Xbox Done Discussion - 2016's #1 Master Race Bottom Bitch

[BadKarma]

Dont care about always online. Will still buy. Maybe.

[Shiyo]

Dont care about always online. Will still buy. Maybe.

You're part of the problem.

In the end, consoles are money sinks. They have $400 price tags on launch day, $60 games (PC games are generally cheaper by $10 and more accessible via digital download), and then, well you just NEED the service that comes with them too, right? (PS+ is far better than XBL, I'm sure we're on the same page with that) On top of needing to pay for internet every month, with XBL you need to pay another fee just to use multiplayer for the multiplayer game you just bought? Hey, PC does that with JUST the internet connection (you're being had now!). So let's say you've owned your xbox or PS for 5 years and have the subscription for gold ($40/yr) or PS+ ($50), you've paid $200, and $250 respectively. On top of the initial cost of the system you're talking $600 and $650 for these systems, which you then have to replace when the next gen comes out (PCs are less expensive to upgrade when done intelligently). And when your console breaks down/red rings, then what? You might just have to buy a new one in some cases.

The "best" argument I hear for why consoles should continue to exist is so "I can play on my couch". You can do that with a PC, but I'll give you that argument. I sure ain't lugging my couch to my desktop or vice versa, and I don't like long cables running across the living room. Consoles hardly save you money over just buying a good gaming PC, and at least if your PC goes bunk you swap out a part and it's all good again, unlike your console. They make great gamepads for PC too (see: razer, logitech) so the comfort level is quite literally the same. Losing the console market would place heavier emphasis on the standardization of gaming platforms imo. Maybe that's not true immediately, but where platforms are concerned, less (quantity) is usually more (focus). See iOS vs. Android. Every little feature they add to consoles just makes them more like PCs each year. This generation will be no different. I've given up on consoles and the exclusive games aren't attractive to me. If they are for you, well then I can't argue you can't like those games. I'll stick with my PC which will save me more money on games in my life time and will play the games in higher resolution, with better graphics, and still feel the same to me with my Onza gamepad. And I won't have to buy a whole new one when the next generation of games comes out either.

This is pretty much completely true. Consoles are basically computers that can't do as much as a computer can do and have inferior graphics, UI, and control settings. Not to mention constant bullshit like more expensive games(no steam for consoles..even used games don't compare to steam sales), horrible pay to play online(xbox live..what), VASTLY inferior internet online options with less control, inability to pick actual servers, or just a sloppy UI mess.

Modding on PC is also huge, there's mods for TL2, diablo2, sim city 4, and tons of other games that add infinite content that extend the life of the game by years. The synergies mod(TL2) adds 3 new classes to a game that only has 4, tons new maps, new enemies, new items, etc. That could NEVER exist on a console.

There's just no reason to play on a console over a PC if the game exists on both platforms. PC gives you everything a console does and much much more, once console exclusives go away we'll see even more games on a PC(Gabe just talked to a lot of JP devs to get their games on steam and we're seeing lots more Jp games on steam lately). I hope the future of gaming turns into PC being the major focus, because steam is so great for buying/organizing/keeping track of your games, and the ability to mod and download mods with steamworkshop is so easily accessible even the dumbest people can do it.

I currently only play on my PC and handhelds(I own every console but a PS3, and almost every old console besides virtual boy or other retarded ones like that), but I wish a lot of handheld games I own like Project Diva/MH/Etrian oddysey/jrpgs/god eater would come to PC. The customization, modding, control options, etc are just so much better on PC it's insane.

Consoles need to either not exist or go back to $150-200 price ranges and can ONLY play video games, none of this social media netflix hulu dvd player blueray motion control and whatever the fuck else they keep cramming into our consoles. Get a PC if you wanna do all that shit, consoles should be for playing VIDEO GAMES, computers for EVERYTHING ELSE. I'm pretty sure more people would buy consoles if they were only for gaming with free online multiplayer like PS3(fuck you microsoft) and would make the companies more money. Most people want a console to play video games, but you make them have all this other unneeded shit, making them cost more to make, making them cost more to buy, and making less people buy them. Fucking stupid.

