Pugilist/monk discussion

[Nitsuki]

XIV's version of samurai?

^ i hate to say it myself. But someone in my server said that. God knows how many people will try mnk now. :/

[Carth]

None of the MRD changes affect MNK from what I can see. There is this...

• Enmity generated has been increased. Recast time has been reduced from 60 to 40 seconds.

But even as a WAR main I have no fucking clue what it's referencing. Maybe Infuriate but it's under MRD not WAR (which is labelled as "Defiance" rofl) so who knows. Either way B4B and ambiguous IR change seem to be our only MNK nerfs.

To note, it's Mercy Stroke traited. They said the same thing on the WAR/MRD 2.1 post a few weeks ago. I think Mercy Stroke Xclassed is still 90s.

I'm honestly quite perplexed to the buffs to MNK. It wasn't like it was hurting for damage before, it just needed a reason to use ass-attacks and some QoL changes to either Twin Snakes (which we got) or Greased Lightning (which we didn't get but we got a massive damage boost instead).

[Francisco]

Not that it's realistic to have every buff, DoT, or stack up 100% of the time, but with the changes what would be an near optimal rotation that wouldn't involve a bunch of keyjumping or incredibly long ability cycles? Basically, I'm too feeble-minded to memorize a 36 ability rotation.

The simplest answer to me seems like: ToD > DK > TwS > SP > BS > TS > F > D, then repeat, but skipping ToD every other turn.

On ToD rounds, you'd be without DK/TwS buffs for ~3-4 seconds, probably affecting the on-hit damage of ToD (not a huge deal) and DK/TwS reapplications (bigger deal).

Sticking to the cycle, you might be reapplying D/F a couple of seconds early, but they overwrite at least. ToD will have a down period of ~4-5 seconds.

(I rounded up downtimes to the nearest second, plus one to account for human error/imperfection).

Edit: Flipped Demolish and Fracture to extend GL rotation, less risk of it falling off if you don't have F and ToD back to back.

[Elcura]

I don't think MNK will be flavour of the month, but I do think melee classes will generally be a lot more popular. Considering how long it would take to decently gear up a MNK if you haven't already gotten allagan, those playing it properly intended to do so from the start.

[Kiarax]

I think a lot of shittier players that ride the FOTM wave will realize MNK takes a lot of effort (comparatively) to maximize your damage, hopefully that'll curb a lot of the worse players at least. Given how the popularity of WAR shot up when the changes were announced though it's clear MNK will see the same thing.

Edit: Flipped Demolish and Fracture to extend GL rotation, less risk of it falling off if you don't have F and ToD back to back.

You're still inserting 2 WS (or 1 if ToD isn't being refreshed) between refreshing GL, doesn't really matter where you add them in.

[Francisco]

I think a lot of shittier players that ride the FOTM wave will realize MNK takes a lot of effort (comparatively) to maximize your damage, hopefully that'll curb a lot of the worse players at least. Given how the popularity of WAR shot up when the changes were announced though it's clear MNK will see the same thing.

You're still inserting 2 WS (or 1 if ToD isn't being refreshed) between refreshing GL, doesn't really matter where you add them in.

If you're doing (DK > TwS > SP) > (BS > TS > D) > (F > ToD > DK > TwS > SP).... you have a string of 5 WS to execute at one time between your next GL stack.

Chance it to (DK > TwS > SP) > (BS > TS > F > D) > (ToD > DK > TwS > SP)... and you instead have two strings of 4 WS to get GL back up. It's basically just spreading the risk around. Getting 4 WS during GL is easy. Five is a lot riskier.

[Kiarax]

Never thought of popping Fracture before Demolish for some reason, that's definitely not a bad idea. Can't say losing GL has ever been an issue even with 5 WS though (assuming GL3) but I can see it being a good idea in fights where you frequently have to move out of 360 AoEs, maybe CT fights won't be so straightforward (lol).

