Delve

[Ranth]

i also thought so but both are close... and eft infact is easier than raptor ; ;

during the 30 sec phase of mobs gaining double damage, raptor can potentially kill people

also seeing jem's death i assume he was the sacrificial lamb for decoy shot, which makes my friend's point valid:

does it work way better if you use DRG for it? angon and super jump.......

That's what we've been using. Of course you need a DRG that has the gear/knows how to properly utilize jumps and positioning for RNGs.

[Ophannus]

Mocchi said a few weeks ago:

It's tough to know if our strategy is working. Please introduce clear messages.

First, as some additional information on this content, there are no random weaknesses where the WS or magic spells change like Voidwatch for Delve to show your strategy is accurate. To give a better idea, it's probably close to the way that defense is lowered while under the effect of Dia. Of course it's not limited to certain magic like Dia only, but for example, by doing [XXXX] the damage reduction% will decrease by 1% or evasion will be reduced by 10.

I wonder if this was an actual example of a weakness of a current delve NM or just an example simply to demonstrate.

[Diomer]

Quick question for people who left Tax'et + some other NM unlocked for Bee; did Tax'et appear in the earlier area that isn't blocked by a wall when you leave him as one of the two unlocked NMs? Or do you have to kill the first NM that you left unlocked to drop that wall and then kill Tax'et finally dropping the wall to the Bee?

[macross]

Nothing spawns till the first wall drops, even in normal farming fractures. It's same as normal, kill the one nm, and wall will drop with taxet behind that. If you lock t1-t3 and kill those then both 2nd wall and boss wall drop on the 2nd NM death.

Only hard part is practicing and not having one idiot screw stuff up. You pretty much fail, learn, adjust, and try again with said adjustments till you win. I doubt any true pickup will just go in and win first try, is alot of little nuances you gotta figure out by practicing. Heck the day we tried toji, we just go in, kill one nm, if it goes bad we just exit and try again. Can't be getting lost running to boss etc lol.

But yeah would still like to see screenshots of some proof they have killed it. Gotta be tons of peeps running around with super h2hs if it's on farm mode ya? I know when we kill it you will see a bunch just standing around in town with the new gear on.

[Diomer]

Nothing spawns till the first wall drops, even in normal farming fractures. It's same as normal, kill the one nm, and wall will drop with taxet behind that. If you lock t1-t3 and kill those then both 2nd wall and boss wall drop on the 2nd NM death.

Only hard part is practicing and not having one idiot screw stuff up. You pretty much fail, learn, adjust, and try again with said adjustments till you win. I doubt any true pickup will just go in and win first try, is alot of little nuances you gotta figure out by practicing. Heck the day we tried toji, we just go in, kill one nm, if it goes bad we just exit and try again. Can't be getting lost running to boss etc lol.

But yeah would still like to see screenshots of some proof they have killed it. Gotta be tons of peeps running around with super h2hs if it's on farm mode ya? I know when we kill it you will see a bunch just standing around in town with the new gear on.

Yeah that's the part I was curious about; I could see Tax'et and Twith or Chapuli being quicker if you could get to Tax'et right away, but if it's still behind that first wall, then Chapuli and Twith seem quicker to me.

[Arthars]

reason no one buy weapons yet is prolly becausre they saving up for more... or they dont even have 180kish plasm

people i know all dont have that much, because they crazy upgraders and R15 nearly all the useful items

i had 800k at oine point, dropped to 500k now cos i sold some +2s to make my relic bow free XD

plasm is good money and easy to farm....

[CubsWoo]

Tried 3 boxing Kurma to see how enspell spam worked.

Managed to get kurma down to 61% before dying at about the 17-18min mark (I had to spend a fair amount of time in PDT gear and some hate issues arose from spamming cure 4). I wasn't very fortunate on tortoise song spam but enthunder was definitely causing MDT to go up quite fast. Enspells had pretty low macc but after the first 8% (first reset) I had gotten up to 59dmg unresisted enthunder, first unresisted enthunder was 15 damage. Completely forgot to use formless strikes so can't comment on that.

