Delve

[Yubar]

Only reason why I said "I don't know for sure" is because I'm one of the two GEOs in the group. I'm hanging back casting Geo-Frailty and Indi-Focus. lol

You should have no problem staying near Tojil with a Geo and Indi spells from yourself with a good PDT, eating tacos, and keeping Phalax on.

[Malithar]

You should have no problem staying near Tojil with a Geo and Indi spells from yourself with a good PDT, eating tacos, and keeping Phalax on.

Doesn't sound like that's his issue, as one Geo stays out of range and does a Geo-Frailty/Torpor and Indi-Focus, while the other is in range doing Indi-Languor and Geo-Frailty/Torpor.

[Yeager]

Doesn't sound like that's his issue, as one Geo stays out of range and does a Geo-Frailty/Torpor and Indi-Focus, while the other is in range doing Indi-Languor and Geo-Frailty/Torpor.

Yes, the other GEO in the group is the one that runs into range and does Geo-Torpor/Indi-Languor and that person doesn't post on BG. I'm the one that stands back and I cover Geo-Frailty and Indi-Focus

[Damane]

Yes, the other GEO in the group is the one that runs into range and does Geo-Torpor/Indi-Languor and that person doesn't post on BG. I'm the one that stands back and I cover Geo-Frailty and Indi-Focus

do your schs or geos impact teh eft peist and kurma? (also tojil later on but thats for the geos). usually I do them on geo on all 4 or as a sch on the pre NMs except peiste (to not let calcyfing get off during my casting). Every debuff adds up. with a good set your sch and geos should have no problem stickign impact to the pre NMs and tojil.

[Yeager]

do your schs or geos impact teh eft peist and kurma? (also tojil later on but thats for the geos). usually I do them on geo on all 4 or as a sch on the pre NMs except peiste (to not let calcyfing get off during my casting). Every debuff adds up. with a good set your sch and geos should have no problem stickign impact to the pre NMs and tojil.

I carry my Twilight Cloak on me, as well as one of the SCHs. But whenever we try to use Impact, the debuffs will literally wear off within 5-10 seconds. It's gotten to the point we simply don't bother, as 10 secs of debuff doesn't justify the cost of 666 MP.

[Karbuncle]

Most of the time they Elemental Seal > Impact to make the debuffs stick longer. IDK if thats still practiced but thats generally how we did it back when.

[Damane]

I carry my Twilight Cloak on me, as well as one of the SCHs. But whenever we try to use Impact, the debuffs will literally wear off within 5-10 seconds. It's gotten to the point we simply don't bother, as 10 secs of debuff doesn't justify the cost of 666 MP.

then you need to work on your debuffing gear. I can stick impact with full duration on my GEO or SCH without the need of ES. Indi-focus or voidstorm + klimaform do the job with tons of m.acc and a magian m.acc dark staff (or the club from yumcax now). The only NM resisting impact is tojil and that are sometimes only 1/2 resists and rarely 1/4 resists.

You should be able to get impact on half duration/full duration consistantly on pre NMs with good gear. later when you augment your bokwus legs/feet with m.acc get some tojil hands etc etc etc. you will land it usually with full duration np.

Start upgradeing your m.acc gear with the earrings from delve, the backpiece etc. and get some pre Delve gear with good m.acc on it. Biggest thing woudl be the m.acc magian dark trial staff or yumcax club. just to start off.

you can also hold off pre NMs endlessly when you max out your m.acc gear with sleep, they barely resist it anymore. and if they do start resist it you are prolly 10 min + into the fight with another NM.

obviously if you are stickign impact with geo you need to carry meds with you vile elxir hi-elixir and pro-ether +3 do the job (you dont need to use all 3 up in 1 run, but they help if you get fully resisted once).

[Yeager]

then you need to work on your debuffing gear. I can stick impact with full duration on my GEO or SCH without the need of ES. Indi-focus or voidstorm + klimaform do the job with tons of m.acc and a magian m.acc dark staff (or the club from yumcax now). The only NM resisting impact is tojil and that are sometimes only 1/2 resists and rarely 1/4 resists.

You should be able to get impact on half duration/full duration consistantly on pre NMs with good gear. later when you augment your bokwus legs/feet with m.acc get some tojil hands etc etc etc. you will land it usually with full duration np.

Start upgradeing your m.acc gear with the earrings from delve, the backpiece etc. and get some pre Delve gear with good m.acc on it. Biggest thing woudl be the m.acc magian dark trial staff or yumcax club. just to start off.

you can also hold off pre NMs endlessly when you max out your m.acc gear with sleep, they barely resist it anymore. and if they do start resist it you are prolly 10 min + into the fight with another NM.

obviously if you are stickign impact with geo you need to carry meds with you vile elxir hi-elixir and pro-ether +3 do the job (you dont need to use all 3 up in 1 run, but they help if you get fully resisted once).

