Ark Angel Battles: The Second Coming

[NynJa]

I dont remember this being fucking WoW where you're locked on to one job. If your job sucks for event X, use another job instead of trying to force the issue.

[Sechs]

interpretation of fun in an MMO is playing classes i enjoy, some peoples interpretation is getting sh*t done asap

I absolutely agree with this statement but, as said before, I'm torn between those 2 kind of players.
On one hand I'm usually leaning towards the "play what's fun" side.
But sometimes some fights have such annoying conditions, that I don't want to risk failing it.
It's the example of AAs. It takes me so much time to get those 20 merits which I can't store for multiple runs, that whenever I get one of those rare chances to do the fight, I want to make sure my odds of winning are as high as possible, even if that means me going on a job I wouldn't want to play.

To make another practical examples: the SKBCs. I have plenty of seals, which means plenty of orbs, and each run is 6x fights. In such a scenario I don't mind "failing" one of those 6 runs, even if it's mine.
There are 5 more runs, and I have plenty of other seals stored and I don't need to spend hours to farm merits/xp to do another run right after, if I want to.
In such a scenario I feel relaxed, and as a matter of fact I went with some crazy jobs combinations and I even tried some VD without being afraid of failing.
A single failure would have been an acceptable loss, because of the conditions I explained above.

Now take that into AAs. It's a single run for 6 people. You can't join if you don't have access and once it's done... it's done. You need to farm more merits for another run and if you fail it it's bye bye.
This doesn't allow me to feel "relaxed" at all.

[Sechs]

I dont remember this being fucking WoW where you're locked on to one job. If your job sucks for event X, use another job instead of trying to force the issue.

Hardcore people in WoW have being rerolling since day 1, it's not that much different in the end.
Not sure I get your comparison.


@Fake
DD jobs in this game are far more similar than most people think they do, compared to other MMOs at least. I'll give you a point on that.
And I also agree that some people tend to hate job X just because it's the current bandwagon one and they want to be hipsters or something. Another point to you.
But at the same time, I can understand if someone doesn't feel like levelling or playing job X.

[Fake]

But at the same time, I can understand if someone doesn't feel like levelling or playing job X.

Absolutely, just have them direct the tears to OF/livejournal/tumblr because nobody gives a shit.

If every job could be useful all the time in every setup then people would gravitate towards the most OP/bandwagon job even more than is already the case. You always get certain snowflakes bawling their eyes out every time new high end content is released and it doesn't specifically cater to their self imposed restriction, but thats what OF is for.

[Sechs]

If every job could be useful all the time in every setup
[cut]

Which is more or less what happened in WoW post patch 3.0, with the homozeneization of classes and their abilities, so that in most setups, you don't miss that "vital" buff, because it can be given by a number of classe and it's exclusive, blahblah.
I really hope FFXI never gets that far 'cause, while I rationally understand why WoW needed that step back then, I never really liked it.

Demanding every job to be useable in every content under every circumstance, in a game like FFXI nowadays, is stupid.
People are SUPPOSED to level multiple jobs, at least a couple. If you're not doing it you're clearly playing this game wrong, imho.
I think Matsui said this well to people on official forums some time ago.
They just need to make sure all jobs can have a REAL use, somewhere, in relevant stuff and not 6years old content.
They can do this by creating very different contents/fight.

This fight you can zerg ==> use setup X
This fight needs tanks ==> use setup Y
This fight needs something else ==> use setup Z

To a certain extent they're already doing this and I'm happy. There's more work to be done but the direction seems to be the right one, imho.

[NynJa]

Hardcore people in WoW have being rerolling since day 1, it's not that much different in the end.
Not sure I get your comparison.

Because every char in WoW has its own class, if you want something from event X for your druid, and your druid sucks ass (or the event is just unfavorable to druids), you're still forced to use your druid for it. Or something like that.

Which is not the case in XI. If you want something from event X for your PUP, and PUP sucks ass, you can use another job that doesnt suck ass for it.

Thats my point. There is NO reason to try and force a job that will actually lower success rate just to be a unique snowflake.

[Raelia]

"We/They won with three of X job, must be the only way to beat it" is the oldest thing in FFXI.

If that logic is sound to you, your preferred job isn't outstanding enough to go against it, otherwise rock it and fuck the haters.

[NynJa]

I said that? I dont remember saying that. I believe I said "stop trying to stick a square peg in a round hole".

Theres a difference between turning a 15 minute fight into a 20 minute fight without affecting difficulty (other than the inherent, the longer something takes, there is a greater chance that something can go wrong), and turning a 15 minute fight into a 25-35 (oops now you're at risk of timing out) minute fight while also affecting difficulty.

Niche jobs have niche talents. Can a PUP solo Salv II? I believe there have been posts that its possible. Can a MNK do the same? I dont believe so.

[Raelia]

I was mostly addressing the entire last three pages of info-dry diatribes. Arguing with PUP players is something I put aside years ago and would highly recommend doing so, because no other class in the history of MMOs attracts players with a stronger craniorectal interface and asymmetric-ice-aggregate imperative.

