Pugilist/monk discussion

**tancients** · 2013-10-28 21:30

Do you guys have the fists keybound to anything quick or is it only occasionally for changing?

Trying to figure out some optimal mapping but not as familiar with what will be most used besides the 6 dps abilities.

**shidobu** · 2013-10-28 23:10

Originally Posted by tancients

Do you guys have the fists keybound to anything quick or is it only occasionally for changing?

Trying to figure out some optimal mapping but not as familiar with what will be most used besides the 6 dps abilities.

i have a logitech g60 (mmo button mouse) so my shit is all quick/easy to access

**Shaano** · 2013-10-28 23:22

So many differen't gear sets being posted but is there one for "no coil gear" at the moment? Currently only have +1/AF2 head and feet/ rest is darklight. Will have 810~ish myth after capping out this week so if an upgrade comes from that will jump on it right away but any fingers pointing me in the right way be awesome o:

Spoiler: show

edit: was considering buying af2 hands / ring or necklace this week once I hit cap or is it better to get the af2 body

**Kachiko** · 2013-10-28 23:30

Do you want to know what to buy for best in slot (posted somewhere in this thread already) or do you want to know what to buy to maximize your DPS per myth tome? If you don't have Relic +1, that's your fist upgrade.

*nevermind, I guess the +1/AF2 Head and feet meant Relic +1*

**Nitsuki** · 2013-10-28 23:34

Af2 body for sure. That's my next purchase as of capping next week. Sexy as fuck and BiS considering skillspeed/acc. I'd still take allagan body for crit but hey, both look awesome. Btw, imo, replace your DL pants for peltast legs if you have them. The crit is a nice difference.

**Shaano** · 2013-10-28 23:35

Yeah relic +1 is done, and more than likely will farm/buy grypho body (since it drops from turn 5 it looks) throwing some crit into it unless that's the wrong choice. I've had no luck period getting any mnk drops from turn 1 and working keeps me from going to further turns so far D:

edit: i have peltast legs for dungeon spamming and lower end content but the whole ''omg where is your dl gear'' i just threw it on ;c

**lilbubbles** · 2013-10-29 03:28

Originally Posted by Shaano

edit: i have peltast legs for dungeon spamming and lower end content but the whole ''omg where is your dl gear'' i just threw it on ;c

I hate that...

I feel the same way when I was doing garuda in df, people kept yelling at me to go for the feathers but come on... really? I land 2 of my aoes when they spawn, and I am pretty sure me chasing down 1 feather and killing it will do more damage to the pillars when garuda goes through an entire extra phase because I wasn't hitting it.

I finally gave up and started chasing those feathers, but meh.

**Zeonn** · 2013-10-29 03:46

Hi Guys, one question:

I was reading a lot that the monk BiS is building around the skspd, but lately i'm reading about taking the critical way. IMHO i think the crit is better than the Skill Speed, yet, im not a calc man. So... What is the best? Crit or SkSpeed?

Thanks guys.

**Shaano** · 2013-10-29 03:49

Originally Posted by lilbubbles

I hate that...

I feel the same way when I was doing garuda in df, people kept yelling at me to go for the feathers but come on... really? I land 2 of my aoes when they spawn, and I am pretty sure me chasing down 1 feather and killing it will do more damage to the pillars when garuda goes through an entire extra phase because I wasn't hitting it.

I finally gave up and started chasing those feathers, but meh.

and with garuda just need to have people who can do damage to her constantly to push her through phases, ignoring all feathers makes it a lot faster / easier. Shoulder tackle is nice going from one place to the other but isn't 30 seconds like a blackmage so losing damage with travel times

**Icarian** · 2013-10-29 07:14

Originally Posted by Zeonn

Hi Guys, one question:

I was reading a lot that the monk BiS is building around the skspd, but lately i'm reading about taking the critical way. IMHO i think the crit is better than the Skill Speed, yet, im not a calc man. So... What is the best? Crit or SkSpeed?

Thanks guys.

The downside of Skill Speed is that it only affects on GCD WS DPS, Skill Speed does nothing for Auto Attack, DoTs and off GCD WSs, which is a good chunk of our damage, also, you'll run into heavy TP issues during longer fights if you stack too much speed.

I've yet yo see an in depth testing on stat weights or whether a Skill Speed build is better/worse than a Crit/DET one, I've only seen theorycrafted numbers thrown around and nothing really conclusive or a set of numbers people agree on.