So the debuff duration from Impact is related to the amount of Magic Accuracy? Interesting. I'll go over my gear then, but inventory space is already a serious issue due to carrying PDT, MDT, and MAB sets on me.

[Damane]

So the debuff duration from Impact is related to the amount of Magic Accuracy? Interesting. I'll go over my gear then, but inventory space is already a serious issue due to carrying PDT, MDT, and MAB sets on me.

Impact is just a debuff that has a side effect of dealing dmg, you can just tell exactly if it resisted 1/2 1/4 or totally by the amount of dmg it deals. On NMs that have loads of MDT or so you deal 200 dmg impact and think its fully resisted, but it actually landed fully (the NM just takes little magic dmg) and stays on for 3 min until you see the message of AGI DEX STR etc down wearing off.

on tojil on the firs 25% 1k + impact means it did stick fully and lasts 3 min, below 75% HP it takes reduced magic dmg, so an impact of 500 equals a non resist and a duration of 3 min.

and scrap MAB gear. Nukeing is dead, store it somewhere when you rarely needed.

[Motenten]

As someone pointed out my earlier analysis, I'll note some things I've learned since then. Unfortunately I don't have damage output parsed for our first winning run, so mostly doing indirect assessments.

In the original post where I noted our performance, it was 440 DPS during Hundred Fists, and 300 DPS after that (magic phase), and took 260 seconds. In our winning run, we hit 75% at 3 minutes (180 seconds), for an average DPS of 450 per mnk. Assuming 50% higher DPS during Hundred Fists vs without, that would approximate to 580 DPS during Hundred Fists and 385 without, about a 30% increase in damage output.

Several mnks had not completed their AF2+2 relic/augments prior to that. Getting that done meant we had 60 seconds of Hundred Fists instead of 45, and a better buffer on Formless Strikes. That would raise the average DPS some just because of how much time was spent in each segment.

On our first winning run we used 3 geos. Two of them alternated geo- spells to be sure Languor (I think?) was always up. This wouldn't be as necessary today because of the reduced cast time (2 seconds instead of 8 seconds). However we also had ~9 minutes of Bolstered effects instead of just 6, keeping things from dropping off at the end of the fight, which I think was a significant aid in getting the win.

We started really optimizing party swaps around this time. Poor party swap speed for brds and cors can really slow things down, and really hurt if it happens during SV/N/T.

We had the cors do /dnc to add in Box Step. That likely contributed a fair bit to the improved damage output.

Getting lucky with Wild Card. Make sure the cors have their AF2+2 feet. Also, AF2+2 head for longer duration rolls, and legs for Snake Eye. Some groups prefer 5/5 Winning Streak; I think 5/5 Snake Eye is the better option.

It was those early, almost-win parses that led to my estimation of Tojil's defense of ~1900, which in turn led to the decision to add in Box Step for extra defense down to improve damage output.

We'd tried an earlier experiment with pizza, but it left enough of a deficit in accuracy (particularly after SV buffs wore off, if Wild Card didn't reset them) that it wasn't worth it compared to sushi. The extra attack was better made up for in buffs and debuffs.

For Embrava, we've always used it on the eft and on Kurma, never on Tojil. Given that we're using SV songs on Tojil, the only benefit is the regen on the DDs, and extra MP for the mages; it's not really much value in speeding up the fight itself, and the MP isn't needed if the mages are getting Ballads (or, in an emergency, vile elixirs). It probably wouldn't be bad to move the eft Embrava to Tojil, but if any DD at all dies on the eft, that slows the next couple fights down (possibly a significant amount), which in turn reduces how much time you have available for Tojil. It's a risk, and probably not worth taking if you haven't had your first win yet.

Speaking of MP, whms need to have good curing efficiency. This is very difficult to quantify, but some whms seem to burn through their MP incredibly fast. Even for myself, where I know I'm very good at maintaining MP, I had issues on our first win. Problems with keeping Ballads up meant I used both a Vile Elixir and a +1 during that fight.

[dasva]

So the debuff duration from Impact is related to the amount of Magic Accuracy? Interesting. I'll go over my gear then, but inventory space is already a serious issue due to carrying PDT, MDT, and MAB sets on me.

Pretty much all debuffs durations are related to resist states so yeah macc help ad well as - meva on the nm

[Yeager]

Ok, I put together a little bit of a Magic Accuracy set specifically for Impact. Other than Angha Ring, is there another Ring that offers Magic Accuracy? Also, I don't have enough plasm yet to obtain the M. Acc earring set, and the cape. That will come eventually, though.

So far, I've got a total of +53 Magic Accuracy in gear. Will that suffice until I am able to get the Earring set and the cape?

[Fwahm]

Balrahn's ring, Omega ring, Mediator's ring all give MACC.

[Yeager]

Balrahn's ring, Omega ring, Mediator's ring all give MACC.

Nabbed a Mediator's Ring. TYVM for the suggestion. I didn't even see it on the AH until you mentioned it here.

[Taint]

We have our DRG sub DNC. CORs sub WHM and Erase/Haste a melee.