[Aristio]

You're part of the problem.


This is pretty much completely true. Consoles are basically computers that can't do as much as a computer can do and have inferior graphics, UI, and control settings. Not to mention constant bullshit like more expensive games(no steam for consoles..even used games don't compare to steam sales), horrible pay to play online(xbox live..what), VASTLY inferior internet online options with less control, inability to pick actual servers, or just a sloppy UI mess.

Modding on PC is also huge, there's mods for TL2, diablo2, sim city 4, and tons of other games that add infinite content that extend the life of the game by years. The synergies mod(TL2) adds 3 new classes to a game that only has 4, tons new maps, new enemies, new items, etc. That could NEVER exist on a console.

There's just no reason to play on a console over a PC if the game exists on both platforms. PC gives you everything a console does and much much more, once console exclusives go away we'll see even more games on a PC(Gabe just talked to a lot of JP devs to get their games on steam and we're seeing lots more Jp games on steam lately). I hope the future of gaming turns into PC being the major focus, because steam is so great for buying/organizing/keeping track of your games, and the ability to mod and download mods with steamworkshop is so easily accessible even the dumbest people can do it.

I currently only play on my PC and handhelds(I own every console but a PS3, and almost every old console besides virtual boy or other retarded ones like that), but I wish a lot of handheld games I own like Project Diva/MH/Etrian oddysey/jrpgs/god eater would come to PC. The customization, modding, control options, etc are just so much better on PC it's insane.

Consoles need to either not exist or go back to $150-200 price ranges and can ONLY play video games, none of this social media netflix hulu dvd player blueray motion control and whatever the fuck else they keep cramming into our consoles. Get a PC if you wanna do all that shit, consoles should be for playing VIDEO GAMES, computers for EVERYTHING ELSE. I'm pretty sure more people would buy consoles if they were only for gaming with free online multiplayer like PS3(fuck you microsoft) and would make the companies more money. Most people want a console to play video games, but you make them have all this other unneeded shit, making them cost more to make, making them cost more to buy, and making less people buy them. Fucking stupid.

You don't want to hand a 8 year old a $1,200 Gaming Rig. Nor do parents want to do research into a Gaming Rig. Plus, while the overall cost may be lower in the long run, a $100 Wii with two "free" games and easy to use controls just seems cheaper. It's just a whole lot easier to use a console without having to worry about compatibility issues, driver updates, and the such; you just throw in the disc and it works.

[Krandor]

Shiyo's post was pretty heavy into the "PC Master Race" realm, but being even remotely educated on technical aspects of a PC is never a bad thing. Recently I watched my dad dump a few hundred bucks to some PC repair place for what could be taken care of in an afternoon with a screwdriver, compressed air, and a reformat.

[dejet]

What's wrong with a blu Ray player or Netflix?

I understand the games and what not are fat better on a pc. But by your crazy thinking roku, Google tv or apple tv should not be bought.

Sorry I don't want my pc close to my television. For that reason alone I will always have some system there; be it a ps3, Xbox or roku.

As a note I would much rather play games on pc. My stream collection I love dearly.


Edit: and saying people don't want motion controls its funny.Ok yes everyone else failed at it but Nintendo, still the Wii was one of the best selling systems. I know tons of people that love the Netflix/hulu apps. I use my blu Ray player still to this day. You need to stop thinking your likes are the same as everyone else.

Only unwelcome additions so far seems to be always online and the crap thatmight make used games worthless.that shit needs to go out adds nothing for gamers or anyone but the devs.

[Kalmado]

You don't want to hand a 8 year old a $1,200 Gaming Rig. Nor do parents want to do research into a Gaming Rig. Plus, while the overall cost may be lower in the long run, a $100 Wii with two "free" games and easy to use controls just seems cheaper. It's just a whole lot easier to use a console without having to worry about compatibility issues, driver updates, and the such; you just throw in the disc and it works.

A lot of great points are in this statement, but you can play devil's advocate on all points as well. Regarding the bolded, I disagree with that and I'll give two reasons. First, it was reported when Fallout: New Vegas came out it was unplayable and multiple patches had to be done. Don't have online? You're screwed. Second, when I purchased Max Payne 3 for my xbox I went through four copies before getting one to work. Sure the same could happen with a pc games disc if that's how you purchased, but as I said I'm playing devil's advocate here. It's just not that simple that consoles are that easy/great/etc.

