Enforcement Actions in Boston

**hey** · 2013-04-20 09:31

Originally Posted by Tyrath

Maybe it was more so in the Waterton area, but if you don't understand why people in those area should've been staying in for their own safety, I don't even know what to tell you. Not gonna have much freedoms if you're dead.

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Or something.

**Dimmauk** · 2013-04-20 09:52

It didn't take fox news long to comment/mock people up north on the new gun laws. This was yesterday morning.

**Tyrath** · 2013-04-20 11:54

Originally Posted by hey

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Or something.

Yeah fuck off with that quote. It's talking about when you start giving up liberties because of the fear of potential threats. This was a very real threat right in everyone's face. There was no essential liberty taken away here. A madman who was heavily armed with guns and explosives, who had already shown he didn't care for the lives of innocent people, was on the loose. I would be inviting the SWAT/FBI/Police/National Guard/Everyone else to come over and get rid of him.

**Boyiee** · 2013-04-20 13:44

Originally Posted by NynJa

who clearly is NOT afraid to use them.

This is one of the biggest things. Guy commits a massacre, guy kills police. He had nothing to lose and the fact that he didn't kill himself or take as many with him as possible is shocking. In his mind he probably wasn't making it out alive, so what's stopping him from plowing through more bodies?

When a guy kills a cop and enters a neighborhood, everyone is at risk. A cop entering your home really isn't that big of a deal at this point, because this guy obviously isn't gonna get off. It's either jail, or death. And at that point its either your family or your neighbors at risk. When a person smells smoke in their house, we search the entire fucking thing. Got a bong on the table? Don't really care. Underwear hanging from the doors? Don't really care. I want to find the source so that me, my partners, and your family are safe and then I want to get the fuck out.

**Churchill** · 2013-04-20 13:52

I'd argue that the situation you described is actually extremely dangerous for you (civilian) to have a cop in your home.

**noblemountain** · 2013-04-20 13:53

Originally Posted by hey

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Or something.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. - John Stuart Mill

**Boyiee** · 2013-04-20 14:17

Originally Posted by Churchill

I'd argue that the situation you described is actually extremely dangerous for you (civilian) to have a cop in your home.

You're standing outside while they clear the rooms for 2-5 minutes, I don't see how its dangerous. Or you could sit in the kitchen with an officer protecting you while the rest clear the house.

**Churchill** · 2013-04-20 14:29

Was more referring to the fact that you could just as likely get shot as be protected.

**Helm** · 2013-04-20 14:41

` -. ) How many were shot/protected in Watertown? I'm confused why you'd think people are somehow more likely to get shot.

**Dimmauk** · 2013-04-20 14:43

Originally Posted by Helm

` -. ) How many were shot/protected in Watertown? I'm confused why you'd think people are somehow more likely to get shot than protected.

4?

**Helm** · 2013-04-20 14:51

Tremendously productive reply from someone the question wasn't really even directed at, thank you. >_>

**Callisto** · 2013-04-20 14:58

Does anyone have the count of people who were arrested/threatened arrest for not choosing to stay inside? Don't recall seeing those figures.

**Tyrath** · 2013-04-20 15:04

Originally Posted by Callisto

Does anyone have the count of people who were arrested/threatened arrest for not choosing to stay inside? Don't recall seeing those figures.

Like I said on the previous page. I'm in Boston right now and I saw a lot of people moving around in 2 of the towns that were supposed to be locked down but didn't see anyone getting in trouble for it. Can't speak for the hotzone in Watertown, but the rest of Boston didn't resemble anything like a police state, more like a state of emergency than anything else.

**Callisto** · 2013-04-20 15:05

So then, how do we quantify the number of people whose rights were taken away by the police state, I think this is definitely something we need to know

**archibaldcrane** · 2013-04-20 15:14

Remember kids - police can lie to you. Just because they tell you to stay inside doesn't mean you have to stay inside.

**archibaldcrane** · 2013-04-20 15:15

I'm more troubled by the forced entry into buildings where they have no specific reason to believe that the bomber was inside than I am by the "lockdown".

**archibaldcrane** · 2013-04-20 15:17

If you were home during a situation like that, and the cops come by, and you act fairly belligerent and just get into "get off my lawn ya darn cops, come back with a warrant", can they say "fuck you" and enter anyway?

**Tyrath** · 2013-04-20 15:17

Dude was in the area and missing. He was clearly hiding on someone's property, it was necessary to do a house by house search to clear the area for the safety of everyone there.

And oh look, he ended up being found on someone's property. They just didn't have their perimeter wide enough and he was just outside of it.

**archibaldcrane** · 2013-04-20 15:18

Originally Posted by Tyrath

Dude was in the area and missing. He was clearly hiding on someone's property, it was necessary to do a house by house search to clear the area for the safety of everyone there.

And oh look, he ended up being found on someone's property. They just didn't have their perimeter wide enough and he was just outside of it.

So what you're saying is that the killer was not in the area they were searching.

That's the point. They didn't have specific reason to search any of those houses, and they were wrong about their assumption that he was even in that specific area.

**archibaldcrane** · 2013-04-20 15:22

The question is - how big of an area are you comfortable with the cops kicking down doors? How vague of an "I think he's 'round here somewhere" are you willing to tolerate before they engage in such an activity?

Also, comparing this to a house on fire or a 911 call to a specific address is completely different - in those cases, even if you don't have permission to enter, you know there is an immediate threat/danger on that specific property.

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