Dev Tracker: Discussion (Old)

[Toth]

I just want to look like a Geomancer and have equipment to enhance my abilities


Also, Matsui is awesome. He always explains himself and his team philosophy. It is such refreshing after all that Tanaka crap. He also makes a great point. Did our characters really grow much stronger with the jump to 75 to 99. Aside from the increased weapon and magic caps, I say that equipment has been more cause for growth than simple stats.

[Dotsudoku]

Unrelated, but does anyone feel like it was just confirmed that REM aren't going to be and/or remain on top even after the adjustment?

...Therefore, we considered two proposals.

1. Increase the variety of gear available.
In the traditional style, add a variety of coexisting top tier equipment, maintaining the pre-established hierarchy with Relic, Mythic, and Empyrean weapons remaining at the top. Gear would be selected appropriately based on the situation and the player level would remain 99.

2. Extend the variation of equipment vertically.
This is the path we chose. Here, the player level still remains 99; however, the player will continue to grow through newly added equipment...

Seems like it's effectually saying that, "we could have taken a path where REM would remain on top, or we could do this- and we did this"

[dasva]

Did our characters really grow much stronger with the jump to 75 to 99. Aside from the increased weapon and magic caps, I say that equipment has been more cause for growth than simple stats.

You gained alot from 75-99. As for your 2nd statement not sure it makes any sense considering equipment has cause growth because of it's simple stats. And the stat increases from 75-99 are rather huge though significantly less focused manner than gearing allows

[Slycer]

Unrelated, but does anyone feel like it was just confirmed that REM aren't going to be and/or remain on top even after the adjustment?



Seems like it's effectually saying that, "we could have taken a path where REM would remain on top, or we could do this- and we did this"

That's exactly what I got out of it. Either that or he's implying that re-upping the stats on the 99 versions will take a challenge commensurate with content level 20.

[Hitou]

We should probably just resign ourselves to that fact that RME are nothing but trophies of bygone years now. Even if they do get around to adjusting them there will probably better weapons add by then or shortly after and I doubt they're going to adjust RME ad infinitum.

[grevenilvec75]

The sad part is that they can keep shitloads of old content relevant by updating RMEs. And they could resuscitate current useless content (bayld/wildskeeper/skirmish) by tying the REMs in with it. It makes too much sense for them to not see it.

[dannyl]

the devs are retards, not surprised they dont see anything that players wish to have. As simple as they may even be.

[Darkmagi]

I don't see why they would completely outdate them after posting revamped stat examples on them and promising an update.

[Kincard]

Would any sane developer think it's a good idea to make a change after the last time they did it there was probably the greatest amount of analdevastation players have ever displayed?

[dejet]

The thing is, even with a revamp what are the odds we will see anyone upgrade them? we can count on our fingers the number of 99(2) emps/relics/mythics. the bulk of them are 85~90 with a decent amount 95. Even if we see upgrades what are the odds you are going to see ADL killed the number of times to get it even to the final stage of a relic? Or that there will be VWNMs to even have the HMP/whatever else you need from it?

Unless we see a total rework of the system I can not see it even being worth the time of day.

Even if you have tons and tons of gil to blow, you cant find the items to upgrade them as it is. This is the major point, its only going to get worse as time goes on.

[dasva]

The thing is, even with a revamp what are the odds we will see anyone upgrade them? we can count on our fingers the number of 99(2) emps/relics/mythics. the bulk of them are 85~90 with a decent amount 95. Even if we see upgrades what are the odds you are going to see ADL killed the number of times to get it even to the final stage of a relic? Or that there will be VWNMs to even have the HMP/whatever else you need from it?

Unless we see a total rework of the system I can not see it even being worth the time of day.

Even if you have tons and tons of gil to blow, you cant find the items to upgrade them as it is. This is the major point, its only going to get worse as time goes on.

That's only if you assume the upgrade is as bad or worse then making them glow... in fact I'd say have to be worse since they actual do something

[Hitou]

I think he's more saying that supply for 95-99 trial items are already pretty scarce and there's not many people even doing those trials now. When they add the update to RME and everyone has to 99 them then supply for those items will become even more scare and prices will skyrocket. Since prices will go up as supply goes down you could say people would start to farm the items again, but supply is never going to be as high as when those things were the only thing to do in the game, at least VW. And as it is, barely anyone bothered to 99 their RME when it was relatively easy to find the items in bazaars.

