Summoner / Scholar sort-of in-depth

[Shalafi]

TD is instacast so it doesn't replace a Ruin

[Taim Meich]

Eh... That's the point, yes. I'm saying that you put dots either outside of trance, or inside with Tri-D. With, of course, all the encounter-specific exceptions in mind.

[Neon_Sea]

Ok so if the situation occurs, I should not refresh DoT's that fall off under DWT? Meaning, I do not have TD and 1 or more DoT's are going to fall off. Yes I realize this should not happen, but if it does...

[Taim Meich]

Unless DoTs are going to be inactive a lot of time, I'd wait. For example, for our biggest DPS DoT, Bio, you'd need 3 ticks to just match the potency of Ruin 3. That means that it can be inactive 9 secods and if you renew it just then, you already covered the potency loss with the Ruin 3 you used instead.

[Shalafi]

Ok, good, we're on the same page.

Clipping DOTS is also bad and typically results in a DPS loss, there are few exceptions but the one I try to stick with is that TD is never a loss even if clipping.

When I have some time I will look at the guide and quote what I can here without going into too much detail.

EDIT: Luckily there is a Summary:

Summary

1. It’s generally never worth it to clip unbuffed DoTs via hardcasting in exchange for buffed versions of those DoTs.
2. Use Ruin 3 inside of DWT over any other GCD unless it’s absolutely necessary.
3. Using Shadow Flare inside of Dreadwyrm Trance is a DPS loss when compared to Ruin 3.
4. It's optimal to use any GCDs that you can keep up and maintain outside of Dreadwyrm Trance, outside of it. This includes Shadow Flare as well as hardcasted DoTs since you can use Tri-Disaster instead without wasting your DWT Ruin 3s.
6. Using Tri-Disaster will always result in a potency gain, even when you clip DoTs. The only time that Tri-Disaster will directly negatively affect you is if you replace buffed versions of your DoTs with Tri-Disaster.
7. Pocketing Tri-Disaster and saving it for adds is not worth it if you have to use that Tri-Disaster outside of DWT. Hardcast your DoTs on the add instead so you don't have to hardcast your DoTs in DWT.
8. Contagion is amazing when paired with DWT and Tri-Disaster and always results in significant potency gains.

edit: numbering was messed up, but since references are made already I just left it

[Taim Meich]

I don't agree with point 7 at all. Tri-D is an extremely useful tool for burning adds quickly on SMN, as not only you have all dots immediately on the target, but it also gives you immediate access to Fester, too. Take for example A4 adds, I prefer to claim mine instantly with Painflare, then Tri-D and focus Garuda on it. That alone should kill it in time, and you have Fester at your disposal if needing to speed things up. Another lesser example: final boss of Fractal, when 3 adds spawn together, Tri-D on the central one + Bane will take care of them and you can either attack the other one or resume DPS on boss.

[Shalafi]

I can agree with you on that as I do the same thing. Really it comes down to being a time saver. My healers tend to pull adds quickly and I need to make sure I'm on top of the adds before they grab them and manually casting DOTS is not always feasible to kill them quickly.

Edit: If DWT is avail I will pop when grabbing the adds and TD them, killing them quickly so I can R3, DF the boss, etc.

[Neon_Sea]

I think it may be correct on paper, but yes I agree using TD on an add to burn quick is just a thing you have to do sometimes.

[Shalafi]

Ya, the guide does state that the info is in a perfect world, but raids don't offer us that luxury and you still have to make your own decisions based on events, etc.

[Fryte]

I can support the idea of using what you need to in order to kill small hp adds. Clearing the raid is worth more than raw numbers.

[Neon_Sea]

So does body/legs or book give more dps for first eso purchase?

[Shalafi]

My understanding is that WD is greater than all.

[Seravi Edalborez]

2 WD, 9 INT, 9 VIT (weapon) vs 8 INT, 7 VIT, 13 defense, 23 magic defense (body/leg). Going from 190 (Hive wep or Proto-Gordian) to 200.

I would lean towards Weapon first for everyone. And for once it's 2 Weapon Damage for everyone, melee ranged and casters.

[Neon_Sea]

I was going from a 190 wpn to 200 vs a 180 body to 200 so it is a little harder but probably weapon.

[Tsuki]

what is 2wd equal to now?

[Neon_Sea]

Not sure that is what I was trying to figure out. Seems like secondary stats are nerfed big time so may be a lot more than what it used to be.

[Shalafi]

afaik, WD to main stat hasn't changed, it's just secondary stats. I've been searching for any info on Spell Speed because I want to know if it is more useful than DET now.

[Taim Meich]

I wouldn't count on it. Ravahn said that the dot ticks with low ss did around 1-2% less damage than before, and at very high amounts, around 2-3% more.

[Eldelphia]

Moving this to the SCH thread

[Clash Perez]

Picked up SMN, since it's a 2-for-1 with my SCH and I'm not feeling the other DPS jobs right now. Still getting accustomed to the job, and have some questions:

Any tips on getting a reliable Contagion use? It seems to go off anywhere from instantly on press to several seconds later, depending on what Garuda is doing at the time. It's particularly noticeable and annoying on trash pulls, since I'm typically waiting on it before spreading DoTs. I've been filling with Painflare and swiftcast Shadowflare if it hasn't gone through quickly, but the unreliable timing is the most annoying part. Any tips on management would be appreciated.

Garuda placement has also been an issue. The answer seems to be to place her somewhere and hope she doesn't get killed there. Micromanaging might be more reasonable once I'm thoroughly accustomed to SMN at 60, but right now I find myself occasionally out of range for Spur/Rouse/etc. There's no "follow me like a puppy but pause to use attacks" option, right? Heel is cancelled as soon as she starts attacking again, eh?

I'm sure people are going to love WoW comparisons, so here we go: It's be nice to be able to toggle particular abilities for auto-use (like in WoW) rather than an all-or-nothing system like we have. Oh well.