DBZ movie?

[Hatedregret]

I liked it. It's tough man. People aren't going to be happy either way. Whether they bitch about there being no story or bitch because they felt bored because there was background to be laid down for future shit.

Spoiler: show

He said he was the 2nd strongest in the 7th out of 12 universes. That opens a ton of doors in the future but nobody wants to deal with that shit as they only want to see an hour of charging up to bitch about that instead.

The Pilaf fluff was useless but may not be later. I will say though, SSG looked like shit and the way it was learned was worse.

Spoiler: show

Vegeta being Alpha was so great. I loved that they finally showed him more powerful than Goku since he trains so damn much more and harder.

[The Stig]

Spoiler: show

Vegeta being Alpha was so great. I loved that they finally showed him more powerful than Goku since he trains so damn much more and harder.

I never saw it like that, but that's a good point to make! Instead, there's 2 schools of thoughts here I considered when I saw it:

Spoiler: show

1. It's the first time Vegeta got more powerful from emotion. The freak out vs Perfect Cell when Future Trunks got shafted by a laser didn't do as much though, but perhaps that was more rage than emotion? Just a thought.

2. Vegeta may train harder, but perhaps he's not clever about it and is trying to brute force his way through. This was evident early when his extra 23 hours of training in the time chamber didn't help much or at all, and Goku still outclassed him.

[Seha]

Eh, was an alright episode.

[Souj]

I never saw it like that, but that's a good point to make! Instead, there's 2 schools of thoughts here I considered when I saw it:

Spoiler: show

1. It's the first time Vegeta got more powerful from emotion. The freak out vs Perfect Cell when Future Trunks got shafted by a laser didn't do as much though, but perhaps that was more rage than emotion? Just a thought.

2. Vegeta may train harder, but perhaps he's not clever about it and is trying to brute force his way through. This was evident early when his extra 23 hours of training in the time chamber didn't help much or at all, and Goku still outclassed him.

DBZ has always stressed that Goku is so powerful because he cares about other people.
Vegeta's training is always just so he can get more powerful, a selfish goal.

[Seha]

Actually Goku quite oftens ignores the wellbeing of the universe just so he can have some fun with the powerful enemy of the moment. He's not all that different.

[Dantrag]

Freiza for instance. He could have easily won after going SSJ. But he said something along the lines of, " I want to fight him at full power".

[Pharaun]

Freiza for instance. He could have easily won after going SSJ. But he said something along the lines of, " I want to fight him at full power".

I think this is best exemplified by Goku, Gohan, & Vegeta playing rock, paper, scissors to see who gets to fight one of Babidi's minions ate the beginning of the Buu arc. Goku/Gohan may protest otherwise, but they like to fight stronger opponents just as much as Vegeta does. something something Saiyans gonna Saiyan something something.

[The Stig]

Come to think of it, most of the series was made up of such dick moves starting from Freeza's fight:

1. As said above, Goku wanting to fight him at 100%; though this didn't have much negative outcome
2. Bulma suggesting to use dragonballs to find Dr Gero's hideout, turned down
3. Letting Android 20 go carelessly
4. Letting 16, 17 and 18 out
5. Android 16 not helping Piccolo and 17 out when it was most crucial
6. Krillin destroying the remote along with Vegeta not killing Cell; Trunks not fighting Cell full power
7. Gohan not killing Cell
8. Pharaun's mention of the rock paper scissors thing; however I think at the time they still treated all like a joke
9. Gotenks pissing around and not finishing Buu off promptly
10. Gohan not killing Buu (this was quite wtf, Gohan had every power to disentegrate him)
11. Vegetto not killing Buu (he wanted to rescue the sucked up people)
12. Goku and Vegeta not fusing back to Vegetto to finish off Kid Buu; this nearly backfired on them lol

Still, it's all rather interesting to think about. We've come a long way ...!

[Dantrag]

I think them trying to actually just flat out defeat each other without playing games was the original Goku and Vegeta fight.

[Fwahm]

Goku isn't stronger because he fights for others. Indeed, Vegeta himself fights for others after the Cell Saga, but he still lagged behind.

Vegeta himself said that Goku is stronger because Goku trains in order to better himself, to make himself the strongest he can ever be. Vegeta, in comparison, trained to get strength in order to use it to do something; to subjugate planets (before the Saiyan saga), to attain immortality/defeat Frieza (Frieza Saga), or to surpass Goku (after the Frieza saga).

BOTH Goku and Vegeta had the Saiyan love for fighting, but WHY they loved it differed. Vegeta treated strength and fights as a means to an end, while Goku treated strength and fighting as ends in and of themselves.

[Hatedregret]

It's all about the pride.

[Khajit]

I never saw it like that, but that's a good point to make! Instead, there's 2 schools of thoughts here I considered when I saw it:

Spoiler: show

1. It's the first time Vegeta got more powerful from emotion. The freak out vs Perfect Cell when Future Trunks got shafted by a laser didn't do as much though, but perhaps that was more rage than emotion? Just a thought.

2. Vegeta may train harder, but perhaps he's not clever about it and is trying to brute force his way through. This was evident early when his extra 23 hours of training in the time chamber didn't help much or at all, and Goku still outclassed him.

Spoiler: show

Emotional powerups are kinda exclusive to hybrids though so it shouldn't be that. It's half of the reason the saiyans went wtf at Gohan when they first saw him. Goku never had an emotional powerup other than the first supersaiyan transformation if you want to be really reaching. I'm just going to chalk it up to toriyama not remembering his own rules/characters which is a pretty well known fact.

The fights were pretty good even though there was excessive cgi. I was thinking to myself that we can actually see the characters fighting for once and then on cue people disappeared and all i could see was flashing lights.

The collateral destruction seemed kinda low given that ssj3 goku was breaking the planet just from existing and this fight was supposed to be with much stronger beings. Even the freeza fight had more background destruction so i spent the first half of the fight wondering how the fuck these people were surviving two gods battling in the middle of their city. Bingo was just sad and wrong and so much schadenfreude.


Bills and other dude were the most interesting characters in the story. I honestly would have loved a movie about them by Toriyama instead. Perhaps even a manga where they go around having their wacky destruction adventures?

[SephYuyX]

Bills and other dude were the most interesting characters in the story. I honestly would have loved a movie about them by Toriyama instead. Perhaps even a manga where they go around having their wacky destruction adventures?

Would watch.