FFXIV Random Complaint Thread: Look forward to it

[ronin sparthos]

I mean did you seriously just say FFXIV is more elitist because you pop open Duty Finder and sometimes people are dicks when in FFXI you had to meet a raiding group's gear checks in private before being able to do anything?

Stop pretending like its just DF. Shouts in Mor Dhona for trivial shit demand you have ace-tier gear or you're a scrub not worth doing anything with. No Relic+1? You're a scrub. AF in Wanderer's Palace? Ok, time to drop out of the run. Wipe once in AK? Not having it. The playerbase has already gone to shit and we're a few months in on this rollercoaster ride. This coming from a game that was designed to not be another instance of Tanaka buttfucking you with 7% rates on Leaping Boots or needing to write out an essay on your obscure Blind set.

People aspired to better gear in XI as they do in XIV, but they never dropped out of runs when one piece of gear didn't meet the standard. If your DD had Snipers, wonderful. If they had DEX rings instead, it wasn't going to break you. Only princess jobs had the luxury to simply drop a PT and get another easily. The way XIV is setup without the proper gear, you stand no chance of winning the instance and that means people riding you hard.

And yeah, you could beat Kirin and pretty much all Vanilla/Zilart NMs with little more than AF, AH'd lvl 75 weapons/armor, elemental staves and most importantly proper jobs, food, buffs and a strat.

[Rocl]

Stop pretending like its just DF. Shouts in Mor Dhona for trivial shit demand you have ace-tier gear or you're a scrub not worth doing anything with. No Relic+1? You're a scrub. AF in Wanderer's Palace? Ok, time to drop out of the run. Wipe once in AK? Not having it. The playerbase has already gone to shit

FFXI didn't have content you didn't do without an LS. You said it yourself. Endgame raiding was done by linkshells who you had to apply for. The closest XI had to XIV's raiding system was Voidwatch and that was retarded because as long as you hit procs you won.

but they never dropped out of runs when one piece of gear didn't meet the standard. If your DD had Snipers, wonderful. If they had DEX rings instead, it wasn't going to break you. Only princess jobs had the luxury to simply drop a PT and get another easily.

We played different games. Also let's not forget abandoning a party in XI meant another couple hours of seeking, abandoning a party in XIV means you queue again and take like 15 minutes.

The way XIV is setup without the proper gear, you stand no chance of winning the instance and that means people riding you hard.

Name one goddamn encounter where the gear check is so hard in XIV. The first two turns of Coil can be done with retarded strategies that include "kiting forever" and "force enrage."

And yeah, you could beat Kirin and pretty much all Vanilla/Zilart NMs with little more than AF, AH'd lvl 75 weapons/armor, elemental staves and most importantly proper jobs, food, buffs and a strat.

Did you notice I never disputed your Kirin claim because Kirin was a poorly fucking designed encounter where for the longest time the "strategy" was to kite it and force it to run out of MP before killing it?

Being able to Bio shit to death isn't prioritizing "strategy and job spread." It's shit fucking game design.

[Deadgye]

Did you notice I never disputed your Kirin claim because Kirin was a poorly fucking designed encounter where for the longest time the "strategy" was to kite it and force it to run out of MP before killing it?

Whoa whoa whoa. Let's get real here. That shit got harder when he ran out of mp after two hours.

[Taru Tacos]

Who is talking about coil? We're talking about 99% of all the gear from everything aside from AK (for tomes) and coil. Because they did a poor job of spreading BiS gear across a lot of content. Replacing coil with [insert next thing here] doesn't help. It just moves the problem from one encounter to another.

Look up! There's the point far, far above you.

I should stick to my loooooools with you. Because you just don't get it. Simply put: the best gear coming from only a handful of encounters is bad. It's bad even if the game just started, but at least they have an excuse. Patches only reaffirming that concept is real bad. You don't have to have a GED to get that, but it would help.

Sadly, so many people here are against that. It reminds then, vaguely, of FFXI somehow, so you know what that means: JIHAD!

Holy shit, you're all over the fucking place.
Ok, so there was this near the start of the whole discussion:

More annoyed with the direction the gear progression is going. Looks like the gear we have is going to be out dated every 3 months when they add new content. The thing I liked about XI was how long the gear remained "good" or BIS(situational?). I think personally I'll loose interest if my gear is outdated every 3-6 months.

