Dick Cheney Recieves Heart Transplant at 71

**Francisco** · 2012-03-27 21:50

Not sure how they prioritize heart transplants, but my 50-something aunt recently got a transplant...

She's also not evil incarnate, however.

**Sera** · 2012-03-27 21:51

IMO as far as health is concerned, 50 to 70 is a goddamn huge window. A LOT of shit starts to go VERY wrong in that two decade span.

**Kaylia** · 2012-03-28 00:56

Originally Posted by Sera

lol, FORGET WHAT YOU HEARD, THE AMERICAN HEALTH CARE SYSTEM IS THE BEST ONE. WE BE GIVIN ALL OUR YE OLDE GEEZERS NEW HEARTS AND SHIT

What?

Could you please explain the point you're trying to make here.

**Sera** · 2012-03-28 01:05

I'm pretty sure the satire is obvious here.

**Kaylia** · 2012-03-28 01:08

It's not. Mind explaining?

**Sera** · 2012-03-28 01:17

Sorry, I guess it's a joke only us Americans whose health is dependent on how deep our pockets are would understand. My apologies.

**Kaylia** · 2012-03-28 01:24

I was under the impression that you were referencing to a previous argument we had, my apologies. This critic of american health system is understandable, but I thought you had ulterior motives given our history.

**kuronosan** · 2012-03-28 01:41

In other words, a 71-year old man with a history of heart problems should not be at the top of any list for heart transplants. That heart should go to someone who really needs it, is younger, and has a better chance of surviving for the next 15-20 years.

It's not like Cheney is going to turn around and give that heart to someone else when he dies in 5 years.

**Kaylia** · 2012-03-28 02:05

I think everyone agree with this, but this specific problem exists everywhere. Drawing the lines to prevent any undesirable situations like the one we have here is difficult.

Who is going to decide the worth of each individual? How do you decide between an unhealthy 63yo who has been waiting for 1 year, and an unhealthy 64 yo who has been on the list for 2 years? Do you want a doctor to make the call every time?

I'm not saying the rules couldn't be improved, but what matter is who would have got the heart if he wasn't around?

**Cairthenn** · 2012-03-28 02:07

From what I understand, 20 months is a typical wait time for the specific type of transplant he received. I'm not going to say that prioritizing another individual would have been ideal, because it's not my place to value one person's life over another.

**kuronosan** · 2012-03-28 02:18

I can't make the decision to prioritize one person's life over another, but be realistic.

If a 30-year old guy needed a heart transplant and you have a 71-year old man on the waiting list... rationally the 30-year old man deserves it more because he (hopefully) has a longer life left to live. Who knows how much longer he'll actually go? Nobody. It's a real difficult line to draw.

I'm simply saying that Cheney, Jobs, and all of these other people, are only prioritized because of their financial worth. Not because of their character. That alone is horseshit and unfair when there are so many others out there on these lists that could benefit from it more if they even had a fraction of the money rich people throw at hospitals.

edit: Think of it this way. You have two people: one is a 45-year old dying from emphysema because he smoked cigarettes every day and needs a lung transplant to save his life; the other is a 65-year old man who is relatively healthy and has led a good life. Who gets the lungs?

Now you have a 70-year old who has had a history of alcoholism and has destroyed his liver and needs a liver transplant. Is it really fair that he gets the liver because he has money when you have some 50-year old who never drinks and probably needs it more but won't because he's broke and is further down the list? Not to me it isn't.

**Kaylia** · 2012-03-28 02:28

If a 30-year old guy needed a heart transplant and you have a 71-year old man on the waiting list... rationally the 30-year old man deserves it more because he (hopefully) has a longer life left to live. Who knows how much longer he'll actually go? Nobody. It's a real difficult line to draw.

What if that 30 year old guy could easily live another 2 years given his condition, but the 71 years old would die in the next few months?

Age is already considered in the equation as far as I know, but it's not the only factor.

[edit]

edit: Think of it this way. You have two people: one is a 45-year old dying from emphysema because he smoked cigarettes every day and needs a lung transplant to save his life; the other is a 65-year old man who is relatively healthy and has led a good life. Who gets the lungs?