As far as pricing goes it's hard to say, especially if you've had bad luck with a console and had to get it replaced multiple times. I personally am unaware of how much a "standard gaming rig" would cost. I have invested roughly $800 into my pc which I purchased four years ago. I have much room for upgrades as well. If you bought a 360 at launch you're $400 invested. Add $160 for four years of xbox live and we're now at $560. Let's say we're talking about the average consumer/parent and this is for their teen. They go to Best Buy and purchase a wireless internet adapter, hdmi cord, battery charger for the controller, and eventually a Kinect. These are standard things and nothing special. That's an additional $217. Now we're $777 into our console. After year 3 it's RROD time and Microsoft won't cover it. Junior has to have his 360 because CoD 50 is out and he's gotta play with his friends! Thank god the price of the system has went down a little, but it's still $200 for the 4gb model. $300 for the other. Let's get the $200 model. We're now at $977. This is not including games obviously.

Even if we get lucky and a system doesn't fail the price you pay for the console can be not much less, at, or more than a decent pc. The average consumer may not come to this judgement, but us here can easily see the overall value goes to the pc. In regards to children not fit to use a gaming rig, that is not a valid argument in this day and age when children as young as 4 use/play with mom and dad's iPad, iPhone, iPod, etc etc which cost hundreds of dollars. While I personally do not agree with children so young and even teens having such expensive toys, the fact is that's how things are nowadays.

I like Shiyo's post. It makes me want to look further into using my pc for gaming as I only use it for ffxi currently. I've always liked playing on a console so I can sit on my couch or a comfy chair. I like playing baseball on my tv and can't wait to be able to upgrade to a larger/better tv. My wife can sit with me or if we have friends over a group can play. As far as games go and the price they are for what you're getting (see this thread) I'm going to look more into pc games and offers on sites such as Steam, Humble Bundle, etc.

As Shiyo points out, I too am very annoyed with having a VIDEO GAME SYSTEM shoving down my throat social media, movies, tv, etc. I do not care one iota about accessing facebook on my xbox. Yes I understand junior might and that's why they are trying to add these features to these systems. The way I see it is they have to spend money investing into the technology and personnel to develop such things and we help pay this expense with the high cost of these systems at release. I do not agree with it.

To circle back to the problem of the possibility we need to be online 100% to use any system, that would push me to pc gaming.

[Korialstrasz]

My wife and I have always be console fans. We have NES, SNES, N64, purple lunchbox, Wii, PS1/2/3, Xbox 360, as well as various handhelds. Not a single one of them requires an internet connection, and that's great. But if the new xbox absolutely needs internet to use, we won't be getting it. Requiring internet for a console is fucking retarded in pretty much every aspect, and is an absolute horrible move by microsoft if it turns out to be true. If it's not, then we'll likely buy it and add to our collection like we always do.

That said, we play a ton of PC games as well, and when a game comes out for console and PC, we'll almost always go with the PC depending on the game. Mods are a big thing to me, as they tend to pick up on some things where the devs left off, or simply "enhance" the experience. But more importantly, sometimes a game comes out that is absolutely fucked up like a left handed football bat right from the start (hi to you Skyrim), and the PC version will almost always get a fix first, even if it's player made. If a quest bugs out, you have various in game commands to compensate or work past it. If on a console, tough shit. You either learn to live with it, or start over and hope for the best. Sure you 'll get the occasional patch, but after a time they stop coming, and you're forever doomed with a partially broken product that the developer will never fix.

[Skidz]

If you bought a 360 at launch you're $400 invested. Add $160 for four years of xbox live and we're now at $560. Let's say we're talking about the average consumer/parent and this is for their teen. They go to Best Buy and purchase a wireless internet adapter, hdmi cord, battery charger for the controller, and eventually a Kinect. These are standard things and nothing special. That's an additional $217.

What in the fuck, exactly none of those things are "standard things and nothing special".