[Damane]

I think he's more saying that supply for 95-99 trial items are already pretty scarce and there's not many people even doing those trials now. When they add the update to RME and everyone has to 99 them then supply for those items will become even more scare and prices will skyrocket. Since prices will go up as supply goes down you could say people would start to farm the items again, but supply is never going to be as high as when those things were the only thing to do in the game, at least VW. And as it is, barely anyone bothered to 99 their RME when it was relatively easy to find the items in bazaars.

i dont think its impossible and definitly needs a group. i would say R and E 99 require now as much dedication as olde dynamis. E 99 more then R 99. M is still on a differnt level because of double plans drop flooding the market with alex. A simple fix would be to add HMP to every VW and add HQ pouches to the upper tier NMs that need 12 or more people. people could go lowman farm T1 sandi or so for plates and LSs could speed up the process with fighting the higher tiers

[dejet]

I think he's more saying that supply for 95-99 trial items are already pretty scarce and there's not many people even doing those trials now. When they add the update to RME and everyone has to 99 them then supply for those items will become even more scare and prices will skyrocket. Since prices will go up as supply goes down you could say people would start to farm the items again, but supply is never going to be as high as when those things were the only thing to do in the game, at least VW. And as it is, barely anyone bothered to 99 their RME when it was relatively easy to find the items in bazaars.

Very much so what I am saying

i dont think its impossible and definitly needs a group. i would say R and E 99 require now as much dedication as olde dynamis. E 99 more then R 99. M is still on a differnt level because of double plans drop flooding the market with alex. A simple fix would be to add HMP to every VW and add HQ pouches to the upper tier NMs that need 12 or more people. people could go lowman farm T1 sandi or so for plates and LSs could speed up the process with fighting the higher tiers

This is also the other part. Unless we see a rework of the system there is almost no hope/reason for this upgrade they posted about last month. If I can not go and get HMP with a small group of people(hell a PUG really) it is worthless. Same goes for ADL, even still having to kill the thing 250 times or more for a single relic means 5 months of farming still. All for a weapon that is still worse then you could farm in a week of plasma groups.

[Appie]

I wonder for myself what's more likely to happen earlier at this point: Spharai updated to former glory in FFXI or me actually sticking to FFXIV (surprisingly enough I am enjoying the 2.0 beta), leveling MNK and making a Sphairai in that game?

Either way, Matsui is not getting a dime from me until it is fixed.

[seiji]

Same goes for ADL, even still having to kill the thing 250 times or more for a single relic means 5 months of farming still. All for a weapon that is still worse then you could farm in a week of plasma groups.

you dont have to kill ADL 250 time for revamped Relic

The weapons to be revamped are the level 99 versions of the above mentioned weapons including the non-afterglow ones.

[dejet]

Where did it say that? All I saw was the upgraded stats. Did not see any mention of what ones we can upgrade. Outside that it said 99.

Lol I see your quote but where is that if you don't mind?

Edit:
Still. A rework would have to be done for emps, there was not a single vwnm shout yesterday.

[Jem]

Would any sane developer think it's a good idea to make a change after the last time they did it there was probably the greatest amount of analdevastation players have ever displayed?

I'd hate to be a Dev for XI purely because of how people acted about the R/E/M suggestion. At the end of the day all they did was out date old equipment. The jump was too significant but there was nothing wrong with their logic. The playerbase backlash was over the top imho.

Honestly, at the minute the bigger concern for me is that although they have tried, they have been unable to out date old strategies. Those first few days/weeks after Delve was released were refreshing. Inefficient as hell but it was just nice to have a change from mindlessly melee zerg everything, you know.

A few months down the line and every Delve NM has been turned into 'Melee zerg into the ground whilst buffed to the nines. Stun if required'. Muyingwa is the only one where you're probably better using a different strat but even that is possible to just melee burn anyway.

[Draylo]

Yeah I agree. What could they even do though? I would love to see other jobs get participation on the strategy. I felt voidwatch was decent at including all jobs but people hated that system. Not really sure what they could do.

[Jem]

On paper it's simple, they just have to make mobs unfeasible to melee. Whether it's permanently or in phases or as a counter to melee zerging. There's plenty of ways they can do that that they have implemented in the past.

Frequent full AoE dispels
Dickish auras (Amnesia / Massacre Elegy / Weakness / Petrify / etc)
Gimp melee damage on it (including Mura / Formless)
Make mobs fly like Wyrms so melee physically won't work
Extremely damaging moves
Moves with horrible adds effects and possibly make them unremovable
Make it immune to stun

You don't have to have the mob permanently have them. Just have it gain access and use some of above as a counter if melee zerging is being abused. There's plenty of ways it could be done.