Dev Tracker: Discussion

[dasva]

I don't think they should be easier to make, but I do think they should be about even cost-wise- and right now they cost about 2.5x as much.

I'd agree closer in cost than 2.5 but some are really trying to get it down by saying say it costs 5X as much or more... or doing straight up comparisons of cost of 1 HPB to 1 alex as if it used anywhere near the same amount and then use the extreme prices. Omg I can get 1 alex for 6k and 1 HPB can cost 50 ergons must cost 10 times as much!!!

Though given their newness and the fact that people still seem to think that maybe other jobs might get weapons that use HPBs I say we haven't really seen the price they will stabilize at and kinda depends on server...

Like on Bahamut can get HPBs fairly easily at 20k if you shout or check bazaars could even get cheaper so 260 mil for ergon. Alex is mostly 7-8k so should be able to get most for 7k so 210 mil. So only like 25% higher cost here which is quite reasonable

[Ophannus]

Ilvl walk of echoes sounds like a great place to introduce empyrean reforged materials. The final boss being an ilvl atomos fight that will be on par with Odin v2 and requires KI from all chambers to challenge atomos. There will probably be a separate, weaker Atomos Prime fight for summoners to get the avatar, just like there's odin v2 and an odin prime fight.

[Fwahm]

There's also 2.5m of plasm that could have gone towards selling boss mats/airlixirs.

[Ophannus]

Also price for ergon is 2.5x more because of player intervention. Square doesnt make the price, players do. When mythics came out, they were 16-18k each for the first year or so. Also if you recall, alex requirement used to be 50k not 30k and they dropped the requirement like 2 years later after hundreds of people had finished already. Not only that, but unlike HPB, alex could only be acquired once per day and the content required at least a good group of 4-5 players to clear at the least. HPB can be farmed by anyone doing reives or wkr or exchanging their bayld at any time.

I see blm bots sitting at lair reives in rakaznar for days at a time and auto-nuke soloing with Moogle and Star Sibyl trusts and the Reive respawn every 5min. They must rack up hundreds of thousands of bayld per day automatically(you get a solid 3-4k soloing a lair reive without touching any of the adds). Also he probably gets a fair amount of HP bayld as a direct reward from the Reive and any of those cases/crates that can drop from them too(or is that WKR only?).

Point is hpb is easier to acquire than alexandrites were 6 years ago, and will probably get easier as bayld becomes easier to obtain, and content starts dropping more bayld boxes.

[Malithar]

HPB can be farmed by anyone doing reives or wkr or exchanging their bayld at any time. I see blm bots sitting at lair reives in rakaznar and auto-nuke soloing with refresh/mab trusts and the reives respawn every 5min, they rack up hundreds of thousands of bayld per day automatically

This is honestly the only thing making these feasible at the moment, beyond the servers first couple. I couldn't even run the program (windows XP x32 ftl), but know many that were, and without 3 of them selling me a total of about 2k HPBs, I doubt I woulda finished for as cheaply or as quickly as I did.

Outside of SE coming out and saying bayld will have no further use, sell off your stocks, nothing more will make people come off their piles of bayld. People have already tried offering 50k per HPB (which makes the Ergon over 700 mil total), if they didn't come off it for that, they won't come off it at current prices. And WKRs and soloing reives for progress is about a joke without the backing of a server, and atm, very few people have reason to do these things.

No doubt it'll get better as time goes on though, if SE revitalizes WKRs and/or reives again. I'm honestly surprised bayld doesn't come from the new Skirmish, I expected that to be another source.

[Bukadan]

its hard to add life to something that any random player can just spam. they could add a new type of reive, like a delve quality reive or something. why end it at wkr?

[Ophannus]

They can easily revitilize Reives by periodically adding job specific equipment to it like they did with mantles. They could add JSE belts, rings, earrings, necks etc...

People spammed reives for a good 3 months to get those capes and that's where many of us got our ludicrous stockpiles of bayld. Doing that again would surely create tons of HP Baylds from individual pieces to crates. Adding and upgrading WKR is getting tiresome, they did it with 115 items when those came out, then they added capes, then the RoE key items for trading in to get any 1 piece of WKR gear, then they repurposed the KI again for augments, i'm tired of WKR until they add the 7th naakual. They may shoehorn HP Bayld drops into the new ilvl WOE though, hopefully along with HMP. Another way to revitilize reives would be to add capacity points to it. We get 300-600 EXP/Bayld per evaluation, why not throw in 150-200 capacity points too?

