X-Men: Apocalypse (May 27th, 2016)

**Tokitoki** · 2016-05-23 12:13

The person is still getting hit with all the force, regardless of how fast the one guy is moving. The person he's hitting will move; there's no way for a person to resist that kind of force.

It doesn't matter that he's moving faster than a normal person can or that everything is "slow motion." Outside his body's sphere of influence, for lack of a better term, time still flows at a normal pace.

EDIT: It won't be like hitting a wall. The only reason "hitting a wall" is a term is because the force needed to move said wall is greater than a human can exert. As long as you can exert more force on an object that it can resist based on it's own structure (for a wall, weight of the material and foundation in simplest terms) that object will move.

**Tyrath** · 2016-05-23 12:24

It could be like hitting a wall if you consider the speedster to be a demolition ball. The force will make it move because even something solid and still won't be able to withstand it.

**Tokitoki** · 2016-05-23 12:27

"Hitting a brick wall" is pretty much standard for "hitting something that won't move."

So while you're right, his fist would be like a wrecking ball, that's not what this guy meant.

**Tyrath** · 2016-05-23 12:31

I know he didn't. I'm just saying if we're gonna consider the regular people a wall, then to visualize the speedster you can't visualize them as a human.

**6souls** · 2016-05-23 12:40

Applying real world science to the Fox Marvel universe is always a losing cause.

**Lyall** · 2016-05-23 13:16

Originally Posted by 6souls

Applying real world science to the Fox Marvel universe is always a losing cause.

Not incorrect, I'm just trying to remember where this came up before in a comic or a movie or something. I know I've seen it referenced in the meta before.

I guess I'm just curious how a punch would work since you couldn't follow through without punching clear through a person's body. Now I've got the humorous idea of Quicksilver just throwing the tiniest slaps on people's chins and cheeks that carry megaton force behind them. He's the world's most talented duelist.

**Tokitoki** · 2016-05-23 13:18

Follow through doesn't matter.

It's a transfer of momentum. It'd be like getting rear-ended in a car when you're at a dead stop and the other car is speeding.

**Lyall** · 2016-05-23 13:21

Originally Posted by Tokitoki

Follow through doesn't matter.

It's a transfer of momentum. It'd be like getting rear-ended in a car when you're at a dead stop and the other car is speeding.

Sort of, only in this case the other car rear-ends you but is completely fine because speedforce. It's past you before your bumper is crunched, which... Is hard to wrap my head around, I guess.

**Tokitoki** · 2016-05-23 13:24

I think you're stuck on the whole time thing. Just think of it as one person going really fucking fast rather than the guy seeing everything in slow motion. Time is still time; if you observed it from the outside it'd just be one extremely fast guy throwing a punch versus a dude going normal speed receiving the punch.

A lesson from some guy on momentum and impulses. Around 13:00 he starts talking about how momentum and energy is conversed, around 15:00 he shows an example of exchange of momentum with his little bumpers.

**dasva** · 2016-05-23 13:24

Speed force let's you ignore all kinds of things. Like really just running thru the air that fast would tear a persons body apart and cause them to burn to a crisp. But you got a nice covering of speed force that protects you from all kinds of things... somehow

Also he isn't time traveling he's just moving fast. It's no different than some guy running fast just in greater scale. There's no the glass isn't moving as fast because it works the same way if I ran into a glass window I'd make it speed up by the transfer of momentum

**Deftscythe** · 2016-05-23 13:26

Originally Posted by Deftscythe

Don't try to understand speedsters. They never follow the laws of physics.

Guys, c'mon. Google "the motherfucking flash" some time if you want to see how much thought comic(and by extension, comic book movie) writers put into the physics of extreme speed. Or just watch any season two episode of The Flash.

**Lyall** · 2016-05-23 13:28

Originally Posted by Tokitoki

I think you're stuck on the whole time thing. Just think of it as one person going really fucking fast rather than the guy seeing everything in slow motion. Time is still time; if you observed it from the outside it'd just be one extremely fast guy throwing a punch versus a dude going normal speed receiving the punch.

A lesson from some guy on momentum and impulses. Around 13:00 he starts talking about how momentum and energy is conversed, around 15:00 he shows an example of exchange of momentum with his little bumpers.

The time thing has always been my hang-up when it comes to speedsters, I will definitely concede that. Like, what happens if Quicksilver uppercuts a dude like straight out of Mortal Kombat? He swings hard underhanded and connect flat on a man's chin, pushing upwards. What happens to the rest of the punch? If his hand continues at Quicksilver's speed, and that results in the target's head snapping back at that speed, his head would probably snap off. I wonder if speedy types just don't ever do things like that as a result, and yes I'm thinking way too much about fantasy cartoon physics because it's Monday and work is slow. I appreciate everyone indulging me so far!

