Dev Tracker: Discussion (Old)

[Vyvian]

The rage timer has already ceased to do what it was originally meant to do. Originally rage timers were put there so that people taking to long would take a loss by default because the monster would start one-shotting everyone in range. It made some amount of sense because after the monster went idle and unraged some other group could claim the monster. It's dumb that now rage timer just means "Hold it with Ochain while people chip its HP for 3 hours". I don't even know why they put rage timers on the damn things to begin with instead of making it confrontation NM with a 20-30min timer like so many other things they do.

I don't think the "rage" was intended to be an auto-wipe, I think it was more of a "if you're not even close it will take forever to do this so give up now", but still allowed you to clear it if you were a little slow (25 min instead of 20 for example). The hour kill on peiste I referenced earlier was 2 aegis plds, so it definitely doesn't require ochain to hold through rage. A similarly long gnat kill (took a while to figure out more debuffs trips Emetic more often), was done with Aegis plds, and while it started trucking (Triple Attacks with 300+ crits if bad luck alligned), it wasn't uncureable with good PLDs and healers.

When presented with a time constraint, and a challenge that is difficult to reach in that time constraint, the community response is to zerg, perhaps they were trying to avoid that. I kinda liked that a couple well geared PLD's and a couple well geared healers can hold the fight together while you chip away at something as an option. I'd rather they have created more pops to reduce congestion, but they claimed the pops would be unequal if they did that..

[Vyvian]

Without relying on 2 brd's doing a SV rotation and cor buffs and PD...basically strategies that DONT involve "mindless zerg", on average whats the mob HP at before it starts to rage?

We fought raptor with 1 brd (3 songs), dd/thf pt, 1 cor, 5 smn, 2 pld and the rest random mage jobs (rdm sch etc), no 1hrs. It was around 15% when 20 minutes had passed. I think that is the intended entry tier. Fighting T4s and taking an hour wasn't what they wanted us to do.

[NynJa]

We fought raptor with 1 brd (3 songs), dd/thf pt, 1 cor, 5 smn, 2 pld and the rest random mage jobs (rdm sch etc), no 1hrs. It was around 15% when 20 minutes had passed. I think that is the intended entry tier. Fighting T4s and taking an hour wasn't what they wanted us to do.

Raptor has also been noted to be one of the easiest ones though.
How about something like the Uragunite? Twitherym? Moth (how long will it take to get it to Exuviation 20 times)? Craklaw?

[dasva]

Well then if they didn't want us to take that long they should'nt have opened it up to the majority of the player base which can't kill it faster lol. Would've been easy to tie it to hard progression like limbus

[dasva]

I've seriously given up even trying to do NMs with my LS. We have to shout for half the alliance because most of the LS ragequit over update.

The level of stupidity with Siren's PUG's can only be shown through this:
>>>Leader: "Ok, so no one WS on the Chapuli. Ok?"
>>>COR: "...so can I use Wildfire?"

I can't even.

Last night for the like 4th farming run in the last couple of days someone pulled and nm and at least 4 people tried to fight it despite being told multiple times no nms and each pull resulting in lots of rage. And peoples excuse for attacking? Well I saw it coming for someone or saw someone else do it

[Vyvian]

Raptor has also been noted to be one of the easiest ones though.
How about something like the Uragunite? Twitherym? Moth (how long will it take to get it to Exuviation 20 times)? Craklaw?

I cleared cracklaw with a pug group inside the fracture and didn't find it terribly difficult to clear, although it did take 30 minutes. That option is still available even after the update. I imagine if we did it as a LS (its scheduled to happen today), we can do it faster than the PUG did. Twitherym took the LS 20 minutes when we switched to a melee setup with lots of acc buffs, and 2 mages to nuke. There was a weird damage resistance thing at 49 and 24 but it was only temporary and we were able to continue. Wamoura is a T5, and considered not entry-level content.

The beauty of the system is that you can pick the easy mobs of the 1-3, and just buy the crappy mob's drops until everyone is geared to that tier, then the fight should be significantly faster.

[ccl]

I think most people really overestimate those mob difficulty, like the peiste seems ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE w/o the gimmick in 10 min, with blind, only 4-5 dd, 4 song brd( no rotation cause we lazy as fuck), no cor, a lot of mule doing nothing (getting KI for friends/mule while farming bead) it died under 10min.

Same thing for most NMs we found weakness, if it's too hard for half decent PUG, it mean the gimmick isn't totally figured.

[dasva]

Except aren't they killing farming of plasm with the walls not coming down? Hard to farm then. And the t1 buyables aren't so great as to take you to the next step. T2 weapons sure but not the small increases from the armor/accessories

Think people are over estimating how many empyrean brds aren't already lsd up same with competent dds and cors

[Carraway]

Except aren't they killing farming of plasm with the walls not coming down? Hard to farm then. And the t1 buyables aren't so great as to take you to the next step. T2 weapons sure but not the small increases from the armor/accessories

Think people are over estimating how many empyrean brds aren't already lsd up same with competent dds and cors

According to Slycer's translations, only the boss wall is going to stay up (the one that drops with 10 minutes remaining, allowing access to the naakual). Only the best plasm-farming groups are going to take a hit and it's going to be minor.

