Mexicants (immigration)

[Xno Kappa]

The process to become a legal citizen in the U.S is complete and utter bullshit. Now this may be somewhat of a extreme case, but my family started this process when i was in fifth grade. Guess what; im now a junior in college, and our case is still ongoing.

That's weird as hell to be honest. Me and my mom got citizenship relatively quick, I think it only took like a year or two and a dumbass test.

[Salodin]

You're not mexican though, are you.

[BaneTheBrawler]

yeh country of origin makes a big difference. my friend and his parents moved here (from mexico) when he was like 5-7, and he's grown up just as american as the next guy, but he only just recently got his citizenship.

[Xno Kappa]

You're not mexican though, are you.

Hell fucking no.

[Jonny]

My Grand Mother just got hers, and she has been in this country since before i was born(i'm 24).
Both my parents still are Resident Aliens not Citizens and to reapply and get Resident Alien cost about 1grand every couple years.

[samalis]

Is current US immigration policy designed to be easier for people with money? Because that's what it looks like.

Late but posting this flow chart I found a bit ago.

Spoiler: show

[Salodin]

Is it a bad thing if its difficult to become a us citizen? I know its annoying, but I'm genuinely curious what people think.

[BaneTheBrawler]

Well there has to be some degree of difficulty, or else the distinction would be meaningless. I think it's probably too difficult at this point, though.

[mallister]

get a lawyer, don't be a dumbass, fill the paperwork out. a bunch of us just went through this getting our spouses here. best case, took 5 months total from start to finish. took us about a year because of problems with my stepson's birth certificate. worst case of the three couples that did this together took nearly two years, because her husband was an illegal that had been deported once before. shit was expensive and nerve-wracking, to be sure.

if you are an unskilled laborer, how easy do you think it should be to come here? seriously, look around. we have enough unskilled, uneducated folks around to begin with that are already here. not trying to be a dick here, but, come on folks.

[Ksandra]

if you are an unskilled laborer, how easy do you think it should be to come here? seriously, look around. we have enough unskilled, uneducated folks around to begin with that are already here. not trying to be a dick here, but, come on folks.

ya but how many unskilled uneducated americans are willing to work on a farm or do day working for construction?

[Kuya]

Is it a bad thing if its difficult to become a us citizen? I know its annoying, but I'm genuinely curious what people think.

If that's the case, it should not come as a surprise that people don't use the legal channels, and we shouldn't flippantly say they should go through legal channels fully knowing they either might not have a chance or they may take upwards of a decade. Poor people who are looking for work aren't in need of it 10 years down the line. They need it now.

[mallister]

@kasandra: i know plenty of people that did road crew construction back home. it was one of the few things you could count on being able to get a job in, regardless of education. i can't speak with as much personal (anecdotal to be sure) experience with the seasonal farming/chicken ranch experience, but last year didn't we have the same argument when the carolinas ramped up local enforcement of immigration, and the locals stepped up once the farms weren't paying $3 an hour anymore? i'm at work no time to dig sauce but it shouldn't be hard to find.

[ziegh]

If that's the case, it should not come as a surprise that people don't use the legal channels, and we shouldn't flippantly say they should go through legal channels fully knowing they either might not have a chance or they may take upwards of a decade. Poor people who are looking for work aren't in need of it 10 years down the line. They need it now.

My nephew has an U.S. citizen brother living in GA and I told him his brother can get him a Green Card, but we checked online and the normal processing time was 11 years+ so my nephew was like, fuck this!

Something I've seen from acquaintances is to fly the wife to the US when they are ready to give birth so the baby obtains US citizenship right away. Seen it done quite often and I know one guy who does not speak a word of English and is an U.S. citizen.

Also if you are smart. Isn't there some genius immigration law or something?

Yes and no, there's an O Visa which is reserved for smart people, roughly Noble Prize winners/nominees type of smart. It's a non-immigrant temporary visa renewable indefinitely so I guess you could call it immigrating if said person renews it every time till he dies without issue or marries an U.S. citizen and get a Green Card.

Can some of our European members enlighten us on the realities of immigration in their home nations? I wonder how much harder it is to get into the US compared to their counties.

A little too broad to explain here. Canada (while not European, it is the immigration system I am most familiar with) has about 65 procedures for obtaining Permanent Residency so imagine explaining EU countries. I'll give it a shot without going into the family categories. All these are getting through a profession or trade.