Assuming it raises the MDT directly, 2 mnks and 2 mura sams should have 0 issues taking this down in well under the time limit. MNK MNK SAM SAM BRD WHM should be feasible but curing may be an issue when it begins to use tremor. Hopefully will get a chance to test this soon. If mura doesn't work then 4 mnks with enspell should be able to achieve something similar.

I took this strat and applied it to a full alliance of pickup players. Setup after one failed attempt (timed out at ~16%) was:
MNK MNK MNK SCH/RDM WHM BRD
MNK MNK MNK SCH/RDM WHM BRD
PLD WHM BRD SCH/RDM BLM BLM

Songs were double Madrigal until 50% and Madrigal/Scherzo after 50%. Non-pickup groups can probably use Marches or whatever since your accuracy is probably better than ours was.

Things we noticed: Enspell damage(outside of spikes during Kurma's TP moves) starts at 1 and moves up to 7 and stays there. If there's a way to push enspell damage farther I'm not sure how, but it did serve as a good method to inform the mages how the resist progression was going without them needing to spam spells to test it.

- Head Butt seemed to lower Kurma's blunt resistance slightly, as did Tortoise Stomp. I'm not 100% sure on either of these, but blunt damage seemed fairly normal for Rigors for most of the fight.

- Harden Shell can be removed with Finale with no consequence to the magic damage resistance. Kurma resists light and dark debuffs like crazy so you may need your BRD to Troubadour it.

- Formless Strikes doesn't seem useful at all.

- Tetsudo Tremor seems stunnable on reaction but it felt like the charge time was shorter and shorter the closer Kurma was to 0%.

- I don't think a PLD is necessary to do this strategy, and MNKs can probably be swapped out for other low delay 1H DDs to help push the multiplier with enspells. DNC might be really good for Kurma for keeping Box and Stutter Step on it.

- I'm not sure how we locked it (it wasn't silenced, best I can tell) but on our winning fight Kurma only did Tortoise Song once, around 70%. It seemed to me that enmity was very fluid during the fight, and he was bouncing between the MNKs taking hate from each other frequently. This is only an observational theory, but it could be possible that Tortoise Song is triggered by one person being on the top of the hate list for a set period of time.

Thanks for the idea, Fake - it worked for us!

[Raelia]

Is it plausible that Tortoise Song is only available to it when Harden Shell isn't dispelled?

[CubsWoo]

Is it plausible that Tortoise Song is only available to it when Harden Shell isn't dispelled?

Doubtful, we didn't try to dispel/finale it until around ~20%.

[Helel]

Yeah that's the part I was curious about; I could see Tax'et and Twith or Chapuli being quicker if you could get to Tax'et right away, but if it's still behind that first wall, then Chapuli and Twith seem quicker to me.

Can confirm from my experience that locking T4-5 NMs is usually the best idea. We tried wamoura + butterfly our first attempt, and wamoura ended up being further down one of the tunnels (wasn't in the big room). It was mess trying to pull it and sack adds. I would definitely go for chap/butterfly.

[Fake]

Mastop; not sure if its any new information but may help.

Emetic discharge seems to require 2 debuffs and is close/is 100% chance to use with 2+ debuffs on.

The switching damage scale is either magic<>physical or is type specific, hard to say since since we didn't have many DD.

With 2 Mura SAM, MNK, DRK, muleTHF(parsing 1-2%) as only DD we were killing in 8-12 minutes, 12 characters total with most people 2-3 boxing. If sams didn't use mura it would die much much slower.

