Feminism Thread

[Ksandra]

I think the technology for artificial incubators shouldn't take too long. We might even see it within our lifetimes. Once that is something available to the masses, i think we'll see gender/sex dynamics change for the better.

completely agree. I do hope we get to see it in our lifetime, too.

[NynJa]

where Priran and Nynja want rape to only be where consent is impossible

Once again, a drunk girl (not under any duress or threat) going "Fuck me, fuck me harder, pull my hair, slap my ass, yeah, fuck me, oh god" while getting plowed sounds pretty consenting to me. Just because the next day she goes "damn he ugly" does not signify rape.

[Niiro]

At what BAC level is someone no longer able to give consent?

[NynJa]

And also, how do you determine that the girl was drunk or not? Is there a magical sobriety test for rape victims, that they dont use for drunk drivers? Because where im from, they can field test a potential drunk driver, and if they fail, they have to do a second one at the station. If they pass that, free to go. Now how much alcohol gets processed in the body overnight?

Niiro post his as i was writing this up!!

[hey]

Your soapboxing about "sex without affirmative consent is always rape" is somewhat undercut by your statement that rape isn't always wrong. Personally, I'd rather draw a line in the sand that preserved "rape is always wrong" rather than "x, y, and z things I don't like are always rape", but that's just me.

Fucking an unconscious girl always rape? Yep. Fucking a girl who's too drunk to stand or form a logically cohesive thought always rape? Sure. But two people who met up after getting tipsy at a bar and have sex are both guilty of mutually raping each other? That's stupid and you're stupid. Rape isn't a tool whose connotations are there for you to commoditize for the sake of seeking women's rights via intellectually dishonest rape statistics.

You don't actually base your morals on the law, do you? They are totally separate things.

[Priran]

At what BAC level is someone no longer able to give consent?

I don't know, but given the choice between "drunk sex is rape if a reasonable person could conclude their partner was too drunk to make a reasonable decision to have sex" or "all drunk sex is rape but sometimes it's OK based on the relationship of the rapist and their victim" I'd rather have ambiguity about whether someone was too drunk for consensual sex over ambiguity of whether rape is bad.

[Priran]

You don't actually base your morals on the law, do you? They are totally separate things.

You're the one basing your definition of rape on the contract law definition of "able to give consent".

[Ksandra]

And also, how do you determine that the girl was drunk or not? Is there a magical sobriety test for rape victims, that they dont use for drunk drivers? Because where im from, they can field test a potential drunk driver, and if they fail, they have to do a second one at the station. If they pass that, free to go. Now how much alcohol gets processed in the body overnight?

Niiro post his as i was writing this up!!

To be fair, archi did say it is really hard to prove this shit. I don't think he is basing his definitions on what is easy to prove in court.

With that said, I am not comfortable either in "all drunk sex is rape" either. I do not rape my husband when we have drunk sex. I am not a rapist.

With that terminolgy you basically make like 90% of married couples rapists and I think that dehumanizes the victims of real rape.

[hey]

You're the one basing your definition of rape on the contract law definition of "able to give consent".

You might have noticed i qualified it with "legally". Legally, it is. But just because something is illegal doesn't mean it's wrong. You should consider the law when deciding to have sex with a drunk girl you met 5 minutes prior. But when deciding if something is right or wrong, the law is irrelevant.

[Priran]

You might have noticed i qualified it with "legally". Legally, it is. But just because something is illegal doesn't mean it's wrong. You should consider the law when deciding to have sex with a drunk girl you met 5 minutes prior. But when deciding if something is right or wrong, the law is irrelevant.

We're discussing "1 in 4 women are raped", a crime statistic.

[BaneTheBrawler]

completely agree. I do hope we get to see it in our lifetime, too.

just as long as ewan mcgregor and scarjo don't end up having to save the day

[Mazmaz]

[archibaldcrane]

We're discussing "1 in 4 women are raped", a crime statistic.

Let's stop doing that.

[archibaldcrane]

To be fair, archi did say it is really hard to prove this shit. I don't think he is basing his definitions on what is easy to prove in court.

With that said, I am not comfortable either in "all drunk sex is rape" either. I do not rape my husband when we have drunk sex. I am not a rapist.

With that terminolgy you basically make like 90% of married couples rapists and I think that dehumanizes the victims of real rape.

Are you saying that you have a sober understanding with your husband regarding what activities you consent to when you're not sober - an understanding that noone would have with a drunk stranger?

[archibaldcrane]

Once again, a drunk girl (not under any duress or threat) going "Fuck me, fuck me harder, pull my hair, slap my ass, yeah, fuck me, oh god" while getting plowed sounds pretty consenting to me. Just because the next day she goes "damn he ugly" does not signify rape.

Have you ever heard of a girl getting a rape conviction with the story "yeah, I was totally into fucking him last night officer, yelling things that could only be considered enthusiastic consent - but you see I was drunk, so I want him in prison!"

or are you making up looney hypotheticals to enhance your delusion of persecution?

[Niiro]

Are you implying that a woman couldn't possibly lie to the police about what she said?

[Kuya]

She could, but that doesn't mean she can prove she was raped.

[Ksandra]

Are you saying that you have a sober understanding with your husband regarding what activities you consent to when you're not sober - an understanding that noone would have with a drunk stranger?

pretty sure I have never said to hubby "hey if we get drunk tonight and we have sex, I won't call the police on you."

and I doubt that would matter in court.

[Niiro]

She could, but that doesn't mean she can prove she was raped.

That's not the point, it was a reply to this:

Once again, a drunk girl (not under any duress or threat) going "Fuck me, fuck me harder, pull my hair, slap my ass, yeah, fuck me, oh god" while getting plowed sounds pretty consenting to me. Just because the next day she goes "damn he ugly" does not signify rape.

To say that because she was drunk it was rape, regardless of what she actually did or didn't say (or did or didn't admit to saying) is the issue.

[NynJa]

Have you ever heard of a girl getting a rape conviction with the story "yeah, I was totally into fucking him last night officer, yelling things that could only be considered enthusiastic consent - but you see I was drunk, so I want him in prison!"

or are you making up looney hypotheticals to enhance your delusion of persecution?

Youre the one sayin drunk sex is rape