2013 America (and Friends!) Gun Violence Thread No Plows Allowed!

[BerenTebogo]

For the purposes of the analogy, the mother is the bartender in this situation, not the gun makers.

As far as I understand it anyway, I'm not really in this one.

[Ksandra]

For the purposes of the analogy, the mother is the bartender in this situation, not the gun makers.

As far as I understand it anyway, I'm not really in this one.

No, I get that. I am saying Delayed who started the comparison said alcohol producing companies, not bartenders.

[archibaldcrane]

I think everyone should have access to the background check system, it should be required for ALL firearm transfers, and if a firearm is transferred without a background check and it is used in a crime, the person who transferred it should also be legally culpable.

[Melena]

I think everyone should have access to the background check system, it should be required for ALL firearm transfers, and if a firearm is transferred without a background check and it is used in a crime, the person who transferred it should also be legally culpable.

This, and to add to it, as much as the ACLU is against it, mental health records should be part of the background check as well.

[Xno Kappa]

Bars have actually been held liable in court for supplying alcohol to people who were already under the influence before they got behind the wheel of a car and crashed. In cases like that where a person contributes to the issue (in this case a bar serving someone already under the influence and making them even worse instead of cutting them off) yes can and should be held liable.

It's applicable to a person hosting a party as well.

[vivbiibasjiu]

This, and to add to it, as much as the ACLU is against it, mental health records should be part of the background check as well.

Yeah let's stigmatize the mentally ill even more shall we? Even though it's been proven that mentally ill people are less likely to commit violent crimes and more likely to be victims. Plus if it appears in background checks, anyone who has ever had a mental illness (including something like depression) can say goodbye to ever getting a job again. Even if they're not legally allowed to discriminate over it, one look at the "crazy" and they'll do a "nope" and say something like "sorry, but there were many applications and we've already hired someone more qualified!" or whatever

There's a good reason medical records are confidential.

[Tyrath]

Since we're on this topic, John oliver had some insightful things to say.

[Melena]

Yeah let's stigmatize the mentally ill even more shall we? Even though it's been proven that mentally ill people are less likely to commit violent crimes and more likely to be victims. Plus if it appears in background checks, anyone who has ever had a mental illness (including something like depression) can say goodbye to ever getting a job again. Even if they're not legally allowed to discriminate over it, one look at the "crazy" and they'll do a "nope" and say something like "sorry, but there were many applications and we've already hired someone more qualified!" or whatever

There's a good reason medical records are confidential.

I'm going to have to disagree with that. They don't hav to specify to the store/seller why the application is denied, protecting the persons privacy. But if they have been hospitalized in the past for violence or suicidal tendencies, they shouldn't have access to a gun

[Aksannyi]

So you're saying that certain mental hospitalizations/issues would simply show up as a flag on someone's check, without any details? I could get behind that. I'm with the other poster, I wouldn't want random dude at the gun shop knowing that I saw a psychiatrist after deployment that one time.

My issue with it is the same as viv stated, there's no reason for people to know someone's medical history, that's what HIPAA is for.

[Rooney]

That's honestly all a background check needs to be: a simple "cleared to buy" or "not cleared to buy". Most of the things that would throw red flags are generally not fixable (history of violent crime, serious mental illness, etc) so details aren't necessary.

[Melena]

I believe actually that's what it is and to appeal it you have to call the fbi. I can't remember if they specified on the check for my brother when he was initially denied a few years ago and had to get a lawyer to get it cleared

[Rooney]

I guess I just always thought they had at least a little detail. Of course that was based on how vigorously certain people complain about them. Really not sure what people have against them at this point: they only take a few minutes and would help prevent some violence.

[Melena]

Because Mercia and ma freedoms

[6souls]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-34450841

11 year old boy shoots dead a 8 year old girl with his father's 12-gauge because she wouldn't show him her puppy. The boy had been known to bully her, as to her reason not to play nice.

Bonus: 11 year old boy shoots and kills his 12 year old brother while at targeting practice. Two adults were present at the time, so were three loaded guns sitting on the table.

[kuronosan]

Yeah let's stigmatize the mentally ill even more shall we? Even though it's been proven that mentally ill people are less likely to commit violent crimes and more likely to be victims. Plus if it appears in background checks, anyone who has ever had a mental illness (including something like depression) can say goodbye to ever getting a job again. Even if they're not legally allowed to discriminate over it, one look at the "crazy" and they'll do a "nope" and say something like "sorry, but there were many applications and we've already hired someone more qualified!" or whatever

There's a good reason medical records are confidential.

Quiet, you.

[Dimmauk]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-34450841

11 year old boy shoots dead a 8 year old girl with his father's 12-gauge because she wouldn't show him her puppy. The boy had been known to bully her, as to her reason not to play nice.

Bonus: 11 year old boy shoots and kills his 12 year old brother while at targeting practice. Two adults were present at the time, so were three loaded guns sitting on the table.

THEM KIDS WERE PROBABLY ALL HOPPED UP ON AD&D DRUGS, AND THAT IS WHY THEY MURDERED.

Conservative radio is been off the fucking chain lately. Like I said, they blame mental illness, but vote against healthcare and marijuana laws.

[archibaldcrane]

Gun ownership percentage by state:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...psxn7x38oe.png

Crazy that Hawaii is 10th in gun ownership %, but has some of the strongest gun control regs and the fewest gun deaths by far. What a weird combination.

[Xantavia]

I think everyone should have access to the background check system, it should be required for ALL firearm transfers, and if a firearm is transferred without a background check and it is used in a crime, the person who transferred it should also be legally culpable.

Stop with the common sense there. If we keep accurate records of gun ownership, it just makes it easier for the government to take your guns away. And it can in no way potentially find weak points in the system. Why would we want to know that a large number of guns used in crimes were all last for sale at Sammy's Shootin' Shack.

[Ghost_Wheel22]

Let's make a deal gun control enthusiasts: I'll agree to UBC, 21 day waiting periods, increased punishment (felony) for any crime involving a firearm across the board, and the above mentioned mental health screening. In return you repeal the Hughes Amendment.

[Ragnus]

Fuck it, deal. There's no reason why a citizen should be able to own one of those things, but if it gets all of the above without changes then it's a win.