Spoiler: show

Canada - They have a Skilled Immigrant program which seeks to fill in the gaps in certain professions, then they score you (67 /100 to pass) and give you permanent residency if you meet all the other criteria (this is one of many ways). After becoming PR you need to reside for 3 out of the last 4 years before submitting your application for citizenship to obtain citizenship. So, technically 3 years after becoming PR and it takes roughly 18 months for the process to finish. I did the whole process myself on my own by reading forums, you cannot do this with the US system, a lawyer is actually needed.

Spain - I believe you have to reside 10 years legally before obtaining citizenship and give up your previous one (except if you come from a former colony). Only two if you come from a former colony (e.g., Latin America). I do not remember if being a PR (Permanent Resident) matters.

UK - You obtain a Right to Abode (I think that's what they call the PR) and have to be one for about 5 years before applying to get citizenship. I may be on the wrong here. They do have an open immigration similar to Canada.

France - I do not remember the specifics but I think you have to reside for 5 years before citizenship. I remember it was very protective of their workforce so not entirely easy to get in.

Germany - They do not offer PR based on need of special skills. You need to be sponsored by an employer, period.

Australia - Point system like Canada.

In immigration forums, most people seem to think Canada and Australia are the countries most open to immigration but that may be changing now.

Last I remember from looking at the US, if you are a Farsi translator, you can apply for a Green Card, that is pretty much the only skill in demand I've seen that USCIS has acknowledged in need of but this was a while ago, I don't think it has changed much since then. Do not confuse this with obtaining a H1B visa, that is a whole other ballpark.

[Kuya]

So wait, if i go to Spain it only takes me two years to become a citizen, and i get to keep my previous citizenship? Hmm

edit: would consider it if only the employment rate there weren't so awful

[ziegh]

Not sure the situation with Puerto Rico, you would need to lose US citizenship, that much is sure. What I found: http://noticias.juridicas.com/base_d...o/cc.l1t1.html

Articulo 22:
1. Para la concesión de la nacionalidad por residencia se requiere que ésta haya durado diez años. Serán suficientes cinco años para los que hayan obtenido la condición de refugiado y dos años cuando se trate de nacionales de origen de países iberoamericanos, Andorra, Filipinas, Guinea Ecuatorial o Portugal o de sefardíes.

[Dizzy's]

I am spanish and arabic. I was born in mexico and have been in the U.S since i was about two and a half years old. So i grew up in the United States. We have also had the same lawyer for the past 10 years. At the time that my mom got here she had her psycology degree.

[myreality]

ya but how many unskilled uneducated americans are willing to be horribly exploited on a farm or do day working for construction?

Fixed.

I have a buddy in construction who tells me all kinds of stories about how the illegal immigrants might as well be slave laborers with how they are treated/abused. Why have Americans working for minimum wage/require insurance and who can complain to the BBB, when you can have illegal immigrants work next to nothing and threaten them with deportation, if they get injured on the job, their fucked. I see/hear about it all the time it is horrible. Watched a man fall off of a single story roof, hurt his leg than was fired (In his defense it rained the previous day). Thankfully though Arizona passed a law that punishes businesses for hiring illegals so it has become less frequent.

The problem is the Businesses that are unwilling to follow regulations. But that will drive up the cost of food products and construction costs, so people usually turn a blind eye to it when they find out their pockets will be affected. And use silly arguments to justify their thinking.

[Salodin]

Stop messing with the free market

[Melena]

Hell it's not just farms that revel in illegal immigrants. Fast food restaurants, especially in states with a large mexican population like California and Arizona have a ton of undocumented workers. They get fake socials and companies are not allowed to question social security or green cards and such so they hire them on. A McDonalds I worked at had the same guy deported 3 times over the course of a year, every time he came back new name and social and hired him back. Everyone knew he was illegal but really nothing they could or wanted to do about it. Whose going to say no to a person willing to work minimum wage and never complain about working conditions?

[Azull]

They get fake socials and companies are not allowed to question social security or green cards and such so they hire them on.

The employer is responsible to make sure the person is eligible to work on the US. That would mean verifying their social, work ID number, perm res card, or whatever. Most employers just dont bother, especially those who pay low wages and have high turnaround like the types you listed.