07/23/2012 Update- Dat Mining Discussion

[Byrthnoth]

Yeah, or using Iridescence with Voidstorm outside. Still, it's a 1 minute recast spell that varies by 50%. You could cast it quite a few times over quite a long time without seeing a low proc.

[Ophannus]

Like 95% sure there was an update between 2004-2006 that gave "Aspir/Drain are now greatly enhanced by weather and day"

[Ophannus]

Nvm I guess I goofed. I was referring to this 2003 patch I remember reading back in the day and I guess I misinterpreted it.

The amount of HP/MP absorbed from an enemy using the black magic spell "Drain" and "Aspir" will be adjusted. The ef‚†ectiveness of the spell will now also be influenced by the day, the weather, and its use during magic bursts.

[Slycer]

Just day was 10% boost. Just day +af2 15%. Day + weather was 30%. Day + weather with af2 pants 35%. Day + double weather 40%. Day + double weather + af2 pants 40%. Day + double weather + af2 pants no staff 40%

The effects stack additively - isn't day + double weather supposed to be 35%, day + single weather 20%? Are you sure you got 40%/30% for those results? Plus, I thought this whole term capped at 35%. Or did you do this entire test while using Chatoyant/obi?

[dasva]

The effects stack additively - isn't day + double weather supposed to be 35%, day + single weather 20%? Are you sure you got 40%/30% for those results? Plus, I thought this whole term capped at 35%. Or did you do this entire test while using Chatoyant/obi?

Yeah that's what I meant this with chat except the last part where I said no staff. Sorry didn't say with staff each time. And yes I had obi but wasn't needed since using helixes. Also yes very sure about the percentages they were all within 1% of what I said plus I then went to nyzle area during water day to retest this time with lots of int/mab so less rounding errors and got same thing plus was testing twilight.

And yes I think we all thought it capped at 35% which was why it took me so long testing since it made 0 sense that double weather + day + chatoyant would give me 40%. It should've either been 35% "cap" or 45% if it went past the cap... that's why I had to come back on blm to use af2 pants. My guess is either it was always 40% or they raised it without saying anything to 40% and no one retested it since it only effected af2 pants during double weather +day. And when twilight back came out and that got you 40% people just assumed that meant it went past the cap.

[Slycer]

Ok, that makes complete sense then if the cap is indeed 40% and not 35%. Maybe it was never 35% and someone just didn't really test it properly? A while back, the only way to test 35% cap was double weather + day + Sorc pants, so I can't imagine there was a prolific amount of testing on that.

Random curiosity - if both weather and day match, and you use Obi or helix, does Twilight Cape add 5% to each bonus, so 10% total?

[dasva]

Yeah that could be I guess we shall never know. Plus we didn't have helixes so instead of being able to compare spells that have the same dmg except weather/day so probably just calculated expected dmg and small errors in unknown mob ints could've thrown things off

As far as double cape I thought it was an or but honestly despite seeing old assumptions proven wrong I never thought to test if that was wrong too lol. I just installed test server stuff so it's updating but if no one else gets to it by then I'll check that out. Should be really quick since only need single weather

[Cymmina]

Might be easiest to test using cures if you have the light obi. The Temenos lobby should have permanent double light weather. Step outside and use Aurorastorm (SCH main only) to test single weather. Twilight Cape and Zodiac Ring work with cures, but Sorcerer's Tonban doesn't.

[nivlakian]

The tests regarding 35% cap in triple element conditions was done by Suiram long ago in BCD as there is often double ice weather there, but need to wait for the right day. An analysis of his data was placed on my talk page on otherwiki (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Us...#Weather_Tests). The link I had to the screenshot no longer seems to work though. In any case, when he tried obi with and without pants while maintaining the same amount of INT, the damage did not change on his target.

[dasva]

Hmmm you know about when that was done?

Also no twilght doesn't get double bonus for day + weather. Don't have zodiac to play with that

[nivlakian]

Hmmm you know about when that was done?

Also no twilght doesn't get double bonus for day + weather. Don't have zodiac to play with that

Based on edits to my page, it should be around Oct. 2006.

[Vxsote]

Based on edits to my page, it should be around Oct. 2006.

I personally replicated the testing back then to confirm the results, and made an entry on the talk page right under Suiram's. Suiram posted on 1 March 2007, and I commented about my results on 3 July 2007.

