[Guide] Paladin Tanking Compendium (Last update 11/13/13)

[Kirbyprime]

/macroicon "Cover"
/ac Cover <t>
/ac Cover <f>
/ac Cover <tt>


/macroicon "Circle of Scorn"
/ac "Circle of Scorn" <me>
/ac "Flash" <me>

Nothing else really.

[Seravi Edalborez]

I have a
/micon "Cover"
/ac "Cover" <mo>
/ac "Cover" <t>

But I barely use Cover anyways. I also pair up the following buffs just to save space (mash for 2nd one):
FoF+Bloodbath
Foresight+Convalescence (I also have Conv by itself)
Bulwark+Awareness

[Judai]

I have a
/micon "Cover"
/ac "Cover" <mo>
/ac "Cover" <t>

But I barely use Cover anyways. I also pair up the following buffs just to save space (mash for 2nd one):
FoF+Bloodbath
Foresight+Convalescence (I also have Conv by itself)
Bulwark+Awareness

Same, as well as Scorn+Flash and Provoke+Lob macros.

I can also confirm that Lob+Fast Blade is a terrible macro and will piss you off considerably when it lobs while you are next to the mob and want to fast blade. I tried it for one AK run way back and think I got rid of it before Demon Wall cause it annoyed the hell out of me.

[Avarice]

I've never really found a need for a macro on PLD, though there are certainly options to use one (like listed above) if you really feel the need to have one.

[Obsidian]

I don't use any either. Tanks ought to know when a switch is happening (Provoke) or when they're up for Silence. Plus I don't feel like annoying my party every time I ever use Spirits Within.

Edit: I should say I have a Cover macro (which includes instructions on how not to screw it up), but I don't use it because Cover sucks harder than a Dyson.

[The Stig]

I've heard some people have a Shield Lob / Fast Blade combo macro that will use Fast Blade if you're close enough, and Shield Lob if you're not, but in the same breath I hear that that macro will sometimes use Shield Lob erroneously, so I wouldn't recommend that either.

I can confirm this is because of the game's macro system.

In that macro, it'll look like

/ac Fast Blade
/ac Shield Lob

If you are hitting buttons fast before the Global Cooldown (GCD) is up, the game will process the macro, but because your GCD is not ready yet, it'll ignore the first command and go with the second.

0.3s until GCD is up
0.2s <macro is used>
GCD is at 0.1 at this point, can't process Fast Blade
0.0 GCD is ready, processes Shield Lob

EDIT: I checked the link, he's on PS3, which might be a bit worst off (?) -- I'm on PC with the same problem.
Best fix is to not smash buttons lol

[Jahaudant]

What does it matter?

The only way I can see any sane person might want to argue that an i80 VIT accessory is better than an i90 VIT accessory for DPS purposes is when they are already running 30 allocated points in STR.

If you have 2 or more points in VIT the better option would be to do as Eurlin suggested and use the i90 item and reallocate the 2 points difference in VIT to STR for a far larger DPS gain.

[Indomitable Will]

IF you switch to a plume your DPS between a full turtle build and a hybrid would be maybe 40~ per hit at most meaning you'll get to GAruda 1 swing faster if that? the fact is our DPS DOES NOT MATTER...at all, each Parry we can squeeze in -can- even if it's just 1 more parry every 1000 hits, that's more useful than doing a little bit more damage. My math was based on % from the stats. I didn't care to honestly back up my numbers, but I'm pretty sure they all came from where I got the parry info. which looks to be where you saw as well 0.076% Crit is 40Pts for 1% give or take, and I don't know DET, but I figured 7DET wouldn't make a difference outside of maybe 3-4 per hit?

the 2STR was you dropping VIT from your extra 30 VIT IF you were to use a turtle build, while I agree 30 VIT has become seemingly useless with 6900 HP for me, it was meant to direct your logic of saying the 2 VIT is useless, but my point was if you have the 30VIT you can then drop the 2VIT and add 2STR with Allagan which then made the DET moot because 2STR > 7DET. IF you were to put all 30 points into STR I would actually argue that the 2VIT would be more useful in that case because you're dropping your HP down a considerable amount making regen, Lustrate, and Spirits slightly less effective.