**dasva** · 2016-05-23 13:47

Originally Posted by Lyall

The time thing has always been my hang-up when it comes to speedsters, I will definitely concede that. Like, what happens if Quicksilver uppercuts a dude like straight out of Mortal Kombat? He swings hard underhanded and connect flat on a man's chin, pushing upwards. What happens to the rest of the punch? If his hand continues at Quicksilver's speed, and that results in the target's head snapping back at that speed, his head would probably snap off. I wonder if speedy types just don't ever do things like that as a result, and yes I'm thinking way too much about fantasy cartoon physics because it's Monday and work is slow. I appreciate everyone indulging me so far!

Really depends on how fast and how much force but yes that could happen at the extremes though force required for that should also completely break the fuck out of the hand as well you'd also probably punch thru the head. And more reasonable levels the things connected to the head would also accelerate and move with it some.

**Anakron** · 2016-05-23 16:35

Originally Posted by Lyall

The time thing has always been my hang-up when it comes to speedsters, I will definitely concede that. Like, what happens if Quicksilver uppercuts a dude like straight out of Mortal Kombat? He swings hard underhanded and connect flat on a man's chin, pushing upwards. What happens to the rest of the punch? If his hand continues at Quicksilver's speed, and that results in the target's head snapping back at that speed, his head would probably snap off. I wonder if speedy types just don't ever do things like that as a result, and yes I'm thinking way too much about fantasy cartoon physics because it's Monday and work is slow. I appreciate everyone indulging me so far!

Different universe, but Quicksilver in Age of Ultron basically did that. He smashed through tons of Ultron sentries with just casual elbows and punches, so it's reasonable that he would smash and rip arms/legs/heads if he did the same with humans.

**kuronosan** · 2016-05-23 18:18

Originally Posted by Lyall

The time thing has always been my hang-up when it comes to speedsters, I will definitely concede that. Like, what happens if Quicksilver uppercuts a dude like straight out of Mortal Kombat? He swings hard underhanded and connect flat on a man's chin, pushing upwards. What happens to the rest of the punch? If his hand continues at Quicksilver's speed, and that results in the target's head snapping back at that speed, his head would probably snap off. I wonder if speedy types just don't ever do things like that as a result, and yes I'm thinking way too much about fantasy cartoon physics because it's Monday and work is slow. I appreciate everyone indulging me so far!

Law of Conservation. Momentum would be transferred, so depending on the kinetic energy put into it (which is a function of mass and velocity) it would obviously do more damage than a normal punch.

The funny thing is he should technically break bones every time he hits or runs into something because collisions aren't perfectly elastic in reality (at least with organic stuff like us). Hypothetically he either transfers all momentum and feels no blowback, which is why he's okay, in which case the receiver is gutted to fucking hell because there is nothing else to transfer the momentum into, or he feels a little and his body is enhanced enough to handle the rebounding energy (physiologically his body can handle the shock, in other words).

If you watch AoU, you'll see this when he smacks Hawkeye (and he flips) and the slow-mo punch to Cap (he jerks back). It essentially would give him superhuman strength without the super-muscles like Cap, Thor, Panther, or Hulk have.

**dasva** · 2016-05-23 20:57

Also depends on the speedsters we are talking about. Like Quicksilver is mostly just super fast (though it extends to more than just movement. ie healing though processes etc) and given enough decently above normal human average durability, strength, flexibility and resistance to kinetic impacts and friction etc to survive how fast he moves.

Meanwhile the Flash can use the Speedforce to basically control all kinetic movement there is down to the molecular level... so he can really accelerate to the speed of light and then transfer 100% of that energy to his hit for his infinite mass punches. Or mess with time or whatever.

**Tomino** · 2016-05-24 02:40

The issue I have is about overdoing it. In DoFP he basically handled a few goons inside a small room and everything made perfect sense, in this movie

Spoiler: show

**Fhloston** · 2016-05-24 02:49

ITT people breaking out science to justify a comic book movie scene

Also, Tomino, if you go in to a Bryan Singer X-Men movie expecting anything but bad costumes.... I just don't know what to tell ya.

Spoiler: show

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

**Alistaire** · 2016-05-24 04:01

Originally Posted by Tomino

The issue I have is about overdoing it. In DoFP he basically handled a few goons inside a small room and everything made perfect sense, in this movie

Spoiler: show

And that's how OP The Flash...I mean Quicksilver is.

Also lol @ them bashing X-Men 3.

**Gokulo** · 2016-05-24 04:20

I had a good laugh during polish scenes

Thread: X-Men: Apocalypse (May 27th, 2016)

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