And it looks like I found the alla post where I put up actual numbers:
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.htm...00&h=50&p=2#67

[dasva]

So it's been ninja changed... wonder if SE is even aware they changed it lol

[Vxsote]

So it's been ninja changed... wonder if SE is even aware they changed it lol

I just returned to the scene of my original crime (testing). Held INT at 118, MAB at wtfever we have now standing naked with ice merits. nuked bliz III on iceday, double weather, single tiger:
no gear, no proc: 642
obi (full proc): 865
obi, relic pants: 898
obi, relic pants, and twilight cape: 898
obi, twilight cape: 898

Unfortunately, I gave my chatoyant back to the person I made it for, so I wasn't able to add that into the mix - but I'm happy to accept dasva's results above. Also, I never bothered to test the cape personally, or to retest the cap after reports that the cape bypassed the cap.

Anyhow, I concur - the DWB cap is now 40%, and it was ninja changed indeed.

[dasva]

Further update on the fish pet. Using the molting burst method I got 25% slow from intimidate (75 sec recast on rr). The one time I did it it lasted 9 minutes... also idk if people noticed but it's AOE

[Buffy]

I just returned to the scene of my original crime (testing). Held INT at 118, MAB at wtfever we have now standing naked with ice merits. nuked bliz III on iceday, double weather, single tiger:
no gear, no proc: 642
obi (full proc): 865
obi, relic pants: 898
obi, relic pants, and twilight cape: 898
obi, twilight cape: 898

Unfortunately, I gave my chatoyant back to the person I made it for, so I wasn't able to add that into the mix - but I'm happy to accept dasva's results above. Also, I never bothered to test the cape personally, or to retest the cap after reports that the cape bypassed the cap.

Anyhow, I concur - the DWB cap is now 40%, and it was ninja changed indeed.

So, based on this 40% number, what is ideal gear set up for MAB damage then on blm? I think my spellcast is going to be badly out of date when I go check.

[Cymmina]

So, based on this 40% number, what is ideal gear set up for MAB damage then on blm? I think my spellcast is going to be badly out of date when I go check.

Chaty staff is going to be inferior to Magians no matter what. If you're going to use it, drop the enhances day/weather gear in this order: Zodiac Ring (Not sure if this edges out the rings that were added with the 95 or 99 caps), Sorcerer's Tonban, Twilight Cape. You won't have to worry about dropping gear if you're using a mix of Chaty and Magian staves until you start looking at day + weather combinations.

Day Only: (1.23)
Magian
Twilight Cape
Zodiac Ring
Sorcerer's Tonban

Weather or Weatherx2 only: (1.15 or 1.3)
Magian
Twilight Cape

Day + Weather: (1.33)
Magian
Twilight Cape
Zodiac Ring
Sorcerer's Tonban

Day + Weatherx2: (1.4)
Magian
Twilight Cape

[Buffy]

Chaty staff is going to be inferior to Magians no matter what. If you're going to use it, drop the enhances day/weather gear in this order: Zodiac Ring (Not sure if this edges out the rings that were added with the 95 or 99 caps), Sorcerer's Tonban, Twilight Cape. You won't have to worry about dropping gear if you're using a mix of Chaty and Magian staves until you start looking at day + weather combinations.

Day Only: (1.23)
Magian
Twilight Cape
Zodiac Ring
Sorcerer's Tonban

Weather or Weatherx2 only: (1.15 or 1.3)
Magian
Twilight Cape

Day + Weather: (1.33)
Magian
Twilight Cape
Zodiac Ring
Sorcerer's Tonban

Day + Weatherx2: (1.4)
Magian
Twilight Cape

Ok, so I'm ignoring the new staff for nukes, which makes sense, I expected magians to be better.

Am I using Obis no matter what?

So day only, to get max day bonus with no weather, I would use:
Ring (3%),
Cape (5%),
Obi (10%),
AF2 pants (5%)?
That would be +23% from gear for day bonus?

Day + Weather bonus is:
Ring (3%),
Cape (10%),
Obi (20%),
AF2 Pants (5%)?
That would be 38% from gear for day + weather?

Weather only:
Cape (5%)
Obi (10%)?
So that's 15% for single weather, but no day?

Weather x2 only
Cape (5%),
Obi (25%)?
So that's 30% for double weather, no day?

Day + Double Weather:
Cape (10%),
Obi (35%)?
That's 40% (because of cap) for Day + Double Weather?

Do I understand that properly?

[Cymmina]

Except for the part where you count Twilight Cape as being 10% instead of 5%, yes. You need obis for everything but helix spells.

[Buffy]

Except for the part where you count Twilight Cape as being 10% instead of 5%, yes. You need obis for everything but helix spells.

Isn't cape 5% day and 5% weather? 10% when both match?