Now you have a 70-year old who has had a history of alcoholism and has destroyed his liver and needs a liver transplant. Is it really fair that he gets the liver because he has money when you have some 50-year old who never drinks and probably needs it more but won't because he's broke and is further down the list? Not to me it isn't.

It would be incredibly hard to consider them in all fairness. It pretty much require someone to make the call on a case by case basis, and I don't think it would be an improvement.

**archibaldcrane** · 2012-03-28 02:42

Dude waited 20 months. That's a long fucking time.

If that's what you get for being rich and evil and all-powerful, I'll pass on being rich, evil, and all-powerful.

Yeah, he had a lot of heart attacks. Know why? Cause his heart was all fucked up. Now he's got a new one. Maybe he'll stop having heart attacks.

**Niiro** · 2012-03-28 02:50

The most common reason the wealthy get organ transplants over others is simply because there's no 1 organ transplant list, there are many spread out across the country.

Whether or not you're on them depends on whether you can feasibly get to a heart/liver/lung/etc in time when one becomes available. If you're a regular person in need of a heart transplant in Arizona and a viable heart comes up in Newark it doesn't matter if you're a perfect match and it'll add 50 years to your life, unless you've got the means to keep your records updated on various transplant lists throughout the country and a way to get to an organ 2500 miles away in a matter of hours it's gonna go to someone who can.

When you have a private staff maintaining your medical records and constantly monitoring donor lists nation wide with a private jet in your backyard you're much more likely to be matched and be able to get the organ and yourself to a hospital capable of performing the surgery in time.

**Sera** · 2012-03-28 04:01

Originally Posted by kuronosan

In other words, a 71-year old man with a history of heart problems should not be at the top of any list for heart transplants. That heart should go to someone who really needs it, is younger, and has a better chance of surviving for the next 15-20 years.

It's not like Cheney is going to turn around and give that heart to someone else when he dies in 5 years.

This This This This This

@Archi-- he should've been waiting longer, meaning never ever ever getting it. With all the young people on that list who could make that heart last more than a mere decade, I find it very difficult to believe that his station had nothing to do with a 71 year old fat filled fucking heart attack magnet getting a perfectly good heart that could've gone to someone younger, with their ENTIRE LIVES ahead of them, and more in need.

Everything Kuro said in BOTH posts.

**Psion** · 2012-03-28 04:57

News like this makes me glad that we're well on our way to just growing new hearts using stem cells from the patient, cultivating them, taking a pig heart and wiping it of its cells to leave the scaffolding behind/making an artificial scaffolding, and seeding it with the stem cells and letting them do their thing.

I think they're doing similar things for the pancreas and other organs too. Dunno how long it will be til it comes out, but considering they already did it for some lady's trachea, i'd say probably several years at most.

**Bregor** · 2012-03-28 10:04

Originally Posted by kuronosan

a 71-year old man with a history of heart problems should not be at the top of any list for heart transplants.

Yeah we should save those donor hearts for people with perfectly healthy hearts.

Wait

**hey** · 2012-03-28 11:11

Originally Posted by kuronosan

I'm simply saying that Cheney, Jobs, and all of these other people, are only prioritized because of their financial worth. Not because of their character. That alone is horseshit and unfair when there are so many others out there on these lists that could benefit from it more if they even had a fraction of the money rich people throw at hospitals.

They don't get priority. What they get is multiple chances. There are a number of different transplant lists for different regions of the country. Someone on a list in new york will not be able to get a heart from california. However, there is nothing stopping you from being on every single list. Except of course, you need to fly around the country and get on them, and then when you finally get one, you need to immediately drop everything and fly across the country to get the surgery. Anyone can do this, but it does require some money.

Cheney may very well have been the youngest person needing a heart on the list that he was picked from. He didn't just go to a hospital, say he needed a heart, and get one the next day. He waited 20 months. I doubt there was any preferential treatment here.

**archibaldcrane** · 2012-03-28 11:38

Let's not forget the whole "donor match" thing. Most hearts are not an option for most prospective donor recipients.

12% of heart transplant recipients are over 65. Cheney is part of that. If you're going to keep harping on special privilege, you're going to need some evidence.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S 4G using Tapatalk

**Drex** · 2012-03-28 12:04

lol I really thought all the death panel alarmism was ridiculous, but with posts calling for someone to just lay down and die because they are old and have a condition, it's a little worrying

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