Dev Tracker: Discussion (Old)

[Economizer]

Once again, you really have no fucking right to discuss this topic, because like you said, YOU DONT HAVE ANY.

No, no. This is like pretending that intelligence or empathy doesn't exist. We all have the potential to discuss and understand this topic, one person not getting this and simply not happening to have the items doesn't mean that you suddenly have to have a relic to have a brain.

[Dotsudoku]

I feel like that ceases to apply when one admits that their biases are probably steering the ship in their arguments

[Obsidian]

So, after keeping RM's relevant throughout abyssea, and them RME's through voidwatch via magians...they just say "too bad,all that gil you spent and time you invested is for nothing".



Once again, you really have no fucking right to discuss this topic, because like you said, YOU DONT HAVE ANY.

I guess I need to play BLM to tell you what gear to nuke in, right? I'm perfectly capable of using my eyes, my ears, and my brain to form an opinion of something, and you have no right to tell me I cannot voice it. I've yet to see you contribute anything other than vitriol to this discussion, so if you don't like what I have to say, please attempt to articulate why instead of calling me handicapped, because honestly, it neither bothers me nor does it put you in a particularly flattering light. Try using your brain, and your eyes, instead of just your mouth.

So, after keeping RM's relevant throughout abyssea, and them RME's through voidwatch via magians...they just say "too bad,all that gil you spent and time you invested is for nothing".

Relics and Mythics weren't (and still aren't, because none of them crit) relevant in Abyssea. It wasn't until Tanaka came back and fiddled with everything that trials were added to them. Half the content that was introduced between Abyssea and Adoulin was done with the express purpose of keeping people subscribed by sprinkling in upgrade items for RMEs (marrows, plates, cinders and riftdross). Now Matsui is in control again, and it's not inconceivable that he took a lot at what Tanaka left him - a bunch of completely unbalanced weapons that serve as the base line of effectiveness - and thought to himself, "gosh, balancing all this crap against itself is going to be hard enough, never mind against the content we have planned," and decided the better plan would be to introduce a bunch of stuff to serve as the new baseline for effectiveness (Naakual weapons) in an environment he has control over, so that he can move forward with a set of variables that he understands.

Time and money invalidated? Hardly. The entire time you've been working on whatever RME you possess, it's been the best (or very nearly) weapon available to you; some of them for the better part of a decade. All the time you spent using said RME is not somehow erased when something comes along to replace it.

I would like to think that reason would be responded to with reason, but the Habs lost, so I won't hold my breath.

Edit: What bias? I don't have a relic so I must hate them? Nope. I simply think that if you're going to do something to RMEs, it should apply in some capacity to all of them, because "completing" them (Afterglows don't count, apparently, because if they did it wouldn't be fair? But then would the "invalidation of effort" argument not apply to Afterglows? No? How convenient) is going to become more and more difficult as people move away from that content.

[Dotsudoku]

I don't think you're going to get many more serious responses while arguing from the position that 85 Empyreans should have gotten a boost comparable to 99 ones

And seriously, enough with the afterglow nonsense. You're apparently the only person who plays this game that didn't understand that afterglow was an aesthetic accomplishment for people with really bizarre priorities

[NynJa]

I guess I need to play BLM to tell you what gear to nuke in, right? I'm perfectly capable of using my eyes, my ears, and my brain to form an opinion of something, and you have no right to tell me I cannot voice it. I've yet to see you contribute anything other than vitriol to this discussion, so if you don't like what I have to say, please attempt to articulate why instead of calling me handicapped, because honestly, it neither bothers me nor does it put you in a particularly flattering light. Try using your brain, and your eyes, instead of just your mouth.

The fact that since you DONT have any relic or mythics, and your emp is stuck at 90...your opinion is completely and blindly bias to the fact you've devoted nothing but maybe 100 hours tops per empyrean weapon, whereas those with relics, mythics and 99 emps and devoted much much more, in both time, and gil to their weapons.

Its like asking the opinion of free Canadian Health Care to an American...NO!