[Tyrath]

I really don't get the master PC race arguments. I own a kickass gaming PC myself, but I still own a PS3 and plan to get at least a PS4 next gen. I can move a ps3 around much easier than a PC. I can take a ps3 to a friend's house if I wanted to, and sometimes I just wanna play my game on a 60inch TV screen because I damn well can.

Gaming PCs are great, but sometimes I just wanna play something on a console. So I really don't get how anyone can argue for ONLY PC gaming ever. Is it better? Definitely. But there's nothing wrong with a console market.

[Grey Jorildyn]

Well there's a lot wrong with console market, but I guess those points have gone ignored up to this point. Consoles have a place but to say the market itself is devoid of issues is beyond false.

[Tyrath]

I personally didn't say there are no issues. I was just speaking against any assertions that a master PC race is all that there needs to be.

[Krandor]

I really don't get the master PC race arguments. I own a kickass gaming PC myself, but I still own a PS3 and plan to get at least a PS4 next gen. I can move a ps3 around much easier than a PC. I can take a ps3 to a friend's house if I wanted to, and sometimes I just wanna play my game on a 60inch TV screen because I damn well can.

The portability argument is a little skewed. A laptop is obviously going to beat a console in that department, though that is definitely a field where price is very much getting involved (along the lines of "OMGZ PC COST SO MUCH," except you know, true), since a decent gaming laptop is going to be starting in the $1000 range.

[Kalmado]

What in the fuck, exactly none of those things are "standard things and nothing special".

You're kidding yourself if you don't think Joe Dad and Jane Mom do not buy those type of things for their kids. They are extremely average. Numerous friends and even their parents bought Kinects for themselves or their children when they came out. I'm talking about lower middle class to middle class people as well. Not the super rich. I myself have all of those items except for the Kinect and I'm about as cheap/frugal as they come and they are definitely nothing special. I'd consider a HDMI cord ($17 at Best Buy) and the battery charger very very standard to have. Again, I'm talking too the average consumer that runs out to Best Buy to get their items.

[Skidz]

You're kidding yourself if you don't think Joe Dad and Jane Mom do not buy those type of things for their kids. They are extremely average. Numerous friends and even their parents bought Kinects for themselves or their children when they came out. I'm talking about lower middle class to middle class people as well. Not the super rich. I myself have all of those items except for the Kinect and I'm about as cheap/frugal as they come and they are definitely nothing special. I'd consider a HDMI cord ($17 at Best Buy) and the battery charger very very standard to have. Again, I'm talking too the average consumer that runs out to Best Buy to get their items.

Is that the market you think will drop $800 on a gaming PC?

[BadKarma]

You're part of the problem.


This is pretty much completely true. Consoles are basically computers that can't do as much as a computer can do and have inferior graphics, UI, and control settings. Not to mention constant bullshit like more expensive games(no steam for consoles..even used games don't compare to steam sales), horrible pay to play online(xbox live..what), VASTLY inferior internet online options with less control, inability to pick actual servers, or just a sloppy UI mess.

Modding on PC is also huge, there's mods for TL2, diablo2, sim city 4, and tons of other games that add infinite content that extend the life of the game by years. The synergies mod(TL2) adds 3 new classes to a game that only has 4, tons new maps, new enemies, new items, etc. That could NEVER exist on a console.

There's just no reason to play on a console over a PC if the game exists on both platforms. PC gives you everything a console does and much much more, once console exclusives go away we'll see even more games on a PC(Gabe just talked to a lot of JP devs to get their games on steam and we're seeing lots more Jp games on steam lately). I hope the future of gaming turns into PC being the major focus, because steam is so great for buying/organizing/keeping track of your games, and the ability to mod and download mods with steamworkshop is so easily accessible even the dumbest people can do it.

I currently only play on my PC and handhelds(I own every console but a PS3, and almost every old console besides virtual boy or other retarded ones like that), but I wish a lot of handheld games I own like Project Diva/MH/Etrian oddysey/jrpgs/god eater would come to PC. The customization, modding, control options, etc are just so much better on PC it's insane.