[Damane]

"We/They won with three of X job, must be the only way to beat it" is the oldest thing in FFXI.

If that logic is sound to you, your preferred job isn't outstanding enough to go against it, otherwise rock it and fuck the haters.

the situation nowadays tough is alot more severe then before. MNK is so overly dominant as a DD due to its survivability combined with its Damage that the other melees are severly in a bad spotlight. This was not the case before, yes you had WAR that was very well known, but SAM DRK and to some extinct DRG could go up against it very well and were acceptable melees.

you also had the choice of different healers, WHM RDM or SCH were all acceptable healing choices/alternatives, now you have ONLY WHM (which is a byproduct of haveing to heal large amounts of HP due to monks and due to the huge cureskin safety WHM adds because of the large amount of HP healed).

Those alternativs dont exist anymore, because the current Job mechanics/PTsetups/foes dont allow for it. which means some adjustments have to happen. There was more balance across the board previously, pre SoA.

This isnt a pure issue of Job design, because on paper every job has something unique to offer, those issues arise because 3 main core aspects of the games dont work properly/at all or ar neglected by the devs:
1. Enmity (not only for tanks, but cures should generate also more enmity, so melees have to hink more about enmity too to save their healers ass)
2. Elemental magic/nukeing
3. Debuffs from various sources (BLU debuffs / RDM debuffs etc) which all dont stick on anything remotly hard.

[Raelia]

Well, there was more balance before SE retardedly equalized Ratio cap, if you wanna get specific. "Let's make all non-2-handers 12.5% stronger for free! Great idea!"

There's still some factor that the gotta-have-it-nows all leveled MNK+WHM for Abyssea, followed by RNG for Delve. Indeed it's because these jobs are continuing to excel, but prevalence doesn't help. How many Anni RNGs did you know before last year?

[Damane]

Well, there was more balance before SE retardedly equalized Ratio cap, if you wanna get specific. "Let's make all non-2-handers 12.5% stronger for free! Great idea!"

There's still some factor that the gotta-have-it-nows all leveled MNK+WHM for Abyssea, followed by RNG for Delve. Indeed it's because these jobs are continuing to excel, but prevalence doesn't help. How many Anni RNGs did you know before last year?

6 on bahamut and 4 on my current server phoenix so 10 (those 4 from phoenix I knew before the 6 on bahamut). since then the number of anni rangers went up by 2 to 6 and again down by 2 back to 4 lol

As said the biggest reason most jobs dont work out well is as said because 3 of the main core mechanics of the game dont work properly (as said above): 1. Enmity (cures take for my taste too little enmity and need an enmity boost, so healers take more hate if the melees are braindead) 2. Debuffs 3. Elementalmagic/nukeing. Fixing/adjusting those 3 would open up alot more possibilitys in terms of job flexibility and choice.

[Tarage]

Is there a good way to tell which AA you have beaten?

[Fake]

Get the KI and see if you can enter on D or VD, if you can't you haven't got win. No there is no way to do it without doing that other than to actually pay attention when you do stuff.

[detlef]

You should have an idea based on what Rem's 6-10 you have.

[Revati]

The main problem for nuking is formless strikes. They need a delve boss that needs magic damage and rages with hundred fists -99% dt if anyone uses formless >.>.

[Syntex]

What's a good amount of acc for these fights?

For both a melter DD like MNK/THF/NIN and also for paladin.

I'm just wondering if I should reforge the pieces with accuracy or can make it up with sushi.

Talking about the difficult fight.

[chichicha]

Is this the place to ask?
What is the normal setup for fighting the Celestial Nexus?

Also if we want to aim for dagger or gun, does it has to be Hard mode?
Or Normal mode dropping too but lower chances?

[Malithar]

Is this the place to ask?
What is the normal setup for fighting the Celestial Nexus?

Also if we want to aim for dagger or gun, does it has to be Hard mode?
Or Normal mode dropping too but lower chances?

Healer/Nin Buffer/Nin 4x /Nin DD
Pld Healer/Nin Buffer/Nin 3x Rng/Nin

Those are the main two setups I've been a part of. /Nin is just that important for it, his AoE is very strong and eats 1-3 shadows, his AMII can hit for 4k+ easily, but eats a shadow, etc. The only tricky part is on part 2 when he occasionally decides to warp around like a bouncy ball in a small room, then stops somewhere obscure and starts casting a -Ja (only happens at <25%), and even then, it's typically not deadly, just everyone has no shadows and in the low yellow-red HP.

As far as I've read, any drops can drop on any difficulty for any of these scaling difficulty BCs. Remember a report of someone getting an AA weapon from soloing VE. Don't take this to mean it's by any means common, even normal can be annoying as all hell with drops actually dropping. Best way you can really go about getting drops is D+, 100% one item, chance of 2.

It's all eyeballing, but weapons do seem to be rarer than other gear. Could always check ffxidb and see what it says, but meh. Merits aren't anything and once you have a working group, it's not a big deal to spam it a few times a day/week.

[chichicha]

Thanks