Relics and Mythics weren't (and still aren't, because none of them crit) relevant in Abyssea. It wasn't until Tanaka came back and fiddled with everything that trials were added to them.

Your timeline is really fucking off. The trials were added at the same time as 80 cap. They were created before Tanaka left, or during Matsui's first run.

As a likely child of Tanaka, I'd look at it as a step by step removal of his legacy.

That explains Neo-Salv/Dyna how exactly?

[Obsidian]

I don't think you're going to many more serious responses while arguing from the position that 85 Empyreans should have gotten a boost comparable to 99 ones

If you can point out where I said that, please do. What I've said the whole time is that they ought to be given something as well. Nowhere have I said or implied that and 85 and a 99 both should just get bumped to 600 damage and call it a day.

But that's cool. If no one wants to have an actual conversation about it you can just keep calling me stupid and circlejerk about how screwed you are now because your RME has been relegated to town gear. It's no skin off my back.

The fact that since you DONT have any relic or mythics, and your emp is stuck at 90...your opinion is completely and blindly bias to the fact you've devoted nothing but maybe 100 hours tops per empyrean weapon, whereas those with relics, mythics and 99 emps and devoted much much more, in both time, and gil to their weapons.

Yeah, I'm blindly biased because I don't have one, but no one with an RME 99 is biased in the other direction?

Its like asking the opinion of free Canadian Health Care to an American...NO!

I have no idea what this even means. To add something completely unrelated in kind, that Gryba hit was clean.

Your timeline is really fucking off. The trials were added at the same time as 80 cap. They were created before Tanaka left, or during Matsui's first run.

No they weren't.

If this is going to devolve into people picking out one sentence from three paragraphs and issuing a canned response, I'm out.

[Prothescar]

My biggest issue is that you clearly have no fucking idea what you're talking about despite trying to make a convincing argument. Case in point: comparing making an 85/90 emp to making an afterglow and asking why one should be considered more of an accomplishment than the other.

[arus2001]

That explains Neo-Salv/Dyna how exactly?

Same reason 1.0 XIV got updates despite ARR's development: People needed shit to do, otherwise they'd leave. Enter a low-budget solution where assets are already developed.

My biggest issue is that you clearly have no fucking idea what you're talking about despite trying to make a convincing argument. Case in point: comparing making an 85/90 emp to making an afterglow and asking why one should be considered more of an accomplishment than the other.

I feel like things got lost at some point in the debate. Like if someone did the HMP phase, people are all still, "FUCK YOU, IT'S NOT 99!" with the assumption getting 99 would be the same experience as other wielders held at the peak of content. This is also where new sources or even cost adjustments would need to be entertained if it truly did become 99 or bust. A number of people seem to farm marrows to more quickly buy their way into RMEs, but once these new weapons trickle in, wouldn't it be a fair assessment that marrow costs would drop with ADL easier to kill? Straight farming the Mythic or Empyrean components is still shitty as ever even if the mobs die a couple minutes faster.

[Dotsudoku]

Nowhere have I said or implied that and 85 and a 99 both should just get bumped to 600 damage and call it a day.

You don't seem to understand what "relative" and "comparable" mean

I don't think you're suggesting that 85 and 90's should get slapped an identical +100 damage, but suggesting that they should be raised to scale is similarly stupid

...but no one with an RME 99 is biased in the other direction?

also, mythic owner suggesting that they should just let RME die, so no, bias has nothing to do with my pointing out how dumb your suggestion is

[NynJa]

No [relic trials] weren't [added when trial of magians was created]

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Da...?oldid=1098802
Revision as of 22:32, March 26, 2010 by Dragonspight (Talk | contribs)

Scroll down to the bottom, you can see the relic trials there, with their fucking stupid 1500 use / 2000 killshot counts.


https://www.bg-wiki.com/bg/Version_Update_(03/22/2010)
"New in-game content "Trial of the Magians" has been added."
NEW...ADDED

go away.


I was slightly wrong in my assumption that ToM was added at the same time as visions of abyssea...ToM was added slightly before abyssea. You're MORE wrong however in saying that the ToM relic trials were added after abyssea.