**Darth-Banana** · 2013-10-29 07:55

Actually about skill speed and what not, I do have a question
The effects of Greased Lightning when you read it from a tooltip or the buff, says "Increases damage dealt and attack speed"

Does attack speed refer to Skill speed, or is it actually Auto Attack Speed?

**Seravi Edalborez** · 2013-10-29 09:28

Skill speed. You can see it by watching the recast on your weaponskills as you build GL. Ideally you want it close to or under 2.00s as I understand it, any more than that is gravy.

**Darth-Banana** · 2013-10-29 13:41

Originally Posted by Seravi Edalborez

Skill speed. You can see it by watching the recast on your weaponskills as you build GL. Ideally you want it close to or under 2.00s as I understand it, any more than that is gravy.

Ah right thanks, that makes sense.

**Venussama** · 2013-10-29 22:38

I was curious about skillspeed vs crit too! I was working towards what I read somewhere of Str (obviously) > Acc to 480 > speed to 491 > crit > det.

Keeping this in mind I'm like 15ish from speed cap. I have relic+1 and all dl bar hands and belt. Stayed with pelcast for the skill speed. Now I'm wondering if I should switch them for the crit on dl!

Also torn between the 300dps monk flank style rotation thats over on youtube or stick to a more traditional rotation that includes bootshine. I currently have out dps all dd's I've come accross using the traditional method until I met this one mono doing the 300 flank thing.

I tried both but I don't have a parser so it's hard to tell.

Thoughts?

**StUfF** · 2013-10-30 00:18

Originally Posted by Venussama

I was curious about skillspeed vs crit too! I was working towards what I read somewhere of Str (obviously) > Acc to 480 > speed to 491 > crit > det.

Keeping this in mind I'm like 15ish from speed cap. I have relic+1 and all dl bar hands and belt. Stayed with pelcast for the skill speed. Now I'm wondering if I should switch them for the crit on dl!

Also torn between the 300dps monk flank style rotation thats over on youtube or stick to a more traditional rotation that includes bootshine. I currently have out dps all dd's I've come accross using the traditional method until I met this one mono doing the 300 flank thing.

I tried both but I don't have a parser so it's hard to tell.

Thoughts?

Looking it mathematically - bootshine is always a damage increase over dragon kick until you have over 60% crit.

Given that
- you don't fuck up bootshine and it fails to crit.
- you don't lose any auto attacks while repositioning.
- you don't lose focus of other raid mechanics which may get you or allies killed.
- you don't lose focus on other parts of your rotation.
- you don't drop dragon kick debuff
- you don't delay/waste your gcd to get into position

If you can execute, it will be a dps buff. Is it worth the effort? Up to you. The advantage of the flank method is it's dead easy. You will never see the objective difference between two parses because of how crit damage is somewhat random.

**Elcura** · 2013-10-30 10:58

If you got the traditional rotation on lockdown and everything is in your favour for positioning then I would definitely do that. Flank rotation is something I'd do when being really lazy or if I wanted to focus on survival/fight mechanics more than personal DPS (which is just Twintania currently).

**Venussama** · 2013-10-30 12:00

Thanks for the input guys

I prefer the traditional myself as I feel like not using bootshine is a waste xD

Any thoughts on skillspeed over crit?

**Voyage1970** · 2013-10-30 12:29

Another thing to keep in mind if I'm thinking of the same video as you are is that it was an ideal situation where there are no mechanics to dodge and the mob isn't shifting constantly when using off-target attacks (I hate you Garuda! Stop frictioning the mages so I can punch you in the butt). Also notice at the end that the MNK was at pretty much zero TP and Invigorate still had 1/3 of its cooldown left. Skillspeed also doesn't increase your auto-attack damage which makes up a pretty large portion of MNKs overall DPS. Then there are our DoTs which don't increase with Skillspeed and our off GCD attacks.

Just food for thought.

**Nitsuki** · 2013-10-30 12:40

Originally Posted by Venussama

Thanks for the input guys

I prefer the traditional myself as I feel like not using bootshine is a waste xD

Any thoughts on skillspeed over crit?

I will see the difference once i get my AF2 body next week, but right now w/ GL3, i'm down to 2.05gcd, and i'm seeing myself lose all my tp at a decent pace, this is not counting invigorate of course, but w/ my current gear, i see the difference. I believe w/ my AF2 body i can then concentrate on crit a lot more as i'll be below 2.00 gcd w/ GL3.

**Icarian** · 2013-10-30 13:51

IIRC 100 Skill Speed = -0.10 GCD (or 10 Skill Speed = 0.01), so you'd need 50ish Speed to get down to 2s from 2.05s.

Thread: Pugilist/monk discussion

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