Absolutely. This is the problem, everything else is just a symptom of it.

but now it totally wasn't how fast you replace BiS/coil gear that you were talking about. Totally.
Nice try on trying to shift the goal posts to cover up your shitty arguments though.

By the way, if you read any other posts, you'd already know I actually agree with you that the best gear coming from a handful of encounters is bad, that shit is stupid as HELL but that doesn't have anything to do with how soon or not we'll be replacing our current tier with the next tier, that has to do with how much content they actually roll out for each tier along with how difficult it is to clear and SE fucking both of those up after their stated design philosophy was that "real game begins at 50" shit is the goddamn problem. We don't even know what the average time will be between tier increases at this point so again, what the fuck is "almost immediatley" in this case? And why are you even back on the best gear topic anyway, what happened to not talking about coil? Oh right. Goal posts.

[Elcura]

Whoa whoa whoa. Let's get real here. That shit got harder when he ran out of mp after two hours.

The hardest part of Kirin was waiting until you could actually fight it. Then not actually fighting it.

[ronin sparthos]

FFXI didn't have content you didn't do without an LS. You said it yourself. Endgame raiding was done by linkshells who you had to apply for. The closest XI had to XIV's raiding system was Voidwatch and that was retarded because as long as you hit procs you won.

And by applying to an LS, you were subject to varying standards from just about anyone with a beating heart to rigorous application or trial process. In XIV, since (near) everything is done through DF it means very little accountability, dealing with impossible standards and devaluing the worth of a FC. The entire purpose of Yoshidas game was to avoid XIs cliquish mentality yet here it is all over again. What have we gained?

Name one goddamn encounter where the gear check is so hard in XIV. The first two turns of Coil can be done with retarded strategies that include "kiting forever" and "force enrage."

Titan HM. Meet the gearcheck or get obliterated by weight or lag. Generally enough to scare most groups into ridiculous requirements to join /sh or needing to get carried to win. I can only imagine the lulz in store when EMs go live.

Did you notice I never disputed your Kirin claim because Kirin was a poorly fucking designed encounter where for the longest time the "strategy" was to kite it and force it to run out of MP before killing it?
Being able to Bio shit to death isn't prioritizing "strategy and job spread." It's shit fucking game design.

Replace Kirin with Byakko and it doesn't change that you didn't need much in the way of gear investments to win these fights. It is afterall the reason RMT eventually came to farm them for gil. A tough monster like Byakko could be dealt with with Aerial Armor, some DD with /THF weaponskills, BLMs and fast heals. Better gear simply gave you more room to fuckup, experiment and/or speed through runs.

[Deadgye]

Haha, perhaps the only part of Kirin that took skill was timing the teleport so that you always ended up in Kirin's chamber instead of pots. Although if I used silent oils instead of fleeing to the teleport and aggroing everything in the process, that would have been easy too.

[Seravi Edalborez]

Magic agro was the bane of my existance as a poverty RDM.

[Lucavi]

The hardest part of Kirin was waiting until you could actually fight it. Then not actually fighting it.

This. How hard is kite + spinning dive + pred claws spam for 20 minutes? And that was like, the C- remedial strategy of killing him.

@Rhonin: Your post above makes no sense considering you need the DF for literally 0 content aside from the not-even-out-yet CT. All your talk of "DF IS EVIL" equates to "I don't have a FC that runs things with me", because if you did, you wouldn't need the DF for anything, and could finally shut up about how "bad" it is. DF is a -choice-; an option to complete group content when you don't have or can't use your FC. XI had no such choice. You joined a LS, with all of its elitism and corruption and asshattery, or you completed .5% of the game's actual content.

Now please stop. Just... just stop. You're not going to out-duel Rocl on this one.

[Rocl]

And by applying to an LS, you were subject to varying standards from just about anyone with a beating heart to rigorous application or trial process. In XIV, since (near) everything is done through DF it means very little accountability, dealing with impossible standards and devaluing the worth of a FC. The entire purpose of Yoshidas game was to avoid XIs cliquish mentality yet here it is all over again.

The DF has the same varying standards. If you think every DF group is full of people ready to ragequit at a moment's notice then I can say every LS required the same "rigorous applications." Of course this forum is going to focus on the rigorous hardcore tryhards.

Re: cliquish mentalities; I have never found any situation irl or in game where people didn't associate with like-minded people or had varying degrees of friendship.

