So how about that Connecticut Elementary School Shooting; Troll at Your Own Risk

[Qalbert]

if you have to tell a goddamn teenager that popping people in the head with an assault rifle is not socially acceptable than you suck at raising your kids.

[Seraph]

I think the assumption here is that the parents even know what the kids are even playing. When I was younger, my father would play each new game I got with me, so he knew what I was up to. Not only did this earn him 'cool dad' points, but he would be able to deal with any questionable content accordingly.

[Ksandra]

Since you seem to be on a rampage no matter what I say

my point wasn't that you shouldn't talk to them,

do tell me, when is it the ok age to talk to them that isn't too young or too old. Age must be given in years months and days so I can set an alarm to my phone.


Again, I agree with you that parents shouldn't let kids play games before the rating suggests. That doesn't mean they shouldn't also get a talk, that's being irresponsible (not doing both).

[Kerberoz]

...seriously?

If the kid needs a "talk" to understand the difference between reality and fantasy, they probably have a mental disorder. I'd have felt pretty insulted by such a talk post-kindergarten.

[zoobernut]

if you have to tell a goddamn teenager that popping people in the head with an assault rifle is not socially acceptable than you suck at raising your kids.

It seems so obvious to you but it really isn't. Even a teenager needs to be talked to about violent media in that way. Parents talking with their kids about stuff really does have an impact on their lives and how they relate to things in the world. Kids don't just figure everything out on their own and you don't reach a magical age where everything suddenly makes sense and you don't need your parents to talk to you about it anymore. Talking to your kids about violent video games doesn't necessarily mean explaining it to them in a super simple easy for a 6 year old to understand sort of a way. You can have an age appropriate discussion with a teenager about violent video games. It isn't that hard.

Edit: You are also making the big assumption that kids are automatically thinking about this which may not be the case if they are growing up today in America where violence is celebrated in movies and games on a constant basis. Even if you go to your kid and just mention it to get them to start thinking about it that is a step in the right direction.

[ronin sparthos]

Parents never gave me a serious talk about the reality versus what happens in cinema but the passing commentary about how things on TV were generally fake kind of worked its way into my head over the years. My grandmother would watch all the Chuck Norris, Charles Bronson, James Bond type films and I'l be like cool some guy is wasting people with a gun but I never really saw myself as being like those guys though it was fun to watch 'splosions and general badassery.

I think the reality of wrestling being fake was more jarring than realizing that you cant throw someone through a glass window, shoot a gun out of someones hand or roundhouse kick your way to victory. What do you mean he didn't really clothesline that guy? You mean the Diamond cutter is fake? These guys are just actors performing in an arena? What the fuck, I've been lied to.

I guess I can see how if your parents or guardian figures are completely detached from giving you any real advice about the world around you that you could fall into the trap of thinking COD is real or that what goes on in the interwebs reflects reality which probably reflects the changing culture of technology and the social coming together.

Bad parents will be bad, good parents will stay on top of the changing landscape though it still takes your child not being derp as parents cannot be expected to be on top of everything. As far as my parents were concerned video games were pretty much just television+1.

[Ksandra]

The fact that people are flipping out of the idea of a parent having a talk with their kids about games kinda boggles my mind. Kid may know better, what's wrong with making sure? Is it going to destroy their lives if you talk to them about something they already know?

[Kerberoz]

"flipping out" is major hyperbole here

[Ksandra]

"flipping out" is major hyperbole here

have you seen all the swears qbert is throwing at me and claiming I'm a bad parent for talking to my kid about it at apparently any age? Yes, I consider that flipping out.

[Qalbert]

again I'm not saying talking is bad. slow down and read what I am saying, I don't know how to be any more clear, I'm not rampaging against talking to your kids, far from it. the problem is your post treats itlike simply having a talk would fix everything. I said no, that's not the core issue. talking is definitely important, and I never said otherwise. however if you have to tell a child that they shouldn't do what they see in CoD in real life, that's indicative of the larger problem that THEY SHOULDN'T BE SEEING IT IN COD because they are either too young and immature/naive, or have legit mental issues. if they honestly don't understand that killing people is wrong, they shouldn't be being exposed to it in the first place, does that fucking make sense?

[Seraph]

have you seen all the swears qbert is throwing at me and claiming I'm a bad parent for talking to my kid about it at apparently any age? Yes, I consider that flipping out.

Hey now. I suggested people in here were getting upset and that just made them more upset. Be careful! =P

EDIT: And to actually contribute in a general sense, assuming that 'having a talk once with your kid' is an acceptable parenting strategy is laughable. Nothing in parenting is a one time thing, its a continual process that takes years (decades).

[BaneTheBrawler]

When my nephews were little kids (like 5-6) my sister would ask me about what video games were appropriate, and I explained about the ESRB ratings and whatnot, and she thought that was pretty useful, just to give her a rough idea of the sort of game it is. She let them play M games fairly early, but they grew up watching me and my older nephew play Goldeneye, so they were already familiar with the idea that video game violence is not to be imitated. They're 15-16 now and are good kids. I've watched them play CoD and whatnot, they don't even teabag. They also have good taste in games. It's refreshing.

