent enough to build it up greatly outside of Capcom influence).

MLG has been ass in the past, but I give them props for building up the SC2 community is it was straight ass off top in the beginning. Now, despite it being boring as fuck, is legit. I don't see this happening for their fighting game division, sorry (this even with Sabin added to their roster). The only way I see them making it bigger is by letting Sabin do what he wants to build up the scene, and also by having MORE people go to other events around the country and take ideas from them first hand. Stream Monster input or feed back be damned right to hell.