Consoles need to either not exist or go back to $150-200 price ranges and can ONLY play video games, none of this social media netflix hulu dvd player blueray motion control and whatever the fuck else they keep cramming into our consoles. Get a PC if you wanna do all that shit, consoles should be for playing VIDEO GAMES, computers for EVERYTHING ELSE. I'm pretty sure more people would buy consoles if they were only for gaming with free online multiplayer like PS3(fuck you microsoft) and would make the companies more money. Most people want a console to play video games, but you make them have all this other unneeded shit, making them cost more to make, making them cost more to buy, and making less people buy them. Fucking stupid.

I live in the city. I really couldn't give a fuck about the people in bumble fuck, usa

[Kalmado]

Is that the market you think will drop $800 on a gaming PC?

If it was marketed correctly towards them, then yes. It's no different than people that have no business owning a cell phone period yet they own the new iPhone every new release and they pay $100+/month for their bill. If anything is marketed correctly people will think they need it and do whatever it takes to get it.

[Krandor]

I live in the city. I really couldn't give a fuck about the people in bumble fuck, usa

I didn't know Adam Orth was a BG poster.

Also, the post you quoted had absolutely nothing to do with your reply.

[Tyrath]

The portability argument is a little skewed. A laptop is obviously going to beat a console in that department, though that is definitely a field where price is very much getting involved (along the lines of "OMGZ PC COST SO MUCH," except you know, true), since a decent gaming laptop is going to be starting in the $1000 range.

Yeah, thats kinda my point.

[Sho]

I live in the city. I really couldn't give a fuck about the people in bumble fuck, usa

Again, this is a problem with the DRM argument and people who support it. The problem with a DRM hinges on the fact that not everyone lives in a city with decent internet, unlike yourself. It has to be marketable to EVERYONE, including that guy that lives in Bumble Fuck, USA with terrible internet speeds.

The console vs PC argument is outdated, but is still relevant. Consoles definitely should not be as expensive as they currently have been of late when it comes to initial starting prices. However the argument is only valid when it comes to gaming laptops, which are usually double the cost of a console regardless. When you purchase a console, you purchase it for various reasons:

1) Console exclusive games
2) Multiplayer games
3) Portability
4) Extreme simplicity for non-technical, casual, gamers
5) Full processing power mainly dedicated to gaming alone
6) Motion controlled games
7) Cost (vs Mid/High End PC Gaming Rigs)
8) Included Component/HDMI Cables for TV
9) Included Blu-Ray Player (PS3)

Extra stuff is added to consoles after that for added convenience and marketability. No one is going to purchase a console system that does not have Hulu/Netflix/Youtube/Facebook/Twitter access, when these functions are basic on PC.

Of course PC gaming is leaps and bounds ahead of console if most of these factors aren't a problem. However, these factors are for many gamers-- enough to warrant the continued need for consoles in the gaming market. Even so, gaming companies are definitely going too far when it comes to pricing these consoles. Nothing should be worth more 300$ now or back then when PS3/XBOX360 was released.

[dejet]

You're kidding yourself if you don't think Joe Dad and Jane Mom do not buy those type of things for their kids. They are extremely average. Numerous friends and even their parents bought Kinects for themselves or their children when they came out. I'm talking about lower middle class to middle class people as well. Not the super rich. I myself have all of those items except for the Kinect and I'm about as cheap/frugal as they come and they are definitely nothing special. I'd consider a HDMI cord ($17 at Best Buy) and the battery charger very very standard to have. Again, I'm talking too the average consumer that runs out to Best Buy to get their items.

and you think joe dad and jane mom are going to build a good PC for that price? no, they are going to spend on the line for 2,000 for a pre built crap dell PC. You can not use the average user and then name the geek PC buffs we average on here. Yes 90% of us can build a PC that would kick the crap out of a console for under $700, the average person however wont.

edit: in that case lets use how I bought my PS3. Used off Ebay for $100 needed to fix the YLOD; that ran me under $20 seeing as I had the heat gun and thermal paste. Already had a TV. My HDMI ran me $1.50 online and my optic ran around the same.

So id say I win the the cost game against your PC build by a long shot. Anyone on this board most likely could of done what I did.