[Qalbert]

Ksandra, your post is like seeing someone on fire and recommending they apply some ointment. Yes the ointment is a valid, and needed step, but the core issue is removing the fire. Does that make sense?

[Byrthnoth]

Somehow I have difficulty believing that a heart-to-heart with his mom about the difference between video games and reality would have stopped this shooter.

[Ksandra]

again I'm not saying talking is bad. slow down and read what I am saying, I don't know how to be any more clear, I'm not rampaging against talking to your kids, far from it. the problem is your post treats itlike simply having a talk would fix everything. I said no, that's not the core issue. talking is definitely important, and I never said otherwise. however if you have to tell a child that they shouldn't do what they see in CoD in real life, that's indicative of the larger problem that THEY SHOULDN'T BE SEEING IT IN COD because they are either too young and immature/naive, or have legit mental issues. if they honestly don't understand that killing people is wrong, they shouldn't be being exposed to it in the first place, does that fucking make sense?

How many times do I have to say that I agree they shouldn't be playing it at a young age for you to get that? I never said talking was the only solution. you interpreted it that way, not me. zoober mentioned talking, and I said ya that's a big issue.

[edit]and saying "talking to your kid about CoD" does not mean I am all for 6 year olds playing it. I am just being smart and realizing that even if I tell my kid not to play it, does not mean they won't come across it. I mean do you not remember being a kid? fuck, my parents wouldn't let me watch 90210 when I was in 6th grade, and I still found ways to watch it. As a parent, you have to do your best, and part of doing your best is realizing your kid is going to work around you as best they can.

Also, I love how you keep saying you aren't saying talking is bad, but then if you have to talk about it you are either a bad parent or your kid has issues. Do you understand how that doesn't make sense?

[ronin sparthos]

Just bring your kid up on JRPGs and they'll think the power of compelling arguments, friendship and magic swords will solve everything. At worst they imitate altruistic acts like helping old people across streets, feeding animals, assisting shopkeepers and rummaging around trashcans for items.

[Ksandra]

Somehow I have difficulty believing that a heart-to-heart with his mom about the difference between video games and reality would have stopped this shooter.

Not saying it would, but apparently the motive is assumed that he flipped because she was going to send him to a mental institution and he thought she loved that school more than him.

Imagine if she was more active in talking/being aware about this stuff when he was young? She might have gotten him help much sooner. Way before he would have reacted by shooting her and the school.

[ronin sparthos]

Somehow I have difficulty believing that a heart-to-heart with his mom about the difference between video games and reality would have stopped this shooter.

Somethings gotta get scapegoated. Consider it an honor that video games have become so renown that they now possess the power to turn teens into rampaging murderers.

[Qalbert]

Also, I love how you keep saying you aren't saying talking is bad, but then if you have to talk about it you are either a bad parent or your kid has issues. Do you understand how that doesn't make sense?

I'm saying that if your kid is exposed to Call of Duty, and doesn't understand the basic concepts that hurting/killing people is wrong, then yes, you have failed as a parent. Even toddlers can understand not to hit other people because it is bad, if your child has access to violent games and doesn't understand that violence is bad, then you are a shitty parent, and that's all there is to it. You shouldn't need to tell a kid "don't do CoD irl" because if they don't understand violence against others is wrong then they shouldn't have been exposed to CoD in the first place, and you either are terrible at judging game appropriateness, or at supervision. Children should be taught basic concepts like "violence against others is bad" at an age well before exposure to violent games should be occurring. That's my problem with your post. Not the notion of talking with your children, the notion that they would be exposed to something violent when they are too young or too immature to understand that violence is bad. How about talk to your kid early on and just explain basic concepts like that violence is bad, and then when they understand it and see Johnny playing CoD at a sleepover they know that "hey, I probably shouldn't do that". If your kid is old enough to be exposed to CoD and you haven't taught him basic things like "don't hurt other people" then you are failing as a parent. If that doesn't make sense, I don't care to explain it further.

[zoobernut]

Somehow I have difficulty believing that a heart-to-heart with his mom about the difference between video games and reality would have stopped this shooter.

This discussion is somewhat of a side discussion. It was already stated that more proactive parenting (that is really what we are talking about here) will only work if the child is of a state of mind where they are receptive to it. If they have mental issues that means that it most likely will not work. Certain mental disorders make it so a person is unable to feel empathy towards others. Those cases need different help.I think this discussion is important because no single action is going to be a solution to the problem we need an entire society shift in many directions to help reduce the amount of mass murders that happen in the US. We need to have better more proactive parents, we need more responsible gun owners who actually lock up their guns, we need better/easier access to mental health care, we need as a society to place less of a stigma on needing such health care, we need to try to reduce the ease to obtain high round capacity high fire rate weapons that facilitate these acts. All of these things contribute to preventing these events. And as Qalbert has said we need a good mix of parents talking to their kids while also being more aware of what their kids are playing/watching and keeping them from overly violent media until they are at an appropriate age where they can understand the difference between fake and reality.