Feminism Thread

[Stilzkin]

We're all good with some dude getting his head lopped off or people getting their heads crushed but show one dude sodomizing another dude? Man having an inappropriate (by our standards) relationship with a boy? Everyone loses their minds.

Really? It seems more common for people to joke about men being raped than women.

I think women being raped more in the media has to do with the idea that rape is a women's problem.

[ronin sparthos]

this guy equalizing cocks to tits and then saying that mutilating someone's genitals isn't sexual violence.

I wouldn't equate a rape scene (pretty big taboo) with a scene where some dude gets brutally castrated. Both are violent acts but they don't even approach carrying the same weight. You'll definitely get some 'daaaaaaaayums' from dudes because of the pain associated as we do when some dude gets kneed in the groin.

[BaneTheBrawler]

I mean, a dude literally got his sausage flayed, cooked and served to him on a plate.

no he didn't. theon's dick (his "favorite toy.") gets sent to asha (yara) and balon. the sausage is just a sausage.


ramsay pulled off the ultimate dick in a box move

[ronin sparthos]

Really? It seems more common for people to joke about men being raped than women.

I think women being raped more in the media has to do with the idea that rape is a women's problem.

Because getting raped as a dude is a direct attack on our perceived sense of manliness, or at least our cultural outlook on the topic. Men don't get raped, they do the raping.... but only to women because man on man action is a gigantic taboo. Not that it didn't happen throughout history or anything. Or that rape isn't about sexual gratification but more about dominance and violent control.

[Andalusian girls]

this guy equalizing cocks to tits and then saying that mutilating someone's genitals isn't sexual violence.

the crucial difference being Theon is radically altered by his experience with sexual violence, whereas the rapes of Dany and Cersei, neither of which were in the book despite what revisionists clain, do essentially nothing to change their characters. they behave more or less identically with their book manifestations despite experiencing rape in lieu of fundamentally consensual (if seedy and grey) sex which is very lazy writing, very bad psychology, and, yes, very problematic from a feminist perspective. the Daenerys that falls in love with a man who shows her respect and gentleness for the first time in her life (contrasted with Viserys's cruelty and debasement of her self worth), a man who explicitly asks for her consent before taking her virginity, is very different from the Daenerys that falls in love with a man who strips her, bends her over, and rapes her as she cries.

art or entertainment can explore whatever avenues they desire without worrying about the delicate sensibilities of the audience, as above posters have mentioned while rape is as horrific as crimes get is it truly worse than the sadistic torture and indiscriminate murder we see committed without reaction? where it becomes annoying is when it is used in the above fashion, simply to shock or elicit sympathy, simply to add the basest drama and tension, with neither understanding nor concern for the act and the damage it inflicts on its victims.

[Penthesilea]

I wouldn't equate a rape scene (pretty big taboo) with a scene where some dude gets brutally castrated. Both are violent acts but they don't even approach carrying the same weight.

Theon was sexually assaulted by the two women prior to getting it cut off. (book spoiler

Spoiler: show

Theon is again forced to rape/be raped by "performing" on Jeyne Poole

Melisandre rapes Gendry
Dany rapes Drogo when he's unconscious (unable to consent)
Lyn Corbray is given boys by little finger
Septon Utt rapes little boys (and murders them)

There's plenty of instances of rape and yes, castrating someone is just as bad as raping someone.

[ronin sparthos]

Honestly, I'd have to take your word on the parts that aren't in the TV series because I haven't read the books so I can't really contest anything there. Details that are in the books get increased play in the series and then the series saw fit to just lop out large chunks of the book cause aint nobody got time for whole plot arcs.
*shrug*

[Charismatic]

castrating someone is just as bad as raping someone.

Definitely worse.

[Stilzkin]

Because getting raped as a dude is a direct attack on our perceived sense of manliness, or at least our cultural outlook on the topic. Men don't get raped, they do the raping.... but only to women because man on man action is a gigantic taboo. Not that it didn't happen throughout history or anything. Or that rape isn't about sexual gratification but more about dominance and violent control.

hmm?

I agree that men being raped is perceived differently than women being raped.

I don't agree that when men are raped "Everyone loses their minds".

Like I said, people are perfectly fine with joking about men being raped but women getting raped is rarely considered a joke. A female character can be raped as part of her character arc, this is rarely done for a male character.

[archibaldcrane]

In GoT, women actually have a point to the plot, they matter beyond just characters who are only there to be threatened and assaulted.

That's an important distinction.

[Penthesilea]

Honestly, I'd have to take your word on the parts that aren't in the TV series because I haven't read the books so I can't really contest anything there. Details that are in the books get increased play in the series and then the series saw fit to just lop out large chunks of the book cause aint nobody got time for whole plot arcs.
*shrug*

I'm just trying to point out that there is wanton sex on display for both sexes and that rape happens to both, yet there's less of an emphasis on the male victims.

That said, yeah, the Dany and Cersei scenes are pretty poorly written and don't do the novels any justice.

In GoT, women actually have a point to the plot, they matter beyond just characters who are only there to be threatened and assaulted.

That's an important distinction.

Eh, there's plenty of women as objects and window dressing.

[ronin sparthos]

hmm?

I agree that men being raped is perceived differently than women being raped.

I don't agree that when men are raped "Everyone loses their minds".

Like I said, people are perfectly fine with joking about men being raped but women getting raped is rarely considered a joke. A female character can be raped as part of her character arc, this is rarely done for a male character.

It's a joke because we perceive men as being unable to be raped and our media follows accordingly. We can joke about it but to actually display it? Pretty rare.

It's why I disagree on the weight of a castration versus being sodomized because the former falls under the umbrella of gratuitous violence and elicits imagery of pain and the other is the type of helplessness and complete submission that we typically associate with women getting raped. Both are ways of dehumanizing an individual but we weigh our cultural biases differently on each.

[ronin sparthos]

Can anyone recall from memory a movie where a dude gets sodomized and has to actually live with that as part of the plot? Drawing blanks at the moment.

[Stilzkin]

It's a joke because we perceive men as being unable to be raped and our media follows accordingly. We can joke about it but to actually display it? Pretty rare.

How are you coming to that conclusion?

It's probably not displayed because people still have a problem with anything homosexual. Which probably plays some part in men being raped being a joke. Homosexual behavior in general tends to be joked about but not shown.

[quannum]

are you saying rape is worse than castration?

[Penthesilea]

I'd say in Theon's case he was entirely helpless to the situation. He didn't want nor trust the women's advances.

Gendry was drunk so he couldn't consent.

[Penthesilea]

Can anyone recall from memory a movie where a dude gets sodomized and has to actually live with that as part of the plot? Drawing blanks at the moment.

http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV...3OA@@._V1_.jpg

[archibaldcrane]

Male rape as a joke is usually limited to prison homosexual encounters, and prisoners are easy to dehumanize and mock.

Other than when a woman rapes an incapacitated man (which is exceedingly rarely portrayed in pop culture) it seems the man raped by women is less of a joke and more just never mentioned or considered.

[Penthesilea]

[ronin sparthos]

are you saying rape is worse than castration?

A guy getting gangraped or sodomized by another man is a pretty big taboo whereas being castrated typically falls into gratuitous violence being OK or a man putting up the good fight before getting a painful end. You need only look at the male reaction to a male rape victim to see the reactions on display. It's also why the whole thing is a joke, because we believe men can't be raped - not without the suspicion that said man wanted it.

"That'd never happen to me!"
"Guy must have been a bitch."
"He's probably gay."

You really want to send people for a whirl? Show a woman raping a man. IMPOSSIBLE they say.