Dev Tracker: Discussion

[Trumpy]

I dunno... put a survival guide somewhere then? I really thot the whole way we get there was pretty dumb anyway. Just make them choose sea or raisen!

[fantasticdan]

because they are reaching the maximum number of HP Crystals they can add or so. They explained it somewhere 1-2 months ago or so

That sounds like a ps2 limitations esque excuse. Even if it were true somehow, there are dozens of near-useless HP crystals they could get rid of. Bastok/sandy/windurst have like 15 crystals each ffs.

[Byrthnoth]

No, it's based on the menu packet that they send to open the homepoints menu. The packet contains a bitfield where every 1 represents a homepoint that you have access to. They're almost out of space in the bitfield.


(So there's no reason to believe dropping console support would affect it)

[Kaisha]

That sounds like a ps2 limitations esque excuse. Even if it were true somehow, there are dozens of near-useless HP crystals they could get rid of. Bastok/sandy/windurst have like 15 crystals each ffs.

They already got five in Ru'Aun which they could just reduce to one and then implement some other means of getting around that zone quicker.

It's not like they're going to add any new zones or BCNM arenas in the near future anyhow.

[Sechs]

Kaishasan! Come back playiiiing! :'(

[Sechs]

Why cant they just add an HP Crystal to the Sanctorum? - I spent a whole 8 seconds to come up with that.

On a side note to this, I used to warp to Reisenjima following these steps:
Warp to Ru'hmet > Descend > Warp to Reisenjima Sanctorum > Zone into Reisenjima (actually have to walk a few seconds) > Warp to #1 to get what I need from the Goblin

I found out that this other path is a few seconds faster
Warp to Ru'hmet > Descend > Warp to any Crag > Zone into reisenjima

Number of "zoning" is the same in both paths, but in the second one you won't have to walk (Reisen portal is right in front to where you get warped to) and you won't have to use the Reisen warps either (because you will pop right at entrance)

[Tidis]

Is it quicker than the VW warp to Maze of Shakhrami, run to crag, zone into reisenjima?

[Sechs]

I dunno, maybe I'm biased and should stop-watch it to see which is is really faster (supposing there is any noticeable difference)
Going the path you suggested requires either 1 or even 2 less zoning but much more walking.

Of course being /WHM, WHM or having a crag ring is even faster but I was kinda ruling those out xD
If I feel bored enough I'll test tonight.

[Lolwutt]

Reisenjima is important enough if they wanted to they could drop another HP for it. I mean, the 'full' packet still has one for the home point in al zahbi that they removed in ~2008.

[wipers]

because they are reaching the maximum number of HP Crystals they can add or so. They explained it somewhere 1-2 months ago or so

Let me guess PS2 limitations !

[GImpers]

SE has previously implemented warps in Jeuno to access content. Horst teles you to Abyssea. Waypoint in Lower Jeuno teles you to Adoulin. Why can't SE just add an Ethereal Ingress/NPC in Jeuno that teles you to Zi'tah/Ru'Aun'Reisenjima?

[steellord]

SE has previously implemented warps in Jeuno to access content. Horst teles you to Abyssea. Waypoint in Lower Jeuno teles you to Adoulin. Why can't SE just add an Ethereal Ingress/NPC in Jeuno that teles you to Zi'tah/Ru'Aun'Reisenjima?

because they never played their own game, and the current devs have no idea of things like Horst that were added by others years ago....so it doesn't occur to them

[Isiolia]

because they never played their own game, and the current devs have no idea of things like Horst that were added by others years ago....so it doesn't occur to them

Other than Reisenjima, a warp NPC like that would be pretty pointless. The Abyssea warps n' such were also added before HP warping. Escha Zi'tah and Ru'Aun have HPs outside their entrances that you can warp directly to from any other HP in Vana'diel. No need to head to Jeuno first.

It'd barely change anything with Reisenjima either - there are already options to get there, just ones that mean zoning a bunch. Needing to head to Jeuno first would tend to add or retain steps to do that.

IMO, the easiest thing would be to simply add a Reisenjima option to the portal in the Empyreal Paradox, if putting a HP in the Sanctorum wouldn't work for some reason. Still means a little extra zoning, going from Garden to Paradox, but it'd cut zoning to the Sanctorum or a crag first.


