Art Symbolism Halp!

[Acevalefor]

This is a writing class and the instructor makes it a point to stay neutral in the discussions. This essay is actually for peer review and class discussion this week. No art history knowledge required but we do have to be able to back up our interpretations with the artwork in question. I really don't think I can go wrong with this. I just want this shit to be over though. If I had known that this "writing" class was actually more like an "arts and culture" class, I would have taken a 200 level class that focused on technical writing instead of rhetoric and symbolism...

[Aksannyi]

I would actually love that, to be honest.

Also re-read what I posted and realized I came across really ranty, whoops. I guess I Aks'd all over this thread. Apologies for that.

[Acevalefor]

I would actually love that, to be honest.

Also re-read what I posted and realized I came across really ranty, whoops. I guess I Aks'd all over this thread. Apologies for that.

Meh. Where else to vent frustrations over past transgressions that no longer matter if not on a message board where people can choose not to read it? At least we're not a captive audience. I've launched into my own stories and derailed a few threads myself.

[Jaybar]

Critically examining art work is meant to help teach divergent thinking - that there are many ways to come to an answer - rather than convergent thinking where there is one way to an answer (generally mathematics and the sciences). It may sound silly but it is a core concept to critical thinking.

[Ddz]

Picasso lived in the late 1800s and died in the 70's I think? Women faced a lot of hardship in the art world until the feminist art movement in the 1960s - so for this woman to be painting a Picasso and topless, I would say that it was in advocacy of this movement.

[Blubbartron]

Critically examining art work is meant to help teach divergent thinking - that there are many ways to come to an answer - rather than convergent thinking where there is one way to an answer (generally mathematics and the sciences). It may sound silly but it is a core concept to critical thinking.

Divergent thinking is a core concept to imagination, not critical thinking. There's a reason they say great minds think alike - it's because logical, intelligent thought is inherently convergent. Given the same inputs to a set of (mostly) logical thinkers, you will (mostly) get the same answer out of them.

Imagination has its place among the educated, but don't put it on the same level as critical thinking, because it's definitely not. Calling the destinations of divergent thought "answers" is a horrible misnomer in and of itself. There are effectively never multiple answers that are equally correct - one is typically "more correct" than the others, and with divergent thinking there's no reason to believe you'll even be going in the same direction as "correct" is.

[Silenka]

She is:

-painting nude figures
-in a red dress
-with her boob hanging out
-next to a river, where water is historically a symbol of sexuality
-and some trees and grass, which are all in full bloom (I'm sure you can do something with that)

I mean if you're just looking for symbolism, there's a TON of it just in the setting and scenery, nevermind what the woman is actually doing. And that part I have no clue on.

[Meresgi]

unless the artist flat out said "this represents blah blah blah" it's all completely subjective. you literally cannot be wrong. exposed breasts can represent whatever you want them to. the entire idea of "right" answers when it comes to viewing art is utter bullshit. don't tell people in the art world that, though. it threatens their sense of self/superiority.

Holy fuck I could not agree more with you. When I saw this thread title and the picture I just remembered all my art classes back in the day in college. It was 99% the professor basically telling us what HE thought the symbolism/meaning was, and then if you wrote down something else, you'd get marked off on the tests. It was such a crock of shit and annoying as fuck, but at least I learned the key to an A in the classes early on and just mirrored what the prof was saying and added in even more bullshit on top of it to further inflate his fucking ego.

Same with books and English classes were they talk about what the author TRULY meant when writing the book and dissect every fucking word as if it's some sort of encryption and they found how to break it all.

As for symbolism and making shit up:

She's baring herself to the world, you could say both physically (in terms of dem titties) and her soul (in the form of her painting).

Red can mean a few things, it can mean power (She is exhibiting her power in the form of art (if your teacher is a chick weave in some sort of feminist bullshit here)), it can mean energy/energetic (the nature around her and the color embolden her painting blah blah blah)

there is a stark contrast between the woman and the cubist painting she is doing, perceptions of reality yadda yadda.

Then again, the worst offender was also the most condescending person I've ever met, and I put him in his place. He was dead sure that all of his students were fresh out of high school with no real life experience, and said as much constantly. He showed us a painting called "Absinthe Drinkers" (google it, I'm lazy) and told us that it was not legal in the States and then asked in the most prickish way possible if any of us had ever had it, so I raised my hand. When he asked (still being a prick) where I could have possibly had absinthe, I told him, "Well, I drank it with my ex-husband when I was stationed in Germany 3 years ago."