If they're gonna do ilvl WoE, it'll be no time before they add ilvl Legion(I can't see them doing ilvl salvage or ilvl nyzul, those had their regenesis already). Also high time for an ilvl meebles. (Does Daimonic Casing have a purpose yet?)

[Bukadan]

they cant add good equip from old reives. theyre all 2boxable/soloable lol. it would cause congestion ect.

[JSHidaka]

Congestion in reives?... Ok

[Bukadan]

by congestion i obviously mean them ending too fast becuase there is so many people there. i hate doing reives with more than a few people because of how dumb those trust using thfs are. fuck them trust using thfs.

[Damane]

Congestion in reives?... Ok

what he means is that the reive would end in like 5 sec when there is too many people there, with the latest adjustments they made to reives and the power players gained from various updates.

[Dotsudoku]

Also price for ergon is 2.5x more because of player intervention. Square doesnt make the price, players do. When mythics came out, they were 16-18k each for the first year or so. Also if you recall, alex requirement used to be 50k not 30k and they dropped the requirement like 2 years later after hundreds of people had finished already. Not only that, but unlike HPB, alex could only be acquired once per day and the content required at least a good group of 4-5 players to clear at the least. HPB can be farmed by anyone doing reives or wkr or exchanging their bayld at any time.

I see blm bots sitting at lair reives in rakaznar for days at a time and auto-nuke soloing with Moogle and Star Sibyl trusts and the Reive respawn every 5min. They must rack up hundreds of thousands of bayld per day automatically(you get a solid 3-4k soloing a lair reive without touching any of the adds). Also he probably gets a fair amount of HP bayld as a direct reward from the Reive and any of those cases/crates that can drop from them too(or is that WKR only?).

Point is hpb is easier to acquire than alexandrites were 6 years ago, and will probably get easier as bayld becomes easier to obtain, and content starts dropping more bayld boxes.

As someone who actually did this for quite a while, I can assure you that it isn't the least bit productive. You'd need a bot to be running you around the zone, cycling through every reive for it to be a reasonable alternative to virtually anything else.

[dasva]

There's also 2.5m of plasm that could have gone towards selling boss mats/airlixirs.

Meh for mythics there is also all the other side things you do that could've been spent doing otherwise... like at the very least the PW pop

[dasva]

Ilvl walk of echoes sounds like a great place to introduce empyrean reforged materials. The final boss being an ilvl atomos fight that will be on par with Odin v2 and requires KI from all chambers to challenge atomos. There will probably be a separate, weaker Atomos Prime fight for summoners to get the avatar, just like there's odin v2 and an odin prime fight.

Sounds a lot more like einherjar than WoE though... kinda part of the point of WoE was a loosely cooperative battlefield anyone could just walk up and join in

[Bukadan]

yea but cooperation goes out the window when you have bst's and smn's who force destruction on the players actually doing the important things lol

[NynJa]

As someone who actually did this for quite a while, I can assure you that it isn't the least bit productive. You'd need a bot to be running you around the zone, cycling through every reive for it to be a reasonable alternative to virtually anything else.

Waking up with an extra 30k or whatever bayld you'll get >>>>>>>>> getting 0 bayld.

[Draylo]

New 6~18 man content!?? Yay

[Lyramion]

New 6~18 man content!?? Yay

*Content you get flamed at and told you are a noob when you enter with more than 6

[ccl]

Maybe they will learn from their delve II mistake and do it better this time D:

[Hitou]

Ugh, I'm pretty sure they're gonna screw up WoE II or w/e you want to call it. The original version was a mess. You'd either have a few people run in and try to solo regular mobs for a chance of coins to drop, or a LS would bring an ally to try to kill the boss but then a bunch of leeches would also join and screw things up for the ally since you can't tell them what to do. After changing it to everyone getting a box it just became "throw smns at it!" while a few DD with twilight sets would die 30 times and a few whms would do next to nothing. After people people realized it was easier to just build an empyrean, the event became a ghost town again with random people showing up to do a few runs off and on. It wasn't until they allowed people to unlock empyrean ws that the system got any kind of consistent use.

So I donno unless it's radically different with the entrance requirements or they manage to make it like WKR with respawning adds and a mega boss I'm pretty sure WoE will be awful. If it's not I'll be pleasantly surprised but history is preventing me from getting my hopes up about it.