Otherwise, I wonder if adding teleport crystals to one of the travel systems would be a way to work around limits. Seems like the crags, by most merits should have HPs by them anyway.

[Trumpy]

the problem with puttin HPs by crags (which believe me i keep thinking of also) is that it makes teleport spells useless. You know how concerned they were about makin warp sticks useless. just imagine how they feel about teleport spells.

[Isiolia]

Yeah, I think that's why they haven't as well. Technically, there's still a use - can teleport from anywhere. They could always do something like add a movement speed buff to teleport spells or something too.

[FaeQueenCory]

Yeah, I think that's why they haven't as well. Technically, there's still a use - can teleport from anywhere. They could always do something like add a movement speed buff to teleport spells or something too.

That would be too complicated/too much work for something like that.

Given that vorseals are applied upon zoning in, regardless where you come from as can be seen by coming from the Sanctorum, having a HP directly IN Reisenjima by the gobbie wouldn't be a big deal... except trying to target it after a DI. (welcome back F8)
The only issue, systemwise, would be the "HP list" that's pulled up whenever you go to warp. (Which is their concern when they say "reaching/at the limit of HPs")

[Sechs]

the problem with puttin HPs by crags (which believe me i keep thinking of also) is that it makes teleport spells useless. You know how concerned they were about makin warp sticks useless. just imagine how they feel about teleport spells.

I can totally understand this, but then again it's *them* who chose to put the Reisenjima access from the Al'taieu/Limbus warper.
It's not like they were forced to. They could've picked plentiful of other zones (on which they could've simply placed a closeby HP just like they did for Misareaux and Qufim).

It was a stupid choice game-design wise, imho. You don't pick zones randomly, you think about things like these which are all but subtle, it's one of the first things you should be thinking of if anything. I swear sometimes they completely lack practical sense, probably because they don't play this game the same way us players do.

[Damane]

I can totally understand this, but then again it's *them* who chose to put the Reisenjima access from the Al'taieu/Limbus warper.
It's not like they were forced to. They could've picked plentiful of other zones (on which they could've simply placed a closeby HP just like they did for Misareaux and Qufim).

It was a stupid choice game-design wise, imho. You don't pick zones randomly, you think about things like these which are all but subtle, it's one of the first things you should be thinking of if anything. I swear sometimes they completely lack practical sense, probably because they don't play this game the same way us players do.

i think its story related why the entrance are there. the mother crystal from reisen is connected via wtf ever to the crags and ruhmet

[Sechs]

i think its story related why the entrance are there. the mother crystal from reisen is connected via wtf ever to the crags and ruhmet

It's story-connected because they built a story to make it look like it.
I could see the Sanctum<>Empyreal Paradox (you move through the crystal line) thing making sense regardless, but the "Crag's Al'taieu entrance <> Reisenjima entrance" doesn't really make much sense, it could've been anything and anywhere else, and they could've built story to make so this any other place would've make sense.

They made their own choice without thinking about the consequences of the impracticability of having such an important farming zone made so annoying to get to.

[steellord]

Other than Reisenjima, a warp NPC like that would be pretty pointless. The Abyssea warps n' such were also added before HP warping. Escha Zi'tah and Ru'Aun have HPs outside their entrances that you can warp directly to from any other HP in Vana'diel. No need to head to Jeuno first.

It'd barely change anything with Reisenjima either - there are already options to get there, just ones that mean zoning a bunch. Needing to head to Jeuno first would tend to add or retain steps to do that.

IMO, the easiest thing would be to simply add a Reisenjima option to the portal in the Empyreal Paradox, if putting a HP in the Sanctorum wouldn't work for some reason. Still means a little extra zoning, going from Garden to Paradox, but it'd cut zoning to the Sanctorum or a crag first.


Otherwise, I wonder if adding teleport crystals to one of the travel systems would be a way to work around limits. Seems like the crags, by most merits should have HPs by them anyway.

i don't understand why they can't just put everything in 1 zone at this point - survival guide, HP, sparks npc, horst, reisen warp, AH etc. I don't care if it's jeuno or adoulin, because none of that is remotely new content. Then you wouldn't care either about "having to go to jeuno" to warp to Reisen because you'd already be there