You could easily get kills down under 5mins with a well balanced DD alliance (pld is a wasted slot on everything except fracture bosses now, maybe cracklaw?). Just make sure you have 3-4 people assigned to do nothing but spam dia/helix/threnody/DoT, thf should be spamming eva down step with full acc build, geo is always good. If you aren't getting debuffs up as soon as it uses emetic then booming bombilation will slow kills down and leave a decent chance of someone getting rail roaded by the defense down. Obviously don't let DDs use any AE weaponskills that will hurt killspeed.

At that point it wouldn't be worth depopping it til you get message unless you had other stuff in zone to farm during, but Mastop will die faster than the scorp (I'd depop this one, fights are long due to stun spam, melees will get killed randomly and you need something like ochain pld spamming dia to remove any chance of Earthbreaker>Earthbreaker) and about as fast as Tax'et with a smart group.

[kenshyn]

Tried 3 boxing Kurma to see how enspell spam worked.

Managed to get kurma down to 61% before dying at about the 17-18min mark (I had to spend a fair amount of time in PDT gear and some hate issues arose from spamming cure 4). I wasn't very fortunate on tortoise song spam but enthunder was definitely causing MDT to go up quite fast. Enspells had pretty low macc but after the first 8% (first reset) I had gotten up to 59dmg unresisted enthunder, first unresisted enthunder was 15 damage. Completely forgot to use formless strikes so can't comment on that.

Assuming it raises the MDT directly, 2 mnks and 2 mura sams should have 0 issues taking this down in well under the time limit. MNK MNK SAM SAM BRD WHM should be feasible but curing may be an issue when it begins to use tremor. Hopefully will get a chance to test this soon. If mura doesn't work then 4 mnks with enspell should be able to achieve something similar.

This is interesting wonder if /run would be effective since 2 runes normally hit much harder than a enspell.

Anyone figure out what skill enfeeble is needed to successfully blind this fer Tutewehiwehi? Seems impossible to gauge the amount of fail going on to kill this mfer...

[macross]

Decently geared rdm with blindII works fine to blind.

just have everyone sub/nin for scorp, can block the stun. drk/nin will be best since you don't need to rely on hasso for max haste.

[fantasticdan]

Can blind it fine as a sch or whm with a semi-competent enfeeble set and chatoyant staff, it is not resistant at all.

[noodles355]

I had no trouble landing Blind as Sch. So that's what, 404 skill? My enfeeb sets aren't even that great as I can't afford the inventory space for many enfeeb specific things so it's made mostly of stuff from other sets:

Chatoyant, Arbuda, Treatise
Nares/Hyksos, AF3, Aredan, Loquac.
AF3+2, Rubeus, Omega, Icesoul/Balrahn's
Kaikias's, Wanion/Casso, AF3+2, Rubeus/Nares.

[Byrthnoth]

Does the bee have knockback or conal moves? I'm trying to figure out how we should position people. It would be nice to be able to be able to put the rangers behind a paladin for Decoy Shot. Being behind the Geo would be the worst case scenario, I guess.

[noodles355]

It has the same TP moves as Colkhab, it just gains access to Denouement and Apotheosis from 100% HP. So stinger volley is still conal.

[Byrthnoth]

How large are the AoEs? People still don't actually know much/anything about how Decoy Shot works, right?

[ccl]

How large are the AoEs? People still don't actually know much/anything about how Decoy Shot works, right?

Supposedly -20enmity on tp gear make the rng take 0 hate, doesn't work on WS. If you stand 20 can decoy shot pld, but bee might have push back move, not sure, (def need a wall for Tojil)

[Mafai]

How large are the AoEs? People still don't actually know much/anything about how Decoy Shot works, right?

When we did bee we did this in the tunnel, the pipes are the wall.:

|PLD BEE|
|----PLD|
|--------|
|--------|
|--------|
|WHM RNG|

The PLD's would swap back and forth if they pulled hate on side. Our rangers pulled hate twice, a 11k barrage and a 19k barrage. I recall dying to the bee within 10. This seemed like a normal attack, not a TP move. I don't believe I had hate when it happened. All of its attacks might be AoE?