Feminism Thread

[Penthesilea]

You really want to send people for a whirl? Show a woman raping a man. IMPOSSIBLE they say.

Who is saying this?

[RKenshin]

Dick horrors =/= Rape. Rape is on the level with having children brutalized and both elicit some pretty spectacular reactions from people considering the taboos surrounding both. In America, you can get away with a startling level of violence but touch either of those two taboos or if you're ballsy - cross them - and you'll get quite the reaction if you aren't outright shut down.

It's why using rape as part of your plot is such a difficult proposition.

You say it so casually, as if having your genitals mutilated is no big deal. I'm pretty sure it would have been a big deal if it was a women getting strung up naked, tortured, mutilated, and turned into a slave.

Do you not see the double standard here?

Just because society views one as a 'sensitive/taboo' issue doesn't mean that the reality of the event is worse.

Regarding the historical perspective: Most people are willing to accept the whole "women were treated pretty badly" portion of it which leads into rape/implied rape that may come off in dialogue but most of the times the writers aren't really keen on shining a light on the reality that boys/men were getting raped too. We're all good with some dude getting his head lopped off or people getting their heads crushed but show one dude sodomizing another dude? Man having an inappropriate (by our standards) relationship with a boy? Everyone loses their minds.

Actually, no, no one loses their minds... or certainly not as much as people do when there's implied rape of a women.

I've seen TV shows do all of the above, and whether it's a man, woman, or child it's always the most controversial when it's a woman or child. Hell half the time I've seen references to a man getting raped its part a joke/portrayed as a joke, or the viewers are meant to think the man deserves it.

no he didn't. theon's dick (his "favorite toy.") gets sent to asha (yara) and balon. the sausage is just a sausage.


ramsay pulled off the ultimate dick in a box move

Details!... but OK fine lol

Because getting raped as a dude is a direct attack on our perceived sense of manliness, or at least our cultural outlook on the topic. Men don't get raped, they do the raping.... but only to women because man on man action is a gigantic taboo. Not that it didn't happen throughout history or anything. Or that rape isn't about sexual gratification but more about dominance and violent control.

Where are you getting this idea that a man getting raped is some big taboo issue? I've never seen any instance of people losing their minds on any kind of it, and again, most of the time it's even viewed as a joke or something the character deserved.

[quannum]

A guy getting gangraped or sodomized by another man is a pretty big taboo whereas being castrated typically falls into gratuitous violence being OK or a man putting up the good fight before getting a painful end. You need only look at the male reaction to a male rape victim to see the reactions on display. It's also why the whole thing is a joke, because we believe men can't be raped - not without the suspicion that said man wanted it.

"That'd never happen to me!"
"Guy must have been a bitch."
"He's probably gay."

You really want to send people for a whirl? Show a woman raping a man. IMPOSSIBLE they say.

i don't see how that answers the question, you've just given more attributes to each event. I hope you're saying gratuitous violence is worse than a big taboo.

[hey]

The term "gamer" in my eyes doesn't necessarily mean someone who is super hardcore at gaming but someone who considers playing video games their primary hobby. She does not.
She also demonstrates that she hardly plays them when she says that she WOULD LIKE to play video games (this implies that she does not) but since they are 'gross' she does not play them.

Not being a fan of something doesn't necessarily preclude you from doing it anyway. I probably wouldn't say i'm a fan of video games either. There are not very many games i enjoy playing anymore. I quite dislike the vast majority of games. Nonetheless, gaming is still a big part of my life. I have met all of my friends through video games, either playing them, or discussing them. I play games almost every day, on rare occasions, all day long, if i'm playing something particularly good. You'd have a hard time arguing i'm not a gamer. And yet, i'm not really a fan of games. I want to play games, and a good game can be really fun, but i don't care for almost any games that currently exist.

[Karbuncle]

I've seen TV shows do all of the above, and whether it's a man, woman, or child it's always the most controversial when it's a woman or child. Hell half the time I've seen references to a man getting raped its part a joke/portrayed as a joke, or the viewers are meant to think the man deserves it.

Like the scene at the end of Ace Ventura 2 where the main baddy gets raped by an Ape! APE RAPE

[ronin sparthos]

Who is saying this?

Society. Every time a male rape is casually the butt of a joke or shuffled away under the file "man up." Children get the pass of being children (priests, sandusky etc.) but grown men? Nope. No such luck. Probably gay though. Yup.

Do you really feel our culture of overt masculinity is at the point where we acknowledge women can rape men and are serious about addressing it? I don't think we're there.

[Qalbert]

Can anyone recall from memory a movie where a dude gets sodomized and has to actually live with that as part of the plot? Drawing blanks at the moment.