[Sho]

my general patch notes reaction: i'm kind of bummed about b4b/RoD/virus nerfs, and i had been holding out hope that the GL adjustments were going to lengthen the duration or make the stacks decrease one by one. but for the most part, i can manage with the existing timer, so with that said...

holy shit i can't believe how much monk got in this patch, and i surely can't fathom why we got it all. 2.1 will be our 2004 RNG era, and accordingly, 2.2 will surely deliver a type of wrath not seen since the great and glorious RNG nerf of 2005. i plan to enjoy it while it lasts

Post made me ROFL so hard at work. Thank you.

[Tsutsumiko]

This confuses me, but perhaps it's because I've really only played bard. How are you reapplying dots over themselves without letting the drop first? Does monk not make use of internal release or blood for blood often? As a bard I pretty much have to let most of my dots drop before reapplying them.

As for what bard keeps track of.. gotta keep venomous strike and windbite up as much as possible and make sure that straight shot buff is always up. The rest is mostly reactionary stuff. If heavy shot triggers straighter shot you don't want to use heavy shot again before using straight shot. Hit bloodletter in between the gcd when it's been reset. Misery's End asap when the mob drops below 20% hp. Keep track of the mages mp in case you need to ballad. Pay attention to the enemy and/or tanks hp so you can throw a rain of death up (not anymore! ; . Flaming arrow stuff.

If you want to go hard mode bard, which personally is too complicated for me so I don't bother: You remember which of your 4 other buffs you had active when you put on your dots and which ones you have on now so you can determine if you need to let your dots drop first or if you can go ahead and reapply them right before they drop. And you fit in your other off gcd moves like repelling strike and shadowbind and blunted arrow in whenever you can.

I definitely wouldn't call non-hard mode bard difficult to play, but it's definitely very active. I'm probably not too far from averaging two abilities every global cooldown.

Basically, once you've hit Greased Lightning @ 3 stacks, your goal is to keep up everything I said. You get a pretty good feel/idea for when you have to start moving into position to reapply moves. It takes me 4 seconds to get through a rotation to Demolish so when I see the timer on Demolish hit 5 seconds, I have to move myself into position to start my combo that leads into Demolish which leads into Fracture. Touch of Death is a little more difficult to manage as it's timer is longer and depending on Perfect Balance or not, it either comes at the beginning or later on in the combo for maximum damage (Without PB, it's the first move. With PB, it's like the 6th move, so you see why this throws it off).

Basically, you're just landing the DoTs at the exact time they go down so that you're not missing out on any ticks of damage. A good rotation will put you in position ahead of time without sacrificing any damage.

[Nitsuki]

Never thought of popping Fracture before Demolish for some reason, that's definitely not a bad idea. Can't say losing GL has ever been an issue even with 5 WS though (assuming GL3) but I can see it being a good idea in fights where you frequently have to move out of 360 AoEs, maybe CT fights won't be so straightforward (lol).

Only reason i used demolish > fracture is because of the GCD timers, once demolish finishes, GCD is already up and i'm on fracture. Not that GL3 is ever a problem either, but i guess i'll give it a go. Call me weird, but i enjoy when animations transition smoothly sometimes.

[Voyage1970]

Only reason i used demolish > fracture is because of the GCD timers, once demolish finishes, GCD is already up and i'm on fracture. Not that GL3 is ever a problem either, but i guess i'll give it a go. Call me weird, but i enjoy when animations transition smoothly sometimes.

This. The GL buff from Demolish doesn't actually get applied until the animation finishes, and the animation takes so god damn long that by the time you get the buff your 2.12s are already up and ready for Fracture. Another interesting bit of info is even if you have 1 second left on GL and you activate Demolish you'll still retain GLIII even if it wears off mid animation. It only cares about what your GL was when you started the animation and takes it from there. The only issue I can see coming from this would be Auto-attacks if GL wears off mid animation. I'm not sure if they still keep the increased damage or not.

[Kaope]

Just hit 50 last night before I went to bed. Have some questions :

1) When and how to use perfect balance? Use it as opener and every time it's up? (IR/BfB>ToD>PB>Snapx2+Demolish>..)
2) Does GL effect apply on all dots?
3) Anyone have mnk macros to share?