The bold I can agree with, but if any of the above are your reasons for it lol

Titan HM. Meet the gearcheck or get obliterated by weight or lag. Generally enough to scare most groups into ridiculous requirements to join /sh or needing to get carried to win.

Weight of the Land does 1.6-1.8k damage per plume. I know because I eat it regularly since I'm too cool to move now. I'm going to ignore the "lag" complaint like I ignore every Titan "lag" complaint. It exists but having more gear isn't going to fix your lag problems unless Darklight/Allagan lowers your ping.

Replace Kirin with Byakko and it doesn't change that you didn't need much in the way of gear investments to win these fights. It is afterall the reason RMT eventually came to farm them for gil. A tough monster like Byakko could be dealt with with Aerial Armor, some DD with /THF weaponskills, BLMs and fast heals. Better gear simply gave you more room to fuckup, experiment and/or speed through runs.

Replace Byakko with Serket and you'd still be retarded. XIV's encounters are more akin to XI's lowman instance content (Nyzul, Salvage) than to XI's pop NM systems.

For the record, it's exactly the same in XIV. More gear gives you more room to fuck up/ speed run/ and experiment different set ups. You don't need massive gear investment to beat Titan. Hell, you don't need massive gear investment to beat the first two turns of the Coil. (I'm unsure if there's a method for Turn 4 but people did it in primarily ilvl60 back near release days sooooo)

[Lucavi]

Lucavi, would you please stop trolling the mentally challenged?

I'm so sorry, TBR. I'm just trying to hasten the inevitable. This place is so peaceful when he's gone. I'll let others champion the cause.

[Carth]

20 minutes? All the Kirin Kite fights I had took 45 minutes at least.

[Lucavi]

20 minutes? All the Kirin Kite fights I had took 45 minutes at least.

I had a half decent LS even back when smn spam was the thing to do. If it took any longer than 20, the other LSes in the area started getting antsy and uppity.

[Raldo]

20 minutes? All the Kirin Kite fights I had took 45 minutes at least.

"Check it out guys! Mistral Axe is RANGED!" Wheeeeee

Mine were all pretty slow too, 'cause nobody took it very seriously.

[Tyrath]

Screw you guys, sleeping pot sneak attack WS on Kirin still the best ;-;

[Voyage1970]

Meditate + Spirit's Within would like to have a word with you.

[ronin sparthos]

Replace Byakko with Serket and you'd still be retarded. XIV's encounters are more akin to XI's lowman instance content (Nyzul, Salvage) than to XI's pop NM systems.

For the record, it's exactly the same in XIV. More gear gives you more room to fuck up/ speed run/ and experiment different set ups. You don't need massive gear investment to beat Titan. Hell, you don't need massive gear investment to beat the first two turns of the Coil. (I'm unsure if there's a method for Turn 4 but people did it in primarily ilvl60 back near release days sooooo)

Comparing Nyzul or Salvage to XIVs instances still doesn't change my point that gear didn't matter as much as competency. With standard base TOAU gear and the right people you could complete those very same instances. Salvage further devalued gear by tying cell unlocks to elements of luck or relying on roulettes to hand out 35s and Nyzul devalued gear by making all the trash mobs EP garbage alongside RNG.

Did having elite gear change the fact that lamps were lamps or that QQTH wouldn't drop after repeated kills? XI was always a logistics game where getting people to do something was the hardest part and your tenacity to deal with inferior droprates was the game itself.

[Seravi Edalborez]

I was testing range one night in Dynamis-Xarc before Dynamis Lord with Cure. I made a PLD waste like 4 sleeping pots by accident.

[ronin sparthos]

Screw you guys, sleeping pot sneak attack WS on Kirin still the best ;-;

Fuck that, Chi Blast all day.

I used to love when MNKs would get pissed that they didn't get invited in and lost Boost. Fun times.

[Obsidian]

Haha, perhaps the only part of Kirin that took skill was timing the teleport so that you always ended up in Kirin's chamber instead of pots. Although if I used silent oils instead of fleeing to the teleport and aggroing everything in the process, that would have been easy too.

The random warp to Kirin's room was bullshit. Spent two hours getting warped to Pots. After about half an hour I told my linkshell not to wait and just start without me thinking there was no way it could possibly take long enough that it would make me miss an entire fight. I ended up missing two and part of a third before I said fuck it and logged off. It had to be some kind of record.