[Obsidian]

If you read Slycer's translation, it makes no mention of anything other than the boss being inaccessible without the NMs being defeated.

[dasva]

According to Slycer's translations, only the boss wall is going to stay up (the one that drops with 10 minutes remaining, allowing access to the naakual). Only the best plasm-farming groups are going to take a hit and it's going to be minor.

Idk even the most noobish of plasm faming groups can farm in there better than the slow repops of other rooms. Though yeah only 10 min worth

[Chamaan]

I think most people really overestimate those mob difficulty, like the peiste seems ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE w/o the gimmick in 10 min, with blind, only 4-5 dd, 4 song brd( no rotation cause we lazy as fuck), no cor, a lot of mule doing nothing (getting KI for friends/mule while farming bead) it died under 10min.

Same thing for most NMs we found weakness, if it's too hard for half decent PUG, it mean the gimmick isn't totally figured.

You're supposed to blind him?

[Jem]

Except aren't they killing farming of plasm with the walls not coming down? Hard to farm then. And the t1 buyables aren't so great as to take you to the next step. T2 weapons sure but not the small increases from the armor/accessories

Think people are over estimating how many empyrean brds aren't already lsd up same with competent dds and cors

Just because people have LS'es don't mean they don't do PUGs though. The vast, vast majority of people I do LS events with do plenty of PUGs too.

It's not uncommon for me to join a random PUG shout and find 3, 4, 5, 6+ people already in the shout from my LS'es or statics. And it's not like they go 'Hey Jem! Come do this with us!', it is purely just sending a tell to random shouters needing people.

[Jem]

You're supposed to blind him?

Yes. If you blind him he loses his ridiculous evasion meaning he goes down like a sack of shit unless he gets Calcifying Mist off. Calcifying Mist is horrible for melees because even with Marches + Haste + Hasso/LR + Gear haste, it feels like you're swinging weakened as the timer drops down. If you can resist it with barspells/carols/Rune Fencer buffs then it would be even more of a joke otherwise you could revert to RNG's and tear him apart.

There were points where we'd be dropping 20% chunks off his HP in like 30-45 seconds and then he would mist us.

EDIT: You do need decent skill / accuracy to land blind though.

[Fake]

Raptor has also been noted to be one of the easiest ones though.
How about something like the Uragunite? Twitherym? Moth (how long will it take to get it to Exuviation 20 times)? Craklaw?

Moth will only use Exuviation if it has 2+ debuffs on, you can make it remove all its DT in under 2mins easily, fight shouldn't take more than 7mins with a good group, less than 15min in a pickup party is easy

Twitherym dies fast with rng.

Urganite is one of the harder ones and requires a decent group to take down in 15mins, but it isn't bad.

People need to start moving away from the idea of /thf SA WS, it was fine for the first few days but its counter productive now a lot of stuff has been figured out.

[pancakesandsex]

Yes. If you blind him he loses his ridiculous evasion meaning he goes down like a sack of shit unless he gets Calcifying Mist off. Calcifying Mist is horrible for melees because even with Marches + Haste + Hasso/LR + Gear haste, it feels like you're swinging weakened as the timer drops down. If you can resist it with barspells/carols/Rune Fencer buffs then it would be even more of a joke otherwise you could revert to RNG's and tear him apart.

There were points where we'd be dropping 20% chunks off his HP in like 30-45 seconds and then he would mist us.

EDIT: You do need decent skill / accuracy to land blind though.

Can you stun calcifying mist?

[dasva]

Just because people have LS'es don't mean they don't do PUGs though. The vast, vast majority of people I do LS events with do plenty of PUGs too.

It's not uncommon for me to join a random PUG shout and find 3, 4, 5, 6+ people already in the shout from my LS'es or statics. And it's not like they go 'Hey Jem! Come do this with us!', it is purely just sending a tell to random shouters needing people.

Don't see ae much here. Most the shouts i see are one of my lss. Smaller server maybe? And the people we get in shouts.... had a cor keep giving me refresh and some other random roll while I was ochaining it one night and jp so wasn't understanding us

[Jem]

Can you stun calcifying mist?

Yeah it's stunnable.

[lolwut]

It's strange how fast people went from "I hate this content. It's too easy for casuals to get relic beating weapons." to "I hate this content. It's too hard to get relic beating weapons, casuals won't be able to do this!" with one simple change.

It's almost as if people hadn't tried the content before complaining about it, and then didn't bother to get better at the content before complaining more.

I personally like Delve. I can do nms with my ls, pickup runs to farm points, and just farm shards for gil/quick plasm while I skill up. It started off as content tailored to players who were current and decently geared, and seems to have well defined increases in it's difficulty so you can't just rush to the end and sit around bored.

If I had to dislike anything in SoA it'd be the skirmish part availability, but it seems like that's just a case of overestimating how many people would actually participate in SoA like they did with the colonization rate. Those issues aside, it's not much different than Abyssea when people were lamenting the impossibility of killing 50 glavoids and the low xp, except without the level cap raises and atma crutches to nerf it too quickly.

[Obsidian]

I still lament Glavoid.