Sounds like a douche, and plus Absinthe is totally legal in the US lol, you can buy it from a lot of liquor stores.

[BaneTheBrawler]

iirc, only certain types of absinthe are legal, and the ones that are don't have the hallucinogens in them. there's a whole array of absinthe. not all of them are made using the ingredient that produces that effect.

[Aksannyi]

This was back in 2006(ish) so I honestly couldn't tell you, I wouldn't be surprised if he was completely full of it because he was so full of himself and thought he knew everything. Since I never felt the need to drink it again (I think I was still nursing my son at the time), I wouldn't have had need to find out.

Either way, felt good to put that asshole in his place. I'm still sour over that incident, worst art class ever.

[Meresgi]

iirc, only certain types of absinthe are legal, and the ones that are don't have the hallucinogens in them. there's a whole array of absinthe. not all of them are made using the ingredient that produces that effect.

I always thought that whole "hallucinogens" thing was bogus after looking into it.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/inn...s/absinthe.htm

I know people always said it was illegal due to the wormwood in it and such. I do see the ban in the US was lifted in '07 from that article after 100yrs lol.

Either way, felt good to put that asshole in his place. I'm still sour over that incident, worst art class ever.

Yeah I have to deal with the head of the art department at the college I work for since I do a lot of the OSX/IOS shit...holy fuck if he isn't the most stuck up mother fucker I know. He made a wallpaper for our department once as a "Look what I can do in just 20 minutes" type thing...it was terrible. Just a gradient with the college logo on it and a few shapes here and there...

[Aksannyi]

I hate self-righteous art types who think their work is sooooo great but it's actually super bad.

[Silenka]

I kinda feel like you can either acknowledge that art means different things to different people or be judgmental about the worth of what someone calls "art", not both.

I don't get modern art at all, I think most of it is fucking stupid and awful. But I sit in the "art means different things to different people" camp so I don't feel like I get a say in it - modern art might not do it for me, but there are clearly other people who see meaning and worth in it, considering its popularity and place in museums and whatnot.

A "bad" art piece could speak volumes to the right person. The line between "good" art and "bad" art is imaginary anyhow because of subjectivity - art critics, museum curators and professors pretend like there is one to justify their jobs or hobbies, but you just can't say "Art has different meanings to different people" and then immediately label a piece of art as objectively bad or good.

[wipers]

I'm not an art snob but I do agree that "modern" art is kinda art for the sake of art. It doesn't move me make me feel or anything.

[Aksannyi]

I should clarify, "art for art's sake" is fine. I have nothing against people who just want to draw/paint/sketch/photoshop and it doesn't always have to have some grand meaning to it. What I hate though is people who create something, then when someone tries to offer valid criticism meant to help them improve, they get extremely butthurt and say things like, "You just don't understand true art."

I went to art college for 3 years buddy, I fucking know what art is, but okay, if you want to keep forgetting the principles of design and never understand things like form and perspective, fine, I guess, but no one will take you seriously as an artist.

[BaneTheBrawler]

idk, i dont critique art. unless it's someone learning to improve their drawing abilities, like on deviantart or something. otherwise, it's not really my place to say "this is good" or "this is bad." instead, i say things like "i like this. but that one's fucking retarded, what is that shit?"


i have refined tastes.

[Aksannyi]

I don't usually give out unsolicited critique, like just go up to someone painting in a park or something and say, "You suck bro." But if you ask me (and you're not a child) what I think of your work, I'm not gonna lie, I'm going to give you an honest opinion.

[BaneTheBrawler]

oh, yeah, for sure.

[Aksannyi]

Just sad that some people ask my opinion then get pissed when I give it. lol

[Acevalefor]

Just sad that some people ask my opinion then get pissed when I give it. lol

This is true for most everything in life. My sister is writing a book about a girl with a mental disability that is trying her hardest to communicate with people and show them she is not broken. It's a great rough draft and she gave it to me for critique and editing. That's where the butthurt came in. I critiqued it and spent several hours marking up the errors and adding my own comments about diction and continuity. She told me she isn't going to use me as an editor anymore because she thinks I am too critical of her as a person. It only bothers me that she asked me to spend my time then told me to fuck off when she didn't like it. Otherwise, I don't care what she thinks and she can go ahead with the project by herself. She won't get published without lots of help though...