Super Smash Bros.

[Genosync]

The major issue here is the Melee scene has such an excessive hard on for said technical aspects that it's probably going to impede a competitive scene for Sm4sh after the newness wears off.

The current major issue impeding Smash 4's competitive scene is the ridiculous campy defensive style of play of certain characters/people with Smash 4 creating extended match times that delay Melee when scheduled to be on the same exact stream (see VGbootcamp during Apex). That caused so much frustration that it was unreal. Also, no one likes to see Dabuz and Abandango run around a stage like little pansies for 20+ minutes to play a Best of 3. That totally put a bad taste in people's mouths. I stayed up until 3:30am watching and talking about Melee finals after that and nearly died at work/school the next day.

What you're probably going to see is the similar kind of breakdown we had with Brawl and Melee. You'll have people that have always played Melee and will only play Melee, you'll have people that will play both and started on Melee, you'll have people that started on Brawl that eventually work their way over to Melee, and you'll have people that dabble in all Smash games. Replace Brawl with Smash4 and it's the same thing. Brawl and Melee eventually coexisted very well with each other, and after about 3 or so years, all of the fighting and bickering went away and people saw each game on its own. If anything, a competitive scene for Smash 4 is being impeded right now (partially due to how people are playing the game, mind you), and after 2-3 years you'll see it become nearly as hype as Melee.

And, oh yeah, PM's pretty awesome too. I think 3.0 was better than 3.5, but that's just me liking crazy combos too much.

[Thulius]

The current major issue impeding Smash 4's competitive scene is the ridiculous campy defensive style of play of certain characters/people with Smash 4 creating extended match times that delay Melee when scheduled to be on the same exact stream (see VGbootcamp during Apex).

I mean... They had to completely switch venues on the first day of the tournament and essentially run a 3 day tournament in 2. It's practically a miracle that they even managed to get through anything, let alone only a few hours behind schedule. I'm not saying there wasn't some super lame Smash 4 play at Apex but that's ignoring a pretty significant chunk of the story.

But yeah, the game's definitely got a long way to go before high level play evolves into something more interesting. Even with Diddy and Shiek being kind of obvious standouts, Smash 4 is far and away the most balanced in the series, so it's gonna take time before people get comfortable with matchups. Like there were people in top 8 still DIing into Diddy's d-throw...

[Cream Soda]

>Chain grabs
>High level

pick one

[Genosync]

>Chain grabs
>High level

pick one

Go consistently pull them off in Melee. The only ones that are dumb are Icies. The rest? I don't really feel that way. In a game where your stock can be taken in less than 15 seconds four times in a row, a chain grab is just another means to an end and still requires both proper timing/input and reaction.

[Cream Soda]

PAL version of melee is better @_@

[BaneTheBrawler]

man i wish they'd brought back ice climbers instead of some of these clones like dr. mario and dark pit. i fucking loved ice climbers... especially with items on.

[Deadgye]

Go consistently pull them off in Melee. The only ones that are dumb are Icies. The rest? I don't really feel that way. In a game where your stock can be taken in less than 15 seconds four times in a row, a chain grab is just another means to an end and still requires both proper timing/input and reaction.

Seconding. If I react to the opponents DI too slow, don't use the correct timing for the given %, or fuck up the jump cancel-- that chain grab ain't happening. Icy's chain grab across platforms takes some skill imo though. When I see an Icy player chain grab instead of wobbling, they receive some respect from me.

[Seraph]

man i wish they'd brought back ice climbers instead of some of these clones like dr. mario and dark pit. i fucking loved ice climbers... especially with items on.

Why the Dr. Mario hate? I'd rather they keep all the characters, even clones, and get rid of shit like Smash Tour assuming they had to make room somehow.

[Hitou]

Well, we're finally getting Mewtwo back so there's always a chance that other chars could come back as DLC too. I'm indifferent towards Dr. Mario but Dark Pit is a waste of a character slot. Sakurai has a hard time not including all of his characters from his other games. I'm surprised we didn't see waddle dee or prince puff or whatever. I personally hate ice climbers, but I'd take them in a heart beat over game and watch...

[Kaslo]

You know what would be the shit? Either a Geno or Johnathan Jones addition (amiibo too)

[Tyrath]

Aww yeah

Spoiler: show

[Meian]

man i wish they'd brought back ice climbers instead of some of these clones like dr. mario and dark pit. i fucking loved ice climbers... especially with items on.

Sakurai stated the "clones" did not really take that much extra time. So it was either these clones or none of them at all (and no additional characters in place of them).

[Kaslo]

Aww yeah

Spoiler: show

Got mine too! Megaman tomorrow!

[Ratatapa]

I want shulk for Xeno 3ds

[Eleven19]

Got my Shulk tonight too. Last one they had on preorder and no extras.

[Tyrath]

I want shulk for Xeno 3ds

I wish i had a new 3ds to use Shulk with. But meh

[IceSylph]

Aww yeah

Spoiler: show

Fuck yourself.

Got my Shulk tonight too. Last one they had on preorder and no extras.

Fuck yourself too.

[BaneTheBrawler]

Sakurai stated the "clones" did not really take that much extra time. So it was either these clones or none of them at all (and no additional characters in place of them).

yeah, i suppose clones are better than nothing but it still would have been nice. i don't really have a problem with them except that they're not even different characters, like ganondorf/falcon and fox/falco, they're just different skins of the same character (with admittedly tweaked values) and should have been in the game that way.

i guess dr. mario is at least sort of like zero suit in that he has different equipment (to a much lesser extent)... but dark pit? whats the difference?

[Cream Soda]

Ganon and Falcon are way different @_@. They have some of the same moves, but they have a lot of different moves as well. Falco and fox are way diff in this game as well. Lucina and Marth are 2 with the exact same move set, just diff properties. Pit/Dark pit are also the same (though the properties are different enough to where it would change your play style between the 2 chars).

Falco/fox and ganon/falcon though are pretty diff tbh

[Meian]

Ganondorf and Captain Falcon are way different though similar move sets.

As for Pit/Dark Pit, Pit is overall better because his arrows can curve (Dark Pit's is like 1% stronger at full charge) and his f-b can kill at much lower % than Dark Pit's. The subtle differences between clone chars overall can make a difference.

Also surprised no one mentioned this yet, Reddit's tier list:



Diddy is in a tier on his own but Sheik is very close by.

Not sure how to feel about Luigi/Pikachu being that high up (I feel Captain Falcon is higher than these two) and Ness (though he is pretty up there, maybe more in upper B+).

Zelda and Palutena could be higher up in C tier. Pretty nice to see Ganondorf up there though even though it is C.