Official global alpha start date: November 28th.

[Insanecyclone]

Alpha OF makes me want to punch the screen.

[Sephiroth]

You had to of started it, meaning, you hit him first in order for him to hit you in the early zones! So my question, why would you attack someone so much higher level than you if you hate "open PvP"?

Also, everyone that still has not got into Alpha, have you guys checked your SE accounts to see if Alpha is listed under services? Have you attempted to log into the Alpha forums? Myself and my friend both did not receive the email (both using yahoo accounts, checked spam as well) but both have received access. Worth a shot.

SE account
https://secure.square-enix.com/accou...n?cont=account

Alpha Forums
http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/forum.php

It's quite possible that I was no longer in the starter zones. I spent my entire time just exploring the map as much as I could. Pretty sure I didn't attack anything but this was years ago so I can't remember the details.

To be fair though the biggest thing that put me off playing WoW wasn't the random PKs but the cartoony graphics. You've got to actually like the world you're spending all that time in. It doesn't have to be high tech graphics for me like XIV either, XI was good enough, it has the realistic feel to it.

Unfortunately no luck checking my SE account for alpha status.

[Manako]

sad over here too

[Lucavi]

To be fair though the biggest thing that put me off playing WoW wasn't the random PKs but the cartoony graphics. You've got to actually like the world you're spending all that time in. It doesn't have to be high tech graphics for me like XIV either, XI was good enough, it has the realistic feel to it.

So realistic that you couldn't interact with anything, and that's not to demean your opinion, as I sort-of agree with you, but lets compare:

WoW's jungle: Actual jungle you can wade in and out of; swimming in lakes to hunt or stalk prey (killing shit to non RPers), bushes that hide you (from others) if you stand inside or behind them, high perches and cliffs to scout from, ect. No boundaries whatsoever until you hit the extreme edge of each zone, all of which were massive. Colorful and animated (IE: cartoony for anyone who hates the style)

XI's jungle: A series of narrow pathways that occasionally opened up to a circular area. All other areas impassable. Backgrounds unreachable. Pretty graphics for the time, though.

I suppose its all in how you look at it (and want to look at it), but thankfully, SE seems to be taking somewhat of a middle-ground with 2.0., and I think we'll see even more of a 50/50 split come beta/retail.

[MutamixBubblypots]

To be fair though the biggest thing that put me off playing WoW wasn't the random PKs but the cartoony graphics. You've got to actually like the world you're spending all that time in. It doesn't have to be high tech graphics for me like XIV either, XI was good enough, it has the realistic feel to it.

I agree with you there. I tried to play WoW but the cartoony graphics were a major turn off for me. After I did some of the beginner quests, I immediately uninstalled it. I couldn't take it anymore.

[Sephiroth]

WoW's jungle: Actual jungle you can wade in and out of; swimming in lakes to hunt or stalk prey (killing shit to non RPers), bushes that hide you (from others) if you stand inside or behind them, high perches and cliffs to scout from, ect. No boundaries whatsoever until you hit the extreme edge of each zone, all of which were massive. Colorful and animated (IE: cartoony for anyone who hates the style)

I would love all that in FFXIV. That's more realistic than your XI example but I don't think this has anything to do with the graphics. Those are more environment design issues. Realistic graphics vs realistic environment. Ideally we'd have both but if we can't I'd choose the graphics because I can live without swimming or that other stuff WoW does well.

[Dakin]

To each their own, but to completely put aside a game because of cartoony graphics?...C'mon man! I agree, best of both worlds would be ideal, it just amazes me that some people still consider graphics a deal breaker.

[Lucavi]

Not to disagree or anything, but I wonder how many people started on the opposite end of the spectrum and would say the same thing? How many people would start with WoW and its systems and graphics, and then refuse to "upgrade" to XI's superior graphics in return for a "downgrade" in maneuverability, interact-ability, ect.? I have a sinking suspicion that the numbers wouldn't be too high, and much of the former opinion is based on either nostalgia for the Franchise or simply playing XI first and growing attached to it before trying something else.