The key here being again, do you die? 1 more parry out of every 1000 hits is extraneous when talking about end game, full i90 pld's, the extra survivability is worthless. you go into garuda with less dps but take less damage, I go in with more dps but take "more damage", neither of us die, but I win a few seconds faster (primarily from solo killing a plume here and there faster than you, so getting 1 more swing on garuda, and dps'ing faster on the sister I'm holding while tanking garuda), and it doesn't change how much the healers have to heal, because they're overcuring if they are topping you off anyway. My whm and sch are able to dps the hell out of plumes and sisters and garuda the whole fight pretty much, because timed cooldowns and positioning are everything in that fight.... you parry 1 more time, for 24% less damage on w/e move, and you block at 27%, all my parry's and blocks are higher than yours because I parry at 25 and block at 28 because my str is on a different tier (block and parry %'s are examples, obviously I don't know what your actual rate is), so i take 2% less damage than you that way, AND kill the sister's faster, which even by few seconds will negate 1 or 2 of her moves, which will save me more hp by not getting hit by those at all that you saved by parrying 1 more time.

[Waraji]

All of my PLD macros consist of spamming the same ability for as many lines it allows. That way I know Hallowed Ground will go off (eventually) after I press the macro.

[Jem]

EHP is all that matters for tanks. I have gotten unlucky on T5 and dropped to 15 HPS on a death sentence swipe as I didnt have a "good" cool down up. So I will take every HP I can get.

Disagree. Twintania is like the only fight where it matters. And for every time you survive with 15HP, there will be alternative scenario where the extra DPS would have made a difference too (or worst case, makes the fight faster).

Like I said it's personal preference but when I'm doing events with LS the difference between 6.9k and 6.6k HP makes no difference at all. It's not like everyone always been at the 7k HP mark and were continuously dying before they hit that mark.

Just quickly put it into the damage calculator and the difference between 359 STR and 404 STR across 1 full Rage of Halone combo is 657 > 729 (525 > 582 with Shield Oath up). Auto-Attack goes from 83.5 > 92.5 (66.8 > 74 with Shield Oath Up). That's using Curtana Zenith. For me personally that's worth the trade off in LS events, I'd probably switch back to full VIT gear for PUGs.

EDIT: For the record that would still put me at 6694 HP using the 19 VIT food (HQ Sauteed Couerl), 6622-6636 with 14-15 VIT food. Annoying thing is as a Midlander I'd have to switch 1 VIT to STR to hit that 405 tier (or rely on a MNK or DRG in party)

[Kaslo]

I can confirm this is because of the game's macro system.

In that macro, it'll look like

/ac Fast Blade
/ac Shield Lob

If you are hitting buttons fast before the Global Cooldown (GCD) is up, the game will process the macro, but because your GCD is not ready yet, it'll ignore the first command and go with the second.

0.3s until GCD is up
0.2s <macro is used>
GCD is at 0.1 at this point, can't process Fast Blade
0.0 GCD is ready, processes Shield Lob

EDIT: I checked the link, he's on PS3, which might be a bit worst off (?) -- I'm on PC with the same problem.
Best fix is to not smash buttons lol

I can confirm its a GCD issue. As long as I'm not too quick on the trigger I'm fine.

[Eurlin]

The key here being again, do you die? 1 more parry out of every 1000 hits is extraneous when talking about end game, full i90 pld's, the extra survivability is worthless. you go into garuda with less dps but take less damage, I go in with more dps but take "more damage", neither of us die, but I win a few seconds faster (primarily from solo killing a plume here and there faster than you, so getting 1 more swing on garuda, and dps'ing faster on the sister I'm holding while tanking garuda), and it doesn't change how much the healers have to heal, because they're overcuring if they are topping you off anyway. My whm and sch are able to dps the hell out of plumes and sisters and garuda the whole fight pretty much, because timed cooldowns and positioning are everything in that fight.... you parry 1 more time, for 24% less damage on w/e move, and you block at 27%, all my parry's and blocks are higher than yours because I parry at 25 and block at 28 because my str is on a different tier (block and parry %'s are examples, obviously I don't know what your actual rate is), so i take 2% less damage than you that way, AND kill the sister's faster, which even by few seconds will negate 1 or 2 of her moves, which will save me more hp by not getting hit by those at all that you saved by parrying 1 more time.

I don't think you understand what my actual arguement was in this situation. I'm mainly arguing about Allagan ring VS another ring Ultima or Vortex. Neither of which will affect your DPS or your Damage mitigation in a noticeable amount.

HOWEVER that said 1 Parry -can- make a difference yes, because getting a double wicked wheel -might- make the difference if you Parry one of those attacks.

I'm not saying that it's like "OMG WE NEED TO NEVER HIT THINGS!" but if you were to change my ring out for a vortex you -won't- kill a plume faster than me, you -won't- get to hit Garuda faster than me, because the difference in DPS is so MINIMAL that it really won't matter.