WHMx2,CORx2,BRDx2 each Erase/Haste 1 Melee. CORs are always rotating and so are the BRDs. (One 4 song BRD, One 2 song BRD)

We bring 3 SCHs. 2 for Stun, 1 for Extra healing, dispeling. First Stun SCH Embravas for Kurma. 2nd Stun Embravas before Tojil is pulled. 3rd SCH /RDM Embravas half way through Tojil. First embrava isn't doing much but making healing easier and keepign MP topped off. 2nd Embrava really helped us keep DPS up when songs dropped and while we attempted to reapply.

[GeneyusTitan]

We also have 1 GEO do both frailty and torpor so that bolster is affecting both of them. When bolster is about to wear off that GEO will put up both languor/focus then the two geos switch places and the second GEO bolsters frailty/torpor again.

How much accuracy do your melees have before buffs? You can use FFXI calc to count. Or you can tell us their dex, combat skill, and how much +acc they have in gear. All signs are pointing to this being the problem.

[grevenilvec75]

Don't forget Parsimony for Impact, if MP is that big of an issue.

[Gokku]

I was told to hit 630 acc before food buffs etc. I belive I've done so 632 in acc based on capped hth + faith torque, and then my dps set. Add focus/begressor and I'm sitting on a almost 700 acc with either pizza or sushi active. Haven't done to tojil yet but when I do ill post the parse if my acc.

[GeneyusTitan]

630 should be fine. Use bream sushi +1. Your acc should be capped unless you're running into buff issues. Could you post your sets specifically to see if there's places where you can see gains?

[Ihina]

So I'm just out playing with Kurma solo on rdm/sch because why the hell not, kiting/nuking it around the pond east of its spawn point. I was always interested in exactly how this mob works.

Especially resistant today for some reason, sleep/bind/gravity didn't land at all.

I start by casting Thunder about 10 or so times, each landed for 109. Prior to using a tp move, I guess +damage doesn't cumulate.

First TP move was Tortoise Song, which didn't do anything at all. I had no brd/cor buffs and Kurma had no damage cumulations on it.

Second TP move was Harden Shell, and what follows is what's expected. 109, 119, 130, 141, 152, 163, 174, 185, 97(resist), 207, 218, 228, 239, 250, 261, 272, 272, 272, 272. It seems like Harden Shell itself doesn't increase the damage taken; it only raises the cap. It also seems it caps off around 250% of base damage, and it caps after 15 nukes.

So I proceeded to Thunder4 it for 1605 each time for a few minutes, which accumluated TP, which it used to do Aqua Breath on me. Next Thunder4, 1765. Ok, must have been a magic crit or something. Next Thunder4, 1925, then 2085, then I figured something was up. According to BGwiki, that should not have happened, but it did, so I went back to Thunder1'ing it. 34(bad equip), 345, 437, 462, 490, 517, 612, 642, 645, 332(switched in Apamajas 1), 577(Apamajas II), 767(Tamaxchi here[I think] on out), 767, which is 703% or the original base or 282% of the previous cap. I'm sure there's a nice, pretty fraction the game code uses. Also, I count 15 nukes until cap again.

Switched to Thunder4 and each nuke did 4016, which is oddly enough 250% of the previous cap's thunder4. Did another Aqua Breath on me but nuke damage stayed at 4016 for the rest of the fight.

It depopped after a bunch more nukes (got it to 92% woo), so I don't know if it's damage accumlation continues to increase from there. I'll be interested to see how well my BLM does against it solo.

So yeah, thanks for reading!


edit: Switched to BLM from here on out. Round 2 was a bit more annoying, it used Earth Breath -> Harden shell -> Tortoise Song -> Harden Shell x4 -> Aqua Breath. Earth Breath didn't do squat to my nuke damage. The first Harden Shell increased my damage, but successive uses did squat. It depopped about 2 minutes after it used Aqua Breath, which did increase/build my damage, so I didn't have much time to nuke it down. Got it to 90% though just spamming thunder1 the whole time.

Full powered nukes eventually did 8k a piece. If you're lucky with TP moves and have a brd for MP, I can see 3 BLMs being able to kill this.

edit2: Round 3. Opened with Aqua Breath, which did increase it's damage taken; so the previous thinking that magic is fixed to Harden Shell is wrong. It followed up with a Harden Shell, which fully capped me after a bunch of Thunder1 spamming, pushing my eventual Thunder5 up to 7500-7800-ish (Lightningday was over, so nukes were a bit weaker). It did another Tortoise Song mid-fight, so I had to start all over, but ultimately, I got it to 78% on BLM/RDM with my brd mule giving me ballads. sub-70% is easily possible if it didn't use Tortoise song mid-fight.

It's unfortunate all my uber-blm friends quit.

In case anyone's curious, I had +158macc from gear, 106+112int and 447 elemental skill. Maybe 3-4 resists on my nukes throughout the 20 minutes.