[Elcura]

I tend to PB before boss fights, since it's a little pointless wasting it for trash (some exceptions). When doing PB, the order I use tends to be SPx3 (buffing between GCD) > TwS > Demolish, if you do it fast enough you can get Demolish out before PB wears off, since it'll kill your flow otherwise. Then (with buffs still active, along with TwS and GL3) I apply Fracture > ToD then continue rotation as normal. This might be a little skillspeed dependant, since you want to get 5 actions off before PB wears. There might be a more efficient order, but I dunno what it is. You could do SPx2 and Demolish, but I'm pretty sure your Demolish would be weaker, still, seems acceptable if you can't do SPx3.

AoE tends to be whatever > TwS > Rockbreaker > PB > Rockbreaker (while buffing) > Howling Fist (between GCD) > whatever > TwS > Rockbreaker.

GL applies to DoTs, it's most beneficial to lay them down in GL3.

No need for MNK macros really, there are some lazy automatic ones but it feels stupid. You could combine your buffs (offensive/defensive) into 1 macro, but ultimately there isn't much need.

[Voyage1970]

I tend to PB before boss fights, since it's a little pointless wasting it for trash (some exceptions). When doing PB, the order I use tends to be SPx3 (buffing between GCD) > TwS > Demolish, if you do it fast enough you can get Demolish out before PB wears off, since it'll kill your flow otherwise. Then (with buffs still active, along with TwS and GL3) I apply Fracture > ToD then continue rotation as normal. This might be a little skillspeed dependant, since you want to get 5 actions off before PB wears. There might be a more efficient order, but I dunno what it is. You could do SPx2 and Demolish, but I'm pretty sure your Demolish would be weaker, still, seems acceptable if you can't do SPx3.

Any particular reason you don't have DK as part of your PB rotation? I typically start with SPx3 like you but then do DK > TwS. Then I can BS > TS > Demo > Fracture > ToD and buffs should wear off right as ToD is applied (assuming you B4B > IR since IR has a shorter duration). DK and TwS buffs should have a few seconds left to reapply on the next rotation and GLIII will have about 1-2s before wearing as you start the first Demolish but as long as you start the animation before GL goes off you'll still keep GLIII. Just seems weird to not have DK buff for almost 2 full rotations considering how substantial of a boost it is.

[Icarian]

God, the new gear is freaking awesome for monk, all of it.

[shidobu]

God, the new gear is freaking awesome for monk, all of it.

cant post shit like this and just not share it. Jerk

Fuma Set :http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...tegory=&q=fuma
Vortex ring of striking http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/7bee16dab39/
Ultima choker of striking http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/4239968c68f/
Tremor Earring of striking http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/eeedb3c55c1/
Inferno Bangle of striking http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/9a9e91b22ab/

Accessories are pretty fucking on point. I plan on getting some of these.. tho i have allagan stuf.. (fuck da police im lotting them if see them)
fuma tekkos i will prob blow my first lot on.... if i ever see them

[Kaope]

Don't forget the new h2h.

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/fd7a79ce096/

[shidobu]

if you dont allready have +1 thats a decent upgrade. looking forward to the other weapons since mnk is the only +1 i have

[Kiarax]

God, the new gear is freaking awesome for monk, all of it.

This so hard. This was a nice thing to wake up to. Need weapon, all 3 accessories and maybe the i80 gloves if I need to pad out my acc. Luckily I'm sat on like 1.4k myth so I can deck my MNK in almost full i90 easily with all this new stuff.

[Nitsuki]

holy fucking shit! Watch my shitty luck at Fuma Tekkos are just as good as Allagan Hands.... 0/6

also, is the ring CT gear? is what i meant to say.

nvm, extreme primals. holy fuckshit i want all the extreme primal accessories!! and weapon!! they're all extremely good, and the weapon is a nice alternative overall, much better than +1 relic.