=====================================

If you want to talk about taking a more DPS build PLD in over a full DEF PLD, then yea sure that's a completely different issue. If you were a Hybrid PLD you probably won't die, and you can kill Garuda slightly faster than an average party. HOWEVER consider this, Jem has just shown a small difference between two builds on PLD the is an average difference of 20~ damage per Halone combo. That's roughly 80~ more damage every 8~ seconds. (auto attacks) with SHield oath.

THat's NOTHING compared to being able to bring your party down to 1 healer and adding an extra DPS. Why? well because when I play my PLD I can Solo tank -everything- up to Garuda Extreme with 1 Healer. I probably can Solo Tank Garuda and Titan X, I'm just not sure how to make sure Spiny doesn't come straight to me every time, and I'm not sure if my FC has the DPS check to run Titan down without another Tank. (as a DEF tank you can eat up to 7 busters before you're just dead) So no your party wouldn't kill Garuda faster and your DPS wouldn't make a bigger difference. We farm GAruda with 1 Healer no problem because I take no damage at all, and Chirada is down in no time. Could I go to a "hybrid" build, possibly..but I don't need to at all.

[Jem]

You could most assuredly solo tank in a Hybrid build. 6694 HP (6622-36 if you use 14/15 VIT food) is more than enough to solo tank the fights that are solo tankable. Although I'd probably full VIT for Twintania at least.

Essentially the difference between the builds is:

Hybrid - 11% DPS increase, +1% Block Mitigation, +1% Parry Mitigation, Whatever 45 DEX does to your Parry rate
Defensive - 362 HP, 15 Parry (Assuming all your 15 VIT accessories have 16 Parry on them except 2nd ring)

Really the main negative against the Hybrid build is the gil outlay. On Ragnarok you're probably looking at 200k per piece (including meld costs). So whether you want to pay 1m for something which will very likely be replaced next update is going to vary from person to person (but you can convert them at least when you're done!)

[Eurlin]

You could most assuredly solo tank in a Hybrid build. 6694 HP is more than enough to solo tank (6622-36 if you use 14/15 VIT food).

Essentially the difference between the builds is:

Hybrid - 11% DPS increase, +1% Block Mitigation, +1% Parry Mitigation, Whatever 45 DEX does to your Parry rate
Defensive - 362 HP, 15 Parry (Assuming all your 15 VIT accessories have 16 Parry on them except 2nd ring)

Really the main negative against the Hybrid build is the gil outlay. On Ragnarok you're probably looking at 200k per piece (including meld costs). So whether you want to pay 1m for something which will very likely be replaced next update is going to vary from person to person (but you can convert them at least when you're done!)

Sorry Jem I meant Solo tank solo Healer, though you have my attention. I don't know if i would go the hybrid route, because solo heals makes me want to stay on a more defensive side for an "oh shit" moment.

[Jem]

I honestly don't think 362 HP makes or breaks a Solo Tank, Solo Healer strat. As long as the rest of your gear is i90 then you're still pushing 6.7k HP. I know I've solo tanked fights with less than that (not because of Hybrid but because I wasn't full i90 yet).

It's going to be personal preference. There's nothing wrong with either way really. Hybrid just requires your tank/healer to be more on the ball.

[Eurlin]

True, I really don't even worry about death from anything lower than Titan X. I don't want to spend the money like you pointed out, which is why I've been in debate about jumping 30 VIT to 30 STR. I guess everything I base my answers off of are really from Titan X up, and Coil Turn 5.

[Jem]

I personally won't be switching VIT for STR purely because accessories I can change at any given time, not so much for STR/VIT allocation. Although my STR/VIT allocation is going to be 1/29 because I need that 1 STR to hit the 405 tier as a Midlander. Can't bring myself to Fantasia into a Highlander for the extra 2 STR, 2 DEX, 1 VIT because of attachment D:

[Obsidian]

And because Highlander Males look like they have an extra chromosome.

To go Jem's route you're losing ~370 HP and ~2% Parrying rate, but likely gaining at least 1% back through the DEX on the accessories. The only place I'm ever legitimately considering my total HP is Twintania.

[Jem]

Assuming it's 1 Parry = 0.076% (http://valk.dancing-mad.com/methodology/#Parry) then you're losing 1.14% Parry rate from the 15 Parry difference (assuming 16,16,16,16,11 Parry versus 12,12,12,12,12). I would imagine that's negated by the 45 DEX gain?

So it's pretty much 362 HP, ~1m gil vs 1% Block mitigation, 1% Parry mitigation, ~11% DPS increase

[Ratatapa]

Alt getting better



Next week goal was to rep

CT head to Valor egg (+24 ACC)
DL gloves to CT gloveS (-15)
DL ring to Ultima ring (-10?)

of course would depend of T1-4 drops