Shawshank Redemption and American History X I think

[BaneTheBrawler]

Dolores Umbridge gets raped by a herd of centaurs. Just throwin that out there.

[Cantih]

Deliverance maybe?

[ronin sparthos]

You say it so casually, as if having your genitals mutilated is no big deal. I'm pretty sure it would have been a big deal if it was a women getting strung up naked, tortured, mutilated, and turned into a slave.

Do you not see the double standard here?

It's not casual, don't get me wrong. Violence is violence either way. But a scene of a group of captured soldiers being castrated by an opposing force is not going to be perceived the same way as a group of captured soldiers being brutally raped by their captors. One is a commonly used trope which amounts to 'violence' and the other is a button pushing reaction designed to challenge our societal perceptions of men. Typically, men do not get raped. Every brutal thing imaginable is fair game with men but rape? That's a big fucking deal.

Just because society views one as a 'sensitive/taboo' issue doesn't mean that the reality of the event is worse.

And yet how society internalizes norms directly affects us all. No shit the whole thing is a double standard and that's what feminism attempts to bring into play. Someone being raped should be outrageous either way but here we are in 2014 telling women to cover up and tell men to stop being faggots when they get abused by some asshole. That's reality. That's what needs to change. People tend to internalize their media far more than they're willing to consciously admit so when it pops up in media, it kinda does matter.

Actually, no, no one loses their minds... or certainly not as much as people do when there's implied rape of a women.

Men being raped in our media touches the homosexuality taboo and directly challenges the idea we hold of a man - the invincible creature of legend. It is generally strayed from in your lowest common denominator media altogether. Toss out all the subtle rape references to women you want but a man being raped is certainly the less used trope and being raped by a woman might as well be a fleet of unicorns.

I've seen TV shows do all of the above, and whether it's a man, woman, or child it's always the most controversial when it's a woman or child. Hell half the time I've seen references to a man getting raped its part a joke/portrayed as a joke, or the viewers are meant to think the man deserves it.

I addressed this already. We don't think men can be raped and thus the whole thing is a homo joke that completely ignores the reality that well.. men do get raped. Rape generally is considered a woman thing and is controversial because of its taboo, enshrined status in our culture.

The only thing worse than rape offhand is in any way abusing children.

[Jefe]

Shawshank Redemption and American History X I think

Think again.

[ronin sparthos]

Also thanks dudes offhand for actually giving me some solid responses on my movie/media question.

[archibaldcrane]

Dirty Work

[djzombie]

Can anyone recall from memory a movie where a dude gets sodomized and has to actually live with that as part of the plot? Drawing blanks at the moment.

Pulp Fiction.

[quannum]

salo'

[Xno Kappa]

Theon literally has his cocked chopped off. Fuck off with any rape equivalent to that shit son!

Also, Berserk for the anime audience on your question. I'm pretty sure every single male is brutally butt-fucked at one point or another.

[Jefe]

What if you get castrated and then raped w/ your own cock?

Spoiler: show

:kappa:

[Penthesilea]

Theon literally has his cocked chopped off. Fuck off with any rape equivalent to that shit son!

Also, Berserk for the anime audience on your question. I'm pretty sure every single male is brutally butt-fucked at one point or another.

I just watched the episode two days ago. The two women come in and attempt to seduce him, which he absolutely distrusts and resists. After a lot of persistence, he succumbs and at that point Ramses busts in with his horn. Then theon is held down and it goes from there. There is absolutely a sexual element as well as the power dynamic - he doesn't want them, his body reacts to the stimulus, and Ramses uses that against him. It's absolutely a rape.

[Byrthnoth]

Kind of still do not care about this. It is far too arbitrary and shortsighted to condemn a game for having a single character or scene that you dislike. People and places that you dislike probably also exist in reality, so why ban them from fiction? I want my heroes stronger, villains more vile, and plotlines more violent than anything I will meet in reality.

Most of us played FFXI. There are a wide range of female characters from Shantotto to mithra to Prishe to Nashmiyeahidontcare. They were varying levels of namblypambly and worthless. Occasionally they were motivated stereotypically. Overall SE avoided making any characters remotely attractive.

Was it a sexist game? Separately, could someone like Anita condemn it as sexist?

[BaneTheBrawler]

I just watched the episode two days ago. The two women come in and attempt to seduce him, which he absolutely distrusts and resists. After a lot of persistence, he succumbs and at that point Ramses busts in with his horn. Then theon is held down and it goes from there. There is absolutely a sexual element as well as the power dynamic - he doesn't want them, his body reacts to the stimulus, and Ramses uses that against him. It's absolutely a rape.

i think what he was objecting to is the sentiment that that's "just as bad" as rape. it's considerably worse. it's rape AND several other fucked up things.