[Prothescar]

I feel like things got lost at some point in the debate. Like if someone did the HMP phase, people are all still, "FUCK YOU, IT'S NOT 99!" with the assumption getting 99 would be the same experience as other wielders held at the peak of content. This is also where new sources or even cost adjustments would need to be entertained if it truly did become 99 or bust.

I do not believe that an incomplete weapon should be considered complete, and therefor it should not receive a completed weapon's bonuses/extra trials/extra quests/whatever. If you want to finish upgrading your weapon, you should finish upgrading your weapon. The cost of a 99 emp and 99 relic is far more comparable than a 90 emp and any 99 weapon. Mythics are on a whole 'nother level, but they're going down in price slowly.


My only 99 weapon is my Amano. I expect that the only weapon I'll get any post-99 benefit from will be my amano. If I want my other weapons to get that benefit, I'll muster the resources to 99 them.

[chichicha]

after reading Matsui' post about adjusting the Delve system.

I just felt like I want to quit this game... Not that I am negative thinking. It's just that they seems to do things pretty much useless and/or no reason. Anti-Congestion?
Never seen one happened in JPN prime or NA prime...

p.s. When talking to friends about this, I get clearer picture why I am upset. lolz
This adjustment doesn't really PUG friendly, while Fracture - obviously needed some farming on Bead to get higher chances to beat mega boss in it. If NMs in open area reduce time and etc, which means many PUG will fail, until ppl went thru a long time to get their gears/ weapons upgraded.
Me, myself, have been living in PUG for a while now, since more on casual playing then "harcore gaming". i.e. I felt that if Matsui is expecting me to play hardcore, spend a lenghty time to obtain whatever to get to where I want to be, seems unrealistic to me.

[NynJa]

Most fights are taking 1-4 hours because theres no hints to how the fights work, or even if a weakness was triggered...but they worry about congestion.

Is displaying a !! when a weakness is hit, or placing an aura around the mob indicating theres an action that needs to be done to induce a weakness really game breaking?

[NynJa]

QUACK QUACK

This isnt the nhl thread...

[Fake]

To all the people saying this update is making you quit, just fucking quit and shut up. These attention whoring posts will be better recieved on the official forums where SE might actually see since its now apparent there are like 4 people working on FFXI and only 1 of them knows what code is.

We're not even a week in since the update, everything except nakuuls has been taken down (either by the intended methods or grinded). There are PUG friendly means of working towards items (fodder mobs in delve) and its easy to form your own pickup groups to grind down the specific NMs once to get your KIs. Expect this to get easier over the next few weeks as every gimmick (the lead delve dev specifically said there are ways affect mobs eva/PDT etc) is figured out.

[Kincard]

I'd go and post on the official forums if they thought that allowing their recent unsuscribers to tell them why they unsuscribed is a good idea

and given what they've been doing over the past week it seems like even if you do they're usually not interested in hearing it

not that I mind since plenty of other people are doing the work for me

[noodles355]

2) Mythic have by and large always been useless

Mura, Ryu, KKK and lib have been the best DD option, Conqurer is top dog too. Yagrush is irreplaceable, nirvana was amazing until skirmish, as was blm mythic (for meteor). Glanz is still a great weapon. Carnwenhan is great for BRD with the song duration. Hell, if i was being pedantic I would argue for Thf mythic which against high lvl, high def targetsis the best in slot. Also Terpsi ranks up thereI think (byrth?). So that's...12? hardly the minority...

[Jem]

What gets me is that people are fixating on the one perceived negative of this update. So many are seemingly overlooking that everything else they did this update is pretty much a mish-mash of suggestions players have made over the years.

[Ligray]

Fairly recent 4Gamer interview, I wonder if there's anything new in it, Slycer?

[ccl]

What jem said!

Between being able to buy drop with point(and thus no more 0/156156), hard fight, new goal and some even awesomer item that seems to be directed at top tier group only atm I'm really enjoying this update.
Also at least new nms/naakual aren't doable by solo bst so unless there are some gimmick to them not everyone will have those Naakual weapon and I can feel awesome again having stuff not every bst solo can!