You could also level the playing field and have someone raised on the Warcraft series play WoW, then XI, and see if they'd choose XI over WoW.

[Lordender]

I love WoW's graphics, lol and the funny thing is, they have improved so much since classic(before cataclysm) Mists of Pandaria has fucking beautiful zones. I think WoW looks better than XI these days.

[Sup3rB4d]

You don't realize how important environmental freedom is until you have it and it's taken away.

[miokomioko]

To each their own, but to completely put aside a game because of cartoony graphics?...C'mon man! I agree, best of both worlds would be ideal, it just amazes me that some people still consider graphics a deal breaker.

It's more likely than you think.

I'm entirely turned off by modern Dragon Quests because of the character designs and the first-person battle view, amongst a few other aesthetic things.
I actually made myself play 8 and found the gameplay rather fun... I just fucking despise how everything looks all of the time.

Some people are just very... visual.

[Lucavi]

You don't realize how important environmental freedom is until you have it and it's taken away.

I gotta go with this. I think the tables would be turned if they had started off with the other. Still can't change the past though, so I'm just glad that 2.0 is taking a more varied approach.

[Sephiroth]

I've not seen the new WoW graphics, my brief visit was before Cataclysm but it's more that they're cartoony than outdated that puts me off. That's just the style of the artwork the game aims for. I suppose one could say it's the art style rather than the graphics that I don't like. I'd happily play XI despite the 10 year old graphics but the idea of starting from scratch on that is too unappealing to bother. And yes if I'm going to be playing a game 20+ hours a week for years the graphical style can be a deal breaker. You're meant to immerse yourself in the virtual world when playing an MMO, if you don't like the look of the world you can't enjoy it. It's just like how you wouldn't want to go on holiday to somewhere you don't find visually appealing.

You don't realize how important environmental freedom is until you have it and it's taken away.

I'm used to environmental freedom in games like GTA and even FFX had swimming. I don't really miss those kind of freedoms when playing MMOs, but they'd be nice additions.

[Sign]

I have always said to people I would love to see a superteam MMO consisting of Western design ideals and Eastern art style. Like others, I find the Western (lets face it, it goes much further than just WoW) art style to be very cartoony and rather unappealing, but their gameplay is generally far superior. That is what makes me so excited when I read the letters from Yoshida, I love the look of FFXIV and if he can incorporate a lot of the things that newer MMO's have developed I could sink a lot of hours into this.

[Spider-Dan]

Interactivity and graphical detail are not related in these cases. It's not like XI would allow you to freely roam through the trees in Yuhtunga if resolution was capped at 640x480.

WoW is ugly, but that was a conscious decision made to lower minimum sysreqs. That strategy paid off. I'm just surprised they haven't released an upgraded client with better models, like EQ did with Luclin.

[Lucavi]

^ They still take a lot of flack, and, to be honest, they've modded the hell out of the engine for everything BUT the character models. They address that point constantly.

[Stromgarde]

Can count me as another person turned off by WoW's art direction. I'm pretty pleased with where XIV is headed in that department though. In terms of the other stuff, Yoshi-P has a rather impressive history of experience with other (western) MMO's to pull from, but it's almost as important what he didn't mention when those lists come up, namely boring-but-pretty Asian grindfests such as Lineage. The dude has good taste, and if you're concerned about the challenge being dumbed down you should check out the new assistant director's (Kazuya Niinou) work history.

[Spider-Dan]

The one thing that concerns me about 2.0's graphics is the heavy focus on shadows. They are really the feature that makes it stand out, and shadows are usually one of the most GPU-intensive options (and the first I reach for when it comes time to kill quality for performance).

Then again, maybe that's by design. It's possible that the lowest-common-denominator plan is to make an engine that runs crisply with shadows off, and have more complex shading be the carrot for the bleeding-edgers.

[Rionel]

I just had the silliest epiphany about CNJ just now. Like, wow, FFXI has conditioned me way too much sometimes.

[Elcura]

How can graphics in an MMO not be important? If you're going to spend a year or more of your life playing the damn thing